How Come There Aren't Any Christian TV Shows?

The simplest answer would be that when art is subordinated to ideology, the art suffers. Look at movies from the Soviet era. Apart from from Sergei Eisenstein’s films, most Soviet movies are nothing more than thinly-veiled propaganda. Most
Christian movies are meant to be used as witnessing tools, so naturally any originality or spark will be suppressed in favor of the message.

Another problem is that American Christians are a stodgy, uncharitable, and unimaginative bunch. ABC had a wonderful show called “Nothing Sacred” about an inner-city Catholic parish. The show’s characters asked quations about faith, they talked about Jesus, and they treated Christianity with honor and respect. It bombed. Christians don’t want shows that will make them think about the implications of their faith. They don’t want to think about the duties of a Christian living in a secular world. Christians want happy fluffy bunny stories about Jesus making life peachy-keen. They want to be reassured that faith is easy, not challenged to live it.

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Boy oh boy, am I reminded of a scene from The Simpsons. Two scenes, actually. In the first, Homer opens the door to find Rev. Lovejoy and the Flanderses on his step:

Homer: frustrated “Ohhhhh . . . this isn’t going to be about Jesus, is it?”
Rev. Lovejoy: Everything is about Jesus, Homer . . . except this.

In the other, Rev. Lovejoy is giving his sermon to a congregation abuzz over the fact that, according to billboards, “Gabbo Is Coming!”:

Lovejoy: “Everyone is saying ‘Gabbo’ this and ‘Gabbo’ that! But I don’t hear anyone saying ‘worship’ this or ‘Jericho’ that!”
Jasper: “What was that about Gabbo?”

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Kimstu,

First, how do you know that is the reason why the producers don’t want Christ mentioned? I want to see some research on that one.

Besides what you said makes no sense if the 85% number is right. Why would people or sponsors be turned off if the show mentioned “Christ”?

The point that seems to have slipped by everyone discussing this is that, except for the programs mentioned in previous posts, and sparingly there, there seem to be very few instances if any where a TV character seems motivated by his or her beliefs in the everyday actions he or she performs. I suspect this is mostly attributable to the apparently intensely secular atmosphere of the network/studio environment. Realistic characters that are not upper-middle-class suburban, or inner-city, “Southern California” types are scarce.

News flash: not every rural person is a hick. Not every Christian is a frothing-at-the-mouth Jerry Falwell type. Not every Jewish person is a Manhattan office worker. The old Southern Progressive tradition is alive and well. There are Democrats in Nebraska. The world is so full of interesting people that I cannot understand why scriptwriters wear the blinders they do. Some years ago, I had a friend whose father was a 75-year-old dairy farmer who looked like Granny Clampett’s twin brother – and was an accomplished classical clarinetist, author of two published books on history, and so widely read and interested in so many things he would have probably joined this board if the Internet had been around then. His niece was an amateur psychic, radio executive, and convert to Judaism.

Basically, my story line assumed that the characters would live their normal lives. The Christians were not trying to sit their neighbors down and witness to them at gunpoint, just live as though their faith meant something to them besides a place to go on Sunday morning.

On Jesus’s absence from “Touched by an Angel” – the program owes a lot to Della Reese’s beliefs, which are not quite orthodox Christianity – I have no fault with them, but they are not to be taken as what your local Methodist thinks! On the one hand, I feel as though there is something to be said for the idea that belief in (the Judaeo-Christian-Islamic) God and his goodness – regardless of the details – is the key point to be focused on in something like this, and omission of Christ’s name simply makes the program more acceptable to those who do not believe in His divinity. On the other hand, in point of fact, a plurality of people and a majority of theists in this country are Christian, and to evade that fact in the name of inclusiveness can be seen as less than honest. Just what are those steepled buildings that the characters drive by with Rona riding shotgun, anyway?

Keeve, you need to keep in mind the distinction that for a Jew, God is other – the unseen yet present Lord of All, distinct from humanity and above His creation, no matter how much He may involve Himself in it. For a Christian, on the other hand, that God loved mankind so much that He (in one of His three personae) became one of them. The dividing line between Christian and Jew is in John 1, I believe verse 14: “And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us…” The word John uses for “dwelt” is the same verb used for the presence of the Tabernacle and the Shekinah in the Septuagint, deriving from “to pitch one’s tent.” You need not accept this bit of dogma, but I think you can see the thrust of the distinction. You have access to God through His grace and the Law; we have access to Him through the intervention of a Person Who was at once Him and one of us. The Incarnation is at the heart of Christian doctrine, for the very good reason that Jesus is not just a prophet but God Himself walking around Palestine as He did in Abraham’s day.

Goboy said:

Wow. News to me. And to Lib. and Trisk. And to a lot of the Pizza Parlor people, I’m sure.

Would you please turn off your keyclicks, goboy? There’s a bit of an echo, and as a result it sounds like somebody is stereo-typing. :rolleyes:

Got those rose-colored contacts in again, eh Poly? :wink:

You know as well as I that most people want stereotype. If it weren’t for the stereotypes on television, viewers might actually have to (gasp!) think about what they’re watching.

Polycarp said/asked:

The answer to the implied question is: “Your money or your life.”

Imagine a character on a sitcom being asked that question by a mugger. Maybe tense, but not very funny, right?

Now imagine Jack Benny getting asked that question by a mugger. The pause, followed by the eventual line (“I said, your money or your li…” “I’M THINKING IT OVER!”) was one of the biggest laugh lines in radio history.

But, as Benny later said, that line took ten years to write. By the time that episode was aired, Benny had been on the radio long enough to develop a character that every listener knew all of the details of- arrogant, nosy, and incredibly stingy (as George Burns said, “Jack Benny managed to wipe Scots off the face of the earth. Every joke about the cheap Scotsman turned into a joke about Jack Benny.”), and so the dilemna of “your money or your life” carries the immediate comic weight that it wouldn’t for Groucho Marx or Jerry Seinfeld.

Or, more importantly, for an undefined character.

Therefore, when a show first comes on the air, it tends to write its characters in caricatures and stereotypes. So-and-so is stupid. Such-and-such is black, and therefore rails against constant oppression by ‘whitey’. So-and-so is Jewish, and is therefore more urbane and worldly than the other hicks he’s around. Etc. That way, the writers can get into those ‘absurd situation’ jokes or ‘study in contrast’ dramas without having spent years laying a groundwork. Given the dog-eat-dog nature of modern network programming, you don’t have the chance to lay groundwork. If you don’t hook people with your jokes or your drama PDQ, you run a strong chance of getting yanked.

As shows continue on, though, and have a steady fan base and regularly decent ratings, many usually begin to expand their definitions of their characters in order to better develop them, and lead people to better ‘contrast’ positions. Watch Night Court and notice how Judge Stone starts off as just a wacky goof, and develops into a wacky goof with abandonment issues and a strong conscience. Watch All In The Family and notice how much more human and less stereotypical Archie Bunker becomes. This is also why spin-offs are so popular; you can start a series with serious groundwork laid into a character.

It’s a general rule and not a specific: Law & Order has only rarely stopped to try and define the characters on the show, but still goes on strong after 10 years; I seriously doubt Three’s Company ever really cared much about making anything real about its characters. But the general point is, most writers feel they need to start with characters that are immediately identifiable, and then once they’ve got a decent share of the market and don’t fear the immediate axe, they then start to work on showing the true individualities of that character.

Sorry, I didn’t mean to suggest that I thought Jesus should be considered unimportant, just that I didn’t see why he should be considered a more important part of the trinity than God the Father is. But your post, together with Polycarp’s post of 12:33 today, have done a lot to help explain it to me. Thank you.

My apologies, Polycarp, I had no intention of including y’all in my sweeping generalizations. :slight_smile: The Christians who post in the SDMB, though, are not representative of the main body of Evangelical Christians. Y’all are more intelligent, better educated, and more willing to consider other folks’ perspectives, something I have found noticeably lacking in the Christians I know. They’re good folks, but they lack depth, and they definitely don’t read.

Oh, and who are the Pizza Parlor people?

Bill: *First, how do you know that is the reason why the producers don’t want Christ mentioned? I want to see some research on that one. *

Well, I don’t have access to their current interoffice memos, but I’m just extrapolating from the reasons that producers always seem to give writers for avoiding all the other topics that they want avoided (cf. reminiscences by Star Trek (original) writers about taboos against showing open-mouth kisses, or Jessica Mitford’s article about how NBC killed an episode of “Dr. Kildare” that discussed syphilis. Lordy, can you tell I haven’t been watching TV for the last couple decades?) Producers generally seem to shy away from “controversial” stuff because they’re afraid that the sponsors don’t want it, and the sponsors don’t want it because they think it will turn viewers off. If network squeamishness has ever been about personal principle rather than about chasing bucks, I haven’t heard of it.

*Besides what you said makes no sense if the 85% number is right. Why would people or sponsors be turned off if the show mentioned “Christ”? *

Because the majority of self-identified “Christians” seem to consider the subject boring, at least in the context of television entertainment or other activities that aren’t specifically religious. Cf. Phil’s quote from Homer Simpson above: “Oh no, this isn’t going to be about Jesus, is it?” I think that that’s what a lot of American Christians would say if references to Christ started showing up on a prime-time show.

BWAA HAAA HAAAAAA HAAAAA !!!

You’ve just described some of my co-workers and many of my neighbors! I didn’t know you lived around here ;).

A.) Because even if 85% of people don’t mind references to Christ, the other 15% might. Sponsors are often less worried about large groups of people than they are vocal groups of people, and having the nightly news talk about the allegations by the ADL that “Tower of Beeble” (Poly’s new sitcom, set at the Martin J. Beeble Apartment Complex) is ‘anti-semitic for stating that only Christians have a moral code’ is just not something they want to see.

B.) Because, as I’ve stated several times before in this thread, just because two people are “Christian” doesn’t mean that they actually believe in the same thing. Or even that they have any beliefs in common. And representing Christ as meaning or saying this, or meaning or saying that- geez, look at the number of threads we’ve had in just the last month where Christians were taking absolute exception to the version of Christianity other people were following. If you start a show with the implication “Christians act this way”, you’re setting yourself up for major pains from Christians who don’t act that way and take offense at your portrayal of Christians.

C.) So why should I touch this polarizing, possibly dangerous topic when there are plenty of empty, moral-valueless shows that I can air and avoid those kinds of issues that get me in hot water?
To sum up- there are a lot of people who believe that their way is the only way, and the advocation of any other way is a moral wrong, if not outright evil. And while these kinds of advocates exist for nearly any political or moral issue, they exist in much higher numbers for religious issues.

When Wildest Bill started this thread, he sounded as if Christians were being discriminated against because they weren’t portrayed on TV in some sort of show. But thinking about it, has any OTHER religious group ever been given their own TV show before?

There hasn’t been a show about Orthodox/Conservative/Reform Jews, Hindus, Muslims, Buddhist, Jains, shamans, Native Americans, Orthodox Christians, Shinto-ist, etc.

Has any other TV show ever focused or devised a “hook” that works specifically around a group’s religion? I can’t recall ANY!!

I think the reason is that any show like that would fall into the trap of becoming gross stereotypes or fall into a preachy, convert-the-masses format.

Well fryer,

“Touched By an Angel” could be considered a Jewish show. Since it is about God but not Christ. “Charmed” is kinda of wicca show.

But another point since “Christains” are such a big part of the population seems like we would have more shows.

Another argument is that there seems to be alot of homosexual type shows when in fact percentage wise there is not that many homosexuals compared to the population.

Wildest Bill wrote:

No. No, it couldn’t.

Although Christ isn’t mentioned by name in Touched by an Angel, the show’s model of the Afterlife and of the nature of God and the angels is so thoroughly Christian as to leave no room for doubt.

Right, cmkeller?

Tracer,

Now I am confused. While I don’t know that much about the Jewish religion, but what I have read in the old Testament there were angels and the promise of an afterlife there too. Wasn’t there?

WildestBill: *Another argument is that there seems to be alot of homosexual type shows when in fact percentage wise there is not that many homosexuals compared to the population. *

That’s an easy one, WB: homosexuals are funny. (No! Come on, I didn’t mean it that way!! Guys, gals, you know I love you!! Ow, Esprix, at least use the soft leather handbag! :wink: ;)) After all, to most people, homosexuality is all about sex, and sex for most people is an endlessly absorbing subject, as well as potentially an extremely comic one. And gender roles, gender reversals, gender identities, all of these have tremendous comic potential for our sex-and-gender-obsessed society. Heck, why did Shakespeare dress female characters up as page boys and send them off into the woods with the hero? Sexual identity is an issue just made for a sitcom, and having homosexual characters in a show gives lots of opportunities for sexual-identity issues.

Could you make a show that used Christianity for comic potential in that way? (Well, as somebody already pointed out, there is the BBC comedy “The Vicar of Dibley,” but from what I’ve heard that one gets most of its laffs from the fact that the new vicar appointed to a staid Anglican parish is—unexpectedly—female. Again, religion ain’t funny but gender is.) Would you want a show using Christianity for comic potential in that way?

WB, you also might want to consider the ultimate purpose of television. My personal opinion is that tv exists to advertise products and, to an extent, entertain. Not challenge, but entertain. TV wants to cater to the largest audience possible (hence the ripping off of any sucessful show) and bringing in strong religious overtones serves to isolate potential viewers/consumers of advertised products. (I’m speaking mostly about the major networks.)

To an extent, stereotypes are easier to identify with immediately than complex, real people. If one is watching a television show and the person is, for example, your standard issue ditz, the viewing audience will make assumptions about the character. Therefore, their motives don’t necessarily have to be explained. How many shows have one or more of

  • the friendly gay guy
  • the hard drinking single woman
  • the flirt
  • the idiot girl
  • the nice token minority

or any other stereotype?

Most shows don’t last very long. In the beginning of a series, the characters are painted in broad strokes so that they are marketable to a large audience. Then, when a series develops, the characters are sometimes explored.

Hey, no Buffy bashing. Beyond the vampires lies one of the most realistic shows I’ve ever seen. :slight_smile:

Wildest Bill wrote:

tracer wrote:

Ah, well, I’m not so sure about that. The ONLY time ANYONE’S religion is EVER mentioned on Touched By An Angel is if they’re Jewish. I don’t believe that there has EVER been a person identified as Christian on that show except maybe once or twice as an afterthought. There have been MANY episodes that specifically focus on Jewish beliefs and rituals. Of course, then they go and have an episode where the angels celebrate Christmas. In other words, they’re trying to have it both ways. If a Christian meets Monica, they assume they must be right because she didn’t say Jesus wasn’t real. If a Jew meets Monica, they assume they must be right because she didn’t say Jesus was real. Is it any wonder why they don’t mention Jesus? I guess you could say that Touched By An Angel is a pseudo-Judeo-Christian theological muddle. Don’t get me wrong; I like the show, but it’s not exactly seminary-quality theology, if you know what I mean.