Well, how do they? How do the followers of an executed political prisoner who said “turn the other cheek” and “let he who is without sin cast the first stone” reconcile this.
Bush claims that being a Christian is the most important thing in his life, but he has sent over a hundred people to their deaths, including Karla Faye Tucker who claimed she was “born again” and begged him to spare her life. Bush mocked her on TV in the manner of the murderers of Jesus. I am not a Christian, but morally could never send anyone to their death and certainly could not mock a person who was pleading for mercy. What does this say about the relationship between morality and religeon?
Well, I for one cannot see any evident contradiction. A person says “I consider myself a Christian and I believe the death penalty is not against my religion”. As simple as that. Just as they say “I am a Christian and I believe (insert whatever, abortion, sex before marriage, masturbation, rap music,…) is not against my religion”. Why should a Christian take your definition of what is acceptable since you are not even a Christian?
I am not arguing a position here. I am merely posting what is considered a directive from God on how the Jewish society was to conduct itself. By inference, all governments have this responsibility.
From the New Testament of the Christian Bible
This passage implies that even to the Christian (not just the Jew), that punishment is the function of Government.
So from the Jewish Bible, where God is telling them how to set up the ideal society (government), murderers must be punished by death. From the NT, the government is “God’s servent … to bring punishment.”
FTR, not all Christians believe that just because our present government is a democracy and that just because God can use it, that we should support it and be involved with it. Notable examples include the peace churches. These include Mennonites, Amish, and Quakers (not a complete list). Mennonites that I know vote, but do not participate in war. Many also believe that capital punishment is wrong (Vengeance is mine, saith the Lord.) The Amish do not even vote. Neither do the Jehovah’s Witnesses (neglecting any debates on their status as Christians.)
So, there is justification in the Judeo-Christian support of the death penalty. But many sects with the Christian church find ample (in their opinion) reason to believe that with the advent of Jesus, Love supersedes the OT (Jewish Bible) position. I am not well-versed enough (pardon the pun) to give scripture for their position.
Part of the point of my last two paragraphs is: Beware of painting with a broad brush. Certainly, the Karla Faye Tucker execution did not go undebated within the Christian community.
The best response to that conundrum is that while it isn’t an individual’s place to say “You will be executed”, it is society’s place, and duty, to do so.
If I recall correctly, Jesus said this when defending an adultress: Let whoever among you that is without guilt cast the first stone! He was speaking against the stoning of a woman whose only crime was adultery. Yeh, I agree with him on that.
The Catholic church has publicly and strongly opposed the death penalty. The Pope has said that it should only be used when society has no other way to protect itself.
On the other hand, my LDS neighbors are staunch supporters of the death penalty on the grounds that some sins require “blood atonement”.
God’s demanding an accounting for life goes all the way back atleast to Noah and His covenant with Noah and his family after leaving the Ark.
In Genesis 9:5-6 we find:
(And before anyone says that this means that we shouldn’t kill animals for any reason, verse 3 of the same passage says that “Everything that lives and moves will be food for you.”)
But on to this:
And no where did he or any of the apostles condemn the death penalty. The case of the prostitute and the pharisees was to show their extreme hypocrisy in a certain instance, not to say that putting someone to death as a means of punishment was wrong.
Well, since He willingly died by way of the death penalty to fulfill His mission, I’d say he considered it necessary. Most of His apostles willing met with similar deaths - none condemned the death penalty as far as I know.
The ironic thing here is that many conservatives agree that it’s proper to put to death someone who is undoubtedly guilty of heinous crimes but want to protect the life of the unborn. While most liberals regard the death penalty as cruel and inhumane, yet don’t see a problem killing the ultimate in innocense - an unborn child.
::grumble:: Yes, you see it that way from your perspective, MKM. But for those of us who are pro-choice and against the death penalty, it looks a little different. For me at least, before the development of a complex cerebral cortex in a fetus I cannot see the fetus as a person, simply a “potential person”–worthy of solemn consideration, yes, but not the same rights as an actual person. In much the same manner, once the cerebral cortex is irreversably dead in an adult human, I no longer consider that human a person, either, and would not keep him/her on endless life support until the rest of the organs eventually follow the brain into utter nonfunctionality. I honor personhood, and do not consider a human life lacking a cerebral cortex to be truly a person–they lack the brain functionality for even the possibility of consciousness. Once the cerebral cortex is formed (around the fifth-sixth month), I believe the fetus may be a person, and would not agree with abortion unless the mother’s life was endangered. (I consider the fetus to quite possibly be a person at that point, but we’re not certain if the cerebral cortex is all that is necessary for consciousness, just that it seems impossible without it. However, we know the mother is a person, and I consider a certain person more valuable than a 90% likely person–though of course, if the mother wishes to risk her death by bearing the child, that is her right).
Once a human’s personhood is fully established, I consider it wrong to kill that person except as is necessary for defense of self or others. When a prisoner is in jail for life, I do not consider them to be a likely threat to life of others (yes, of course there are exceptions–although, what are the statistics of women killed by childbirth versus people killed by prisoners on death row?). As well, having observed those who were on death row later being found innocent of their capital crimes, I find it highly likely that the death penalty has killed and will continue to kill innocent persons–persons whose personhood and consciousness is clearly evident and who were not guilty of the heinous crime they were charged with. If it is not truly necessary to protect other people and may very likely kill innocent persons, I cannot support the death penalty. I am not attempting to hijack this from a discussion of the Christian justification for the death penalty, but do you understand more clearly at least one pro-choice/anti-death penalty viewpoint now?
Obviously not all Christians are against capital punishment. Capital punishment is not necessarily against Christian philosophy. Depending on denomination your miles may vary.
She deserved to be mocked. She brutally murdered someone and then turned around and begged for mercy. I’m not a Christian either but morally I could send someone to their death and I could probably laugh if they asked for mercy. I’m not normally a callous individual but sometimes I do laugh at some horrid things.
Gaudere, just a few questions. Do you have children? Have you ever heard the heartbeat of a child in the mother’s womb?
When I first heard the heartbeat of my daughter who was only two months in the womb, I had absolutely no doubt it was a life. To be honest I was a fence sitter on the abortion issue for most of my life - even for sometime after the renewal of my faith. I would never consider it in my own situations, but felt if someone else wanted to take that step, it was their own business. But after I heard that heartbeat, there was no way any one could convince me that a baby, no matter how far along the gestation period it is in the womb, is not a life. A mass of tissue doesn’t have a heartbeat. A mass of tissue doesn’t look “into my eyes” through the ultrasound while sucking her thumb. Something with life does that. A child does that. That is my perspective.
Not yet, and I don’t believe so. But I do know quite a few women who have done both, and are still pro-choice; my mom, for one.
It/he/she is certainly alive. But remember, I differentiate between “person” and “life”–if you scoop the cerebral cortex out of a human and throw it away, the body may still be alive and the heart may still beat on its own, but I would consider that person dead. There would be no consciousness, no “I” left. If the irrevocable end of consciousness is the end of personhood, then logically to me the beginning of personhood is the beginning of consciouness. And before the cerebral cortex, consciousness does not seem to be at all possible–just try removing the cortex from a human and see what’s left: no thought, just breath and heartbeat. So I cannot see a fertilized egg as a true person, nor a brain-dead adult, nor a pre-consciousness fetus. I would no more demand a husband to keep his brain-dead wife lingering on life support until the body dies as well than I would force a woman to not abort a fetus who has yet to develop a cerebral cortex, or to not use the Pill. That is my perspective.
…And back we go to the Christian death penalty debate. I hope.
Vatican 2 stuck with the position of the church on the death penalty. The only time in which the death penalty is accepted is if other peoples lives are at stake. For example, if a prisoner murders a guard, or another prisoner, then other lives are at risk and the murderer should be put to death.
Well not exactly. Vatican II does not have much to say EXPLICITLY about the death penalty…perhaps you were thinking of the papal encyclical “EVANGELIUM VITAE”
This has always been a bone of contention for me. I would argue against the DP, and my seminary teachers would hear about it, so would devote an entire class to why the DP is recquired by God, blah blah blah.
I figured, He’s God, He can figure it out, and He doesn’t need our help. When He needs me to kill someone, or condone the death of that someone, He can come down and let me know. Otherwise, I’m going to consider it His place, and not mine or society’s, to take a life.