Without knowing more, this doesn’t tell me much. For one thing, he would have seen all the criminal cases, not all normal happy families with no criminal issues. I would think he could have just as easily said that robbery is normal human behavior, or that doing meth is normal human behavior.
I have a brother three years older than me. And no, never in a million years did I sense he had even the slightest interest or curiosity about me sexually. Gross.
The people defending Josh Duggar keep saying “Oh, 14-year-old boys are curious…”. What about girls? In my case, my curiosity wasn’t directed towards my siblings. It was more focused on Superman. He was sexy to me before I even understood the concept.
I asked my husband if at age 14 he thought about 5-year-old girls in a remotely sexual way. Nope. Absolutely not. And when I was 14, I definitely wasn’t into 5-year-old boys.
I agree that a 14 year old fondling a 5 year old is a pretty strong indicator of serious problems. In my own experience as a child it seems like myself and the neighborhood kids were around 10 or 11 when we did most of our curiosity type behaviors. I was aware of several instances of 14 year olds trying to mess with their siblings usually close in age. I would consider 14 as the upper limits of adolescent curiosity. I would be concerned at anything past 12.
From what I have seen of girls from 12 to 15 is a real weird age for them and I would not take things too serious within that range if they were minor type infractions.
At 14 I didn’t think about 5 year old girls in a sexual way either… but I do have to admit that I was curious about female anatomy in a way that didn’t require a sexual attraction. I assume I’m fairly normal in that regard, but maybe not. In any event, I could certainly see myself in Duggar’s shoes at 14, with no sexual interest in a young girl other than “She has a vagina and I’d like to learn more about vaginas.” I can’t really call that sexual attraction or pedophilia.
I only had sisters, but I did play doctor with a cousin 4 years older than me. She’d have been 9 or 10, I guess. She initiated it, but I was certainly a willing participant.
I think we have to define “normal” a bit better here. “I’ll show you mine, if you show me yours” is normal. Sneaking up on - and groping - a sleeping five-year-old is the furthest thing from normal. WANTING to grope a five-year-old is the furthest thing from normal.
Continuing to do so, after tearfully admitting your transgressions and being fully and completely impressed upon with the severity of your actions? Being unable to stop yourself despite having seen the horror and revulsion in your parents eyes? That’s not even in the same universe as normal.
That’s a good point. Those things certainly would not describe me (or anyone else I know, to my knowledge). This is really why a therapist needs to get involved at some point. Someone with psychological experience needs to figure out what motivated the behavior and work with the offender to learn how to cope with those motivations in an appropriate way.
Oh, and I just realized I messed up in last post, where I meant to say “I only had brothers” not “sisters”
Most teens not only have no sexual thoughts about their siblings, they can’t imagine anyone having them.
Funny but this is true, I couldn't imagine anyone actually wanting to kiss my sisters or be intimate with them, somehow they were different.
Yea, this.
Touching 1) a sleeping person 2) under 12 or so 3) who is a relative is really, really abnormal. Any one of those three would be bad enough by itself, but the three together is triply abnormal. Josh Duggar should have gone to the juvenile justice system right away.
I could see maybe a five year old trying to sneak a peak when a diaper is being changed, just out of curiosity. And I could see a 8-year-old prompting a five-year-old to play sexually charged games.
But that’s way different than 15-year-old fondling a five-year-old, sleeping or not. There are so many taboos you have to cross to do something like that. Especially multiple times, when so many people could be watching (I’m having a hard time believing that none of the other “sleeping” sisters knew what was up.)
It’s not as common now because families are smaller. I heard stories growing up about kids in large families. Not sure how much was kids telling tall tales in the schoolyard and how much was real. Families with six or seven kids wasn’t unusual 50 years ago. The more siblings crammed into a small home the less privacy and personal space. Kids get curious and need closer supervision.
My aunt and uncle raised 4 kids in a two bedroom house. Boys and girls in the same bedroom when they were young. The two boys started sharing a hide a bed in the living room when they were older. But all their personal stuff and clothes were still in the one kids bedroom. Not an ideal situation but there was no money for a bigger home. AFAIK nothing happened.
See you’re assuming a teenager raised in normal society exposed to societal taboos.
This boy wasn’t, he has all his access to the outside world controlled, he is home schooled, and he was the first kid. When out in public the sisters are supposed to shout NIKE if they see a scantily clad female, so the boys can close their eyes.
In that sort of fucked up environment what taboos?
I am the youngest and only girl in a family of 3 kids. Neither of my brothers ever showed any inclination to touch me in any way other then what is considered 'normal 'for brothers and sisters . ( ‘normal’ in this case means in a nonsexual or inappropriate manner)We are very close in age .
Reminds me of the old saying: