I always feel weird about calling people “white” and “black” though, it just sounds offensive. European American doesn’t work either, since it’s a bit too specific. Caucasian fits the bill of referring to “white” people in general, even if it can from a very questionable source.
I for one want to know what the fuck the purpose is of segregated clubs in a public high school, be they black, white, hispanic, Asian, purple with yellow stripes on their ass, or whatever.
I’m not saying high school kids shouldn’t invest time exploring their (and other kids’) heritage: they damn well should. But why the hell would doing so in separate, race-based groups be considered conducive to ending racism?
It’s beyond stupid. I can’t really fault this girl for trying to start a “White Club” (although I agree with DtC that the term “Caucasian” is very different in meaning from “African American” or “Hispanic”) when there already are several racially exclusive clubs about, but Geeze Louise, are there seriously people out there who think this is a good idea to begin with??
[devil’s advocate]
It’s a Caucasian MAN’S club. In that case, would she be allowed to start a “Caucasian Women” club? I mean, women of every race have been oppressed as long as any other minority, and still suffer from unequal treatment today.
I would respectfully disagree with you on a technicality. So, I suspect would white people like Betty Friedan, Elizabeth Cady Stanton, Susan B. Anthony, Belva Lockwood and Alice Paul.
[/devil’s advocate]
sticks a comma up there after suspect and hopes no one notices
Maybe it’s just me being reactionary, but when I hear Caucasian Club, I also hear “Keep the Darkies Out Club”. What other purpose could this club serve? “Let’s celebrate our heritage” seems more than flimsy to me. It seems dishonest as hell.
The hell there isn’t a unique culture.
My husband and I are both “Caucasian” or Euro-American. We’re both white, and both of our families came from Europe.
The difference is that my family is Russian, Romanian, with some Baltic States thrown in for fun. My husband’s family is Irish, except for his grandmother, who is (I think) Argentine and Mexican. You couldn’t find two different, more diverse backgrounds.
All that said, I’d love to see a club where “Euro-Americans” can learn what it’s like to be Irish, or Russian, or German, or whatever.
In any event, no one was suggesting that this club was going to raise a White Power flag and sing the Horst Wessel Song at meetings. All this group wanted was to get together to discuss European history and how their “whiteness” affects other groups. Go to a few museums, that sort of thing. How is that bad?
Robin
Do you hear “Keep the Honkeys Out Club” when you hear about black student clubs?
Allow me to some up this thread, and I will not atempt to pathetically lie about the fact I think Diogenes is a bullheaded fool.
danceswithcats: What is wrong with this girl’s club?
Diogenes, et all: This is vile, evil filth from thew depths of hades! How dare this girl demand the right to do the same things as other people! She’s white! She can’t do that because its racism and unequal! And its unneccesary. Because every white person knows all the cultural heritage of all the evil White nations from Spain to Ireland to Russia. Because we all know those White people are really one homogeneous mass, with no distinct culture. How dare she make a political statement, with her skin color! That bitch!
Various posters: What. The. Fuck. ?
May I simply point out that this is why I distinctly dislike a certain breed of liberal? Cerrtain ones, on this board even - and I’m not mentioning anyone by name - seem to hold a distinct hatred of a group they by deifintion are included in. The fact is that if you go to a college, you will see various ethnic clubs, (sometimes including multiple ethnicities) based around language programs. These are not evil associations, and this “Caucasion club” is little different in principle. Now, its possible there would have been trouble. Its also possible that the moon is a move backdrop. I think this lass deserved a chance to put things together.
Because I think there are some other people who need education around here.
I don’t hear that. I’m not a fan of such clubs, but they may indeed feel that they need to band together for strength. . Racism still exists, and blacks are still only about 16%-18% of the population. Whites, being better than 75%, don’t really need to do that.
Diogenes:
On the one hand, you and I can see that really, the different European cultures cannot really be lumped into one “Caucasian” culture.
On the other hand, who are you to proclaim that the students themselves do not see a cultural connection where there is none? After all, if a certain number of people feel they are part of a culture, they are part of a culture.
Ah, but this is not the “European Cultures Club” but the “White People” club–clearely, this is a club based on race, not Kultur. And with your racial background, you don’t qualify. Perhaps there can be an Untermenschen club for the mongrelized offscourings of the Slavs and the native peoples of the Americas.
Ve, er, sorry, we, must devote ourselves to studying the contributions of the white race to civilization because after all, there are no white leaders, entertainers, scientists or athletes of note in the United States, and absolutely no mention is ever made of white people in school textbooks. And God knows that there has never been a White president!
I think the Caucasian Club should start off each meeting with a singing of “Tomorrow Belongs to Me,” followed by discussions of great White people like Richard Wagner, Leni Riefenstahl, Friedrich Nietzsche, and William L. Pierce. Perhaps there could be charitable activities, like having fundraisers to send the Jewish kids to summer camp.
Yes, awareness of (the right) skin color is paramount for the proper education of White children in racial awareness. We must spread this program throughout every school in Amerika.
Heute Freedom High School, Morgen die ganze Welt!
I work for a Fortune 50 company and we have the same situation at work. There are a variety of special interest groups for minorities, including a group for women, black women, black men, and gays and lesbians. They offer, among other things, mentoring services and a social outlet for their members.
No one has come forward to create a group for white males, to the best of my knowledge, but I highly doubt it would get management approval. Why? Well, because there already IS an old boys network in place and it’s been in place for centuries. They might not have a charter, but they do have regular meetings (on the golf course, at lunch everyday) and they regularly enjoy the perqs of being a white male because their chances of getting promoted are leap years ahead of a female or hispanic counterparts.
Simply put, if the power base weren’t so concentrated on male caucasians, we wouldn’t need minority clubs.
The libertarian in me still thinks that if they allow an African American group, they should allow a Caucasian group. However, as a parent I would certainly discourage my children from joining such a group, no matter how well-intentioned the purpose might be. Because the perception is that minority groups are meant to be inclusive while majority groups are meant to be exclusive. There is a difference.
Hmm… here in the US, it seems to me we’re steeped in American culture, which is an outgrowth of SEVERAL cultures, western european probably being the largest.
I always thought a club like this would be useful if only to explain a lot of the heritage issues to generic white mongrels like me. In other words, explain the German, English, Scottish, Polish, Italian, etc… roots of contemporary American culture. Since I really can’t claim any particular heritage, it might be nice to have events and stuff put on by a group like that- it’s not much different than what a lot of the Hispanic student clubs and groups do around here in Texas- I don’t recall them being anything more than cultural celebration type groups.
Now if the idea behind the “Caucasian Club” is to mock groups like the Black Student Union or NAACP chapter at the high school, then I think it’s pretty reprehensible and has no place.
The way I see it, it comes down to intent and focus rather than a black/white “it’s racist” or “it’s not racist” thing.
“Black” is a relatively meaningless term anyway. Ther really is no such thing as “black” or “negro” culture. I wouldn’t have such a problem with some sort of legitimate ethnic club like a Nigerian or Ethiopian or Jamaican club. “Black,” though really only means that you have dark skin. It has no other connotation. I think it’s stupid to form clubs based on nothing but skin color.
Y’know, this may sound a bit, oh, I dunno, silly, but equality is equality, and clearly, the constitution provides for it, even if the people ‘in power’ do not. Furthermore, I think the whole idea of the hypenated American has become passe’, though if we’re determined to stick with it, perhaps a switch in word placement is in order. How about American-African, or American-Irish? This is all just rubbish and blather anyway, so why not be correct about it.
I doubt that in any “african-american” student club here in the US, that there are any 1st generation, right off the plane, africans. The heritage everyone so fervently seeks, generally goes no further than our own shores and borders anyway. History is history, but for my money we’re Americans first, and whatever second. I’m as proud of my German/Swedish/Danish heritage as anyone else is of theirs, but would I rather live anywhere else but here? Not on a bet.
That having been said, I think disbanding the race biased clubs in ALL publicly funded schools should be a priority, there isn’t necessarily a need for a caucasian club, an african club or an irish club, in places where any heritage exists in numbers large enough to have a club based on the heritage. Racism in reality, comes with age, and in real life, after high shcool and college, there are enough clubs that exclude people, why start so early, learning how to hate?
I…I agree with Diogenes the Cynic. Lightning strike me down. Although I think gobear phrased the argument more beautifully.
As a white Southerner, I’m well aware of my power and privilege, and the responsibility that comes with the accident of my birth. Call it whatever derogatory term you will, but I find the idea of starting a Caucasian Club “because the other groups get one” repugnant.
If she’s threatened or jealous that black people get something she doesn’t, doesn’t that just show she’s afraid of losing ground to “the other” and there’s still an inequality?
There are plenty of ways to start a group with the focus “white people, culture, and racial issues” without slapping a racist name on it. Plenty of public schools have. Certainly, there are issues that a group of white, affluent teenagers could address that don’t even necessarily have to do with other races. Cocaine use in white suburbia. School massacres, which have white perpetrators. Eating disorders and self image. I’m sure this is what the Caucasian Club is meant to be about. :rolleyes:
All that being said, I support her right to be a complete nitwit, because I support my country’s freedom of speech and care especially about children’s rights. I hope making this an issue for discussion will inspire people to examine their own feelings (outrage toward the club, or outrage toward the outraged) and how those feelings related to the world at large… But I’m not holding my breath.
And if you think there aren’t cultural divisions based solely on skin color in America, you aren’t paying attention.
You know, most clubs which are “minority oriented” are open to any and all members, no matter what color their skin.
A “White” club is legally and logically consistent, and all the other things you’ve been saying. Yes, it’s a double standard to object to it.
But what bugs me is the motivation behind it. You’re not going to be able to convince me that these young people had a heartfelt desire/need for having a club where they could celebrate aspects of their unique white culture and enjoy an environment where their whiteness was considered something to celebrate. Making a “white” club was an “in your face” statement. I think it’s obnoxious. I don’t see this as a sophisticated sociopolitical statement about the segregation in our society. I see it as a rude, contrived way to make a point, without regard to to its effects on one’s peers.
Dewey Cheatem Undhow: Trying to discredit DtC’s argument by substituting “black” for “white” just doesn’t fly, because the validity of such an argument depends on “white” and “black” meaning equivalent things–but they don’t.
“White” usually means “European descent” and “Black” usually means “descendents of slaves”: the former refers to a set of ethnicities, the later to a group of people that have been systematically opressed since our countries founding.
I do think that we’re reaching the point (in the majority of this country) where our racial sensitivity is starting to create more division than tolerance. I really feel that all the labels are fairly artificial. Some people come from different cultures within the country, but these are sure as hell not defined entirely by race.
When hanging out with my friends, I rarely think black, white, hispanic, gay, straight, whatever. I think “friend”. When I meet someone, I pay more attention to how they’re dressed than what their skin color is, because that says a hell of a lot more about them as a person. Assuming that all people with the same skin color have a common experience is so racist that I can’t understand how it seems like a good idea to the PC types.
LC
Let’s have the white club. And let’s encourage all the minority students to join up!