What I’ve always known is that my grandmother was murdered in 1977, beaten to death by ‘person or persons unknown’ (as it says on her death certificate), no reason for the murder ascertained - she still had 2d on her person and she never looked rich, so if you were going to mug her, you’d take that 2d - took a while to fully die, and ‘died on the same day as Elvis.’
I don’t really know where I got the latter from - it’s just something I remember from when I was a little kid.
I’m happy to publish her name online: Anne Patterson Leggatt. I don’t use her name as a password reminder (I’ve always used fakes) and nobody else has cause to. She was usually known as Pat.
I have tried local govt archives in the area she was attacked. Nothing. It was in the vicinity of the Tower of London and that’s the reason we now have places in the crypt at All Hallows by the Tower. Again, this is hearsay.
I went there the other day and the very nice young churchlady was fine with us viewing the ashes, and I think also surprised that there was space for the rest of us (it’s a small Roman crypt. Counts as a museum for my 100museumsinayear thing. I always multitask :D). I was surprised that she was 57 when she died, not in her 60s - it seems so much younger.
I’m not surprised at the dearth of news reports - she was 57, a Scottish alcoholic who’d been separated from her husband for many years, beaten to death by strangers for no reason, took a while to die, so not newsworthy, and possibly died on the same day as a big news story - but you’d think there’d be something? Local news, maybe? I even asked at the City of London Police Museum this year, when I was there (the death was in the City), but they just had nothing.
Asking my mother or relatives is not an option. What they know, I know, and we are very much not close. But I think it would help them to at least have a news report about their mother’s death - I always remember it being a big deal that their mother was murdered and nobody really tried to do anything about it.
I don’t know about how they are in the UK, but here in the US a library is where I would start. They would know if there were local newspapers in existence at the time that are since defunct, and would have those archives, so if they had any stories you could find them. Sorry if this seems simplistic, but you did ask.
Also, you might check her home town. You said she was Scottish, maybe it was a bigger deal to them that one of their own got murdered in London. Again, the local library (in her home town) is where I would start. Don’t forget to try both her maiden name and her married name.
Professional genealogists are pretty good about winkling out details about obscure people in the past. Maybe you could consult one? I have no idea what they charge.
The police have absolutely nothing? It seems the case would have belonged to someone, so maybe that’s a place to look. Info might not be on file but the detective might have something, so there’s a slim chance they or their family might have notes or memories.
As mentioned, check the libraries and police logs not just for her but for other events and/or crimes. Her friends, shopkeepers, bar patrons, landlords, neighbors or co-workers and bosses. Oh-- hospitals too. Are there census records?
If some of her family won’t talk, check other members who may have overheard something or noticed behaviors. Kids pick up a lot.
Time and privacy issues are going to make it rough, if not impossible. My grandmother was stolen from her birth family, so I know it’s frustrating, hard work. So very much changes and is lost.
Spare some time to think about how you’ll deal if your search doesn’t yield the results you hope for. Good luck.
Same as Roderick, my thoughts are coming from an American perspective, so they may need to be tweaked for the UK.
was there a service for her, and did the officiant know her? Talk to that person. They may have been privy to details your parents aren’t willing to/can’t talk about. Also, what about the funeral home (that is, the people who provided embalming services, coffin, presentation of the deceased, et cetera)? They might have some records.
is there a police record of the attack? While the local gov’t archives may not have anything, the local police precinct might have something. It might even list names of investigators or police officers. After thirty-five years, there’s only a very slim chance someone might remember something, but then, murder is a lot less common in the UK is my understanding. Maybe it stands out in someone’s memory.
Also, in the US, you can file a Freedom of Information Act request if a government gets resistant about providing documentation outside of a certain time frame or national security, and they must, by law, provide whatever they have on the topic. If it’s sensitive information (unlikely), it might be redacted.
do you know what hospital your grandmother was treated at? It’s more of a long shot since hospitals may not be required to keep personal records going back that far, and in the meantime, everything’s been digitized, but there might be a filing cabinet in a damp basement with some information on your grandmother. Was an autopsy performed on her? That’s much more likely to be recorded and kept, especially since your grandmother was a victim of violence.
As Roderick suggested, check local newspaper archives to see if there’s an article. Again, I’m thinking US sensibilities, but an old lady being beaten up and put in the hospital would get attention here, and I would think even moreso in the UK. The article might give you names, places, and details.
Are any of the local businesses still under the same ownership or in the same family? Something like that happening nearby might live on in the owners’ recollection.
If it’s still an unsolved case the police definitely should have a cold case file. There was a show on A&E called Cold Case Files. There were a lot of twenty and thirty year old murders solved. The police periodically review cold cases for new leads or a fresh cops perspective. New science tests often solves old cases.
The terminology may be different in the UK. But cops don’t give up on murder cases.
Even a solved murder should have a permanent file in the archives including the court records with testimony.
If you are in London, visit the British Library Newspaper collection in Colindale, North London, it’s on the Northern Line, the branch with Hamstead and Golders Green. The information specialists will know the local papers for that area at the time so you are likely to find something even if it didn’t get into the Times. You can also contact them via email with your questions.
If you are into visiting museums, they are near the RAF museum (I think) and you can also see a real blue (i.e tardis) police box from the tube window on the way there!
I’ve searched the England and Wales death records (on Ancestry) for Anne Patterson Leggatt, and got nothing for 1977. There’s an Annie Leggatt in 1974, but she was 68 (born October 5, 1905 - your Anne must have been born around 1920). Also, she died in Staffordshire, not London.
I remember reading an article from the BBC which said that murder cold cases are never closed and 1977 is by no means ancient history, so presumably her file is somewhere - if the City of London Police have nothing, I wonder if there’s any chance the case could’ve been passed onto the Met? I guess the case might not have passed into the museum archives as it’s relatively recent?
Have you tracked down the coroner’s report?
I am morbidly fascinated to hear what you manage to uncover.
I’m making an assumption here: two pennies in old money.
Pre-decimal British coinage was referred to as “LSd”, meaning “Pounds Shillings and Pence” but from the Latin “librae, solidi, denarii”. This was in writing only - people only ever referred to them by their English names when speaking.
It was ancient and traditional, and therefore absurdly complicated: There were 12 pence in 1 shilling and 20 shillings in a pound (not even mentioning the other gradations). When we went decimal the pound retained its previous value but the term “shilling” disappeared (though the coins did not - they were then worth 5p, and the new 5p pieces were the same dimensions as the old shilling) and pence were reapportioned to have 100 per pound - and then renamed “p”.
Having said that, decimalization was in 1972 and even in 1977 2p was a pretty trifling sum (enough for a copy of the Beano IIRC) so Sam may actually mean something else by 2d.
Sam I have no suggestions but wish you success in your search.
That sounds like the easiest place to get started, thanks; the problem with searching local libraries for old newspapers is that I have about thirty different libraries to choose from.
I’ll save the other suggestions too, though, especially the list from phouka. Good ideas all. There’s no family to talk to. When I say we’re not close, I mean that I’ve seen my aunt three times in thirty years.
My Grandmother’s life was kinda messed up - her parents were divorced way back when divorce was a huge deal, her mother committed suicide (and her mother’s mother had also been murdered - three generations of violent deaths!) and she was brought up by two great-aunts that I once met briefly; they did not strike me as the nurturing type. Her marriage to my Grandad was really unhappy and her kids - the ones that lived - were all taken away from and brought up by Barnardo’s.
A sad little life brought to an early end by someone or other that nobody seemed to care about finding.
There probably wasn’t a funeral home, exactly; we don’t often do open casket funerals in the UK, with embalming and all that, and she would not have been a suitable candidate for that anyway - her face was smashed to bits. But the Vicar was a man who’s now an Archdeacon based at Southwark Cathedral, so he’d be easy enough to contact.
It’s odd, isn’t it? You’d think her name would pop up on some list or other.
The ‘2d’ thing is just something I was always told - that the only money she had was 2d and even that wasn’t taken, making a mugging unlikely. I expect they were just saying 2d rather than 2p out of habit.
In those days surely they’d have said “tuppence”? I’m sadly (just) ancient enough to remember old money, and never heard anyone actually saying “two dee”.
I don’t know - I’m just repeating verbatim what I’ve been told. It’s never been talked about much, but when it has been it’s been in a few repeated lines. It was definitely 1977 - I saw the date in the crypt the other day (just the year though. And my Grandad’s just has his year of death because apparently they weren’t sure of his year of birth).
I’ve done a bit of trawling through local papers for reports on deaths (as part of my investigations into people buried at a local cemetery). Things you may find include news reports, obituaries, death notices, funeral reports and inquest findings. The latter can be most difficult to discover as they may be held some time after the death. In the case of your grandmother also as she did not die immediately from her injuries you will have to work backwards to find reports of the original attack.
You obviously have accurate details of her name and age: it’s possible that local newspapers may not have done, might she have gone by other names? For example could she have lived with another man and used his name?
If the murder occurred within the City, the records of the coroner’s inquest should be in the London Metropolitan Archives and, just as importantly, should be open to reseachers. The LMA has a handy online guide on the subject. The most relevant section for your purposes is on the third page. As they explain, it helps if you already have the death certificate.
I found the death record at last. Annie Patterson Leggat (note different spelling), born 17 Nov 1920, death registered October/November/December 1977 (the lists are quarterly, but you’ll note it’s not August which is when Elvis died - speculation: she was bashed August 16 and died 2 or more months later?)
You’re a star. The name is spelt various ways - my Grandad spelt his own name a different way every time; he had many fine qualities, but literacy was not one of them. Presumably the attack was the day Elvis died, yeah - I’ve never been sure about that aspect of it.
The name is spelt various ways - my Grandad spelt his own name a different way every time; he had many fine qualities, but literacy was not one of them. Presumably the attack was the day Elvis died, yeah - I’ve never been sure about that aspect of it.