I don’t blame Hillary for obsessing over all that went wrong, and for trying to imagine how things might have gone differently. For all I know, Mitt Romney may have similar thoughts.
But Hillary has to realize: “It’s over.” She had two cracks at the White House, and for various reasons (some her fault, others not), she failed.
She doesn’t deserve another chance, and won’t get one. She should either stop torturing herself or torture herself quietly at home.
If you say so but it really has nothing to do with my point. My point was that Stranger on a train was wrong to say a slight shift wouldn’t have changed the election. A shift of less than .8 in the blue wall would have won her the election.
I was going to post about this in the schadenfreude thread, but since it got its own thread here, I guess I’ll just sit back and soak this in. 
66 million of us voted for her, she won the popular vote by 3 million.
Had she done slightly better in the midwest, she would be president.
I voted for Hillary, but I felt the same way. Obama was our first black president and he was self made. He wasn’t born into wealth or power, he had to build those things for himself.
Having our first female president get the title because she came from a powerful family (or worse, married a man who obtained power first) was kind of a bummer. Had she not married Bill Clinton I’m sure she still would’ve had a meaningful role in the public sphere, but I personally don’t think it’d be on the national level.
I guess this is the one thing I kinda push back against (not directed at you). I think Hillary Clinton was an accomplished national figure in her own right and would have been so one way or another. I don’t think Hillary has much grounds for grieving against Comey specifically (that’s an entirely different thread of discussion). If she has a grievance, it’s that the Republican party in the 1990s blackballed her because they thought she was not acting ladylike when she was out front and center in the first wave of healthcare reform debate. In a lot of ways, I do feel bad for Hillary, who tried hard to make it in a man’s world, and by the time she started to, had become so inextricably tied to the conventional rules of politics that her stature and political record started to become a liability rather than an asset. That’s not to say that her critics - both on the right and the left - don’t have valid claims against her.
I totally agree - people usually do just see what they want to see.
That, and $5, will get you a cup of coffee at Philz.
Had my tee shot on the 13th last Saturday been slightly closer to the pin, I would have had a hole in one.
I think this is the key point. If the election had been changed, the campaigns leading to that election would have been changed.
I’ve seen a similar argument made by Sanders supporters claiming he would have won because he doesn’t have the negative reputation Clinton has. Of course he doesn’t; he wasn’t the nominee.
I’ve said before that by the time the GOP propaganda machine got done with Bernie people would have thought he was Joe Stalin.
Hillary ensues.
I am no fan of Trump, but the irony of her statements are strong, since her campaign was pulling the same hijinx on their opponent (e.g. “Grab 'em by the pussy” video). No one is a victim here.
Oddly, I have no problem with Hillary giving a post mortem on her campaign at a CNN-hosted event where parts were dedicated to CNN asking questions about her campaign. What… you don’t answer the question? Thinking from a historical perspective… you prefer that your primary source remain silent on the biggest night of her life, giving no insight as to their thoughts and reflections?
Regardless, in our new day and age, you do not retire gracefully into the night, you come back… and back… and back… each time louder and more determined than the last. Hell, it worked for Trump, right?
Why should a person who received 63m votes not answer questions about her recent campaign? Why should that person be quiet because they didn’t succeed in a pre-industrial system of elections, one designed to placate farmers, country folk, and slave-owners? It’s not the 18th century any more and Hillary Clinton no more needs to be quiet and stay in her place than any other human being. :rolleyes:
So screw “go away”. Glad to have you back, HRC. And shame on all of you who want to deny her her voice because of your disappointment. For God’s sake, get over yourselves: Progressives need all the help and experience they can get and silencing our own is stupid.
I think Clinton has a valid point about not having a level playing field. The FBI was conducting investigations of both candidates. Comey, a Republican, decided to release information about the investigation on Clinton right before the election while keeping information about the investigation on Trump confidential.
It’s also worth noting that once the election was over, the the email investigation was ended with no charges being filed. This fuels suspicions that the real purpose of this investigations was to discredit Clinton as a candidate rather than look for evidence of any actual crime.
Now it’s one thing when the Trump campaign and the Republican Party attack Clinton; that’s their job. But the FBI is supposed to be an impartial government agency not a political group trying to influence who gets elected.
Yes, because a witch hunt that in the end amounted to absolutely nothing is exactly the same as a candidate accused by 12 women of sexual assault privately admitting to committing sexual assault. Any person who claims “I value women” and voted for Trump is a liar.
Also, guys, are we seriously gonna pretend that this was somehow a fair fight, and Clinton lost just because she was awful? Really? We’re still beating that dead horse? Do I have to list all the ways that she got fucked sideways in this election, from media coverage that constantly played to false balance (when one candidate has two scandals and the other has a hundred, you don’t cover the scandals of both candidates the same amount!) to fake news and propaganda, to the 25 fucking years of smear and propaganda Clinton faced? I’m sure there’s more.
Hillary’s shooting the messenger. On the plus side, at least it’s only a metaphorical shooting. I’d say both Mr. Comey and Mr. Assange got off easy.
Here’s a thought: Don’t be corrupt and you won’t have to worry about your corruption surfacing, leading to people (rightfully) losing faith in your credibility as a leader, and as a human being.
Actually, I wonder what might have happened if the election was 7 days earlier. The 2016 election was held on Tuesday, November 8, the latest possible day. How much fatigue had set in as the campaign season dragged on?
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She endures. Kinda like The Dude.
Elections are dirty. Both parties are especially dirty during elections. I confess I thought Hillary’s campaign was, evidently, weaker than I was willing to admit at the time - I mean - considering she lost due to all the BS - if she was a stronger candidate, all the lies in the world would not have made the difference - but in her case - they did. The GOP played their hand smarter and managed to convince more people NOT to vote for her than the Democrats convinced people NOT to vote for Trump.
Tanking in what were supposed to be safe blue states or low-risk swing states is not some weird, inexplicable phenomenon, and the Comey drama had negligible effect. She chose to campaign in states that were going to vote for her no matter what to boost her popular vote numbers, at the expense of doing anything in the Midwest (she never even visited Wisconsin, unlike every other candidate since 1972). She was a bad candidate who ran a bad campaign, pointing to an irrelevant number that she inflated at the expense of winning the election doesn’t change that.
Don’t encourage her. Because if she runs again, the Repubs will run the second-place finisher from The Bachelor and she’ll still lose.
Regards,
Shodan