How do you prepare for a chemical attack?

Factual Questions
1

There has been much in the news and on everyones mind about the possibility of biolgical or chemical weapons being used in a heavily populated area. I live in New York city and we are in a potential danger.

As much as it sucks to think this way, I am pondering preparing a bag with medicine and defensive countermeasures as well as whatever will help me get out of Dodge and quick. So question 1:

What should go in this bag?

It must be light enough so that I can get around quickly. The only thing I can think of so far is a .45, a shotgun, and a few gasmasks. Which leads me to a scondary question:

Are their grades of Gasmasks? What is the minimum gas mask I should put in the bag? Is there a small one I can carry around in my pocket that would help? How much should I expect to pay for a quality gas-mask and where can I get some?

I wish I was joking. Thanks for the help.

DaLovin’ Dj

2

I don’t know what the gasmasks will do for you. Most chemical agents cannot be detected by humans with their nose. You will probably first notice the effects of the chemical by collapsing into unconsciousness.

Most of the nasty chemical agents are absorbed through the skin, so you need one of those full body protective suits like the guys who work in nuclear power plants.

3

Move to a sparsely populated area with no major strategic or civilian targets.

4

dalovindj,

Two of the Big Three networks have been talking a lot about this in the last few days. Both have bascially said, unless you wear a gas mask 24/7 you can’t predict if you will be subjected to biological attacks and even with some chemical attacks. It’s invisible, it doesn’t taste nor does it smell.

Essentially, what they have been stating is to keep a basic Survival Kit, like you would have for a tornado or hurricane. Extra batteries, a radio, bottled water, first aid kit, a blanket, matches, some canned food and a cell phone.

If you so choose to have a gun included in that, that’s cool, I think we all need protection anyway. But the thing is, if we are attacked with many means, we may never know until people become sick. We wont know if a biological attack is anthrax (which could be a strain that doesn’t respond to the antibiotic that’s being stock piled by people) or small pox or other germ warfare. You would have to have a mask on 24/7 and it has to be put on properly for it to work. Apparently, from what many have said, they don’t come with instructions.

I know you are serious but be serious with yourself. Learn about how these things happen and plan accordingly but don’t stock up on items that may not be able to help you. I think you have a better chance of getting in a serious car accident than you are to be attacked by germ/chemical warfare. Buckle up, watch where you are driving but don’t put yourself in such a place of fear that makes you buy stuff you will never need because the future is uncertain as to what it will bring.

5

The idea of having a break-away kit isn’t bad - if nothing else, then for the added peace of mind. techchick’s list looks good to me. The radio, in particular, is important - so are extra batteries.

Chemical attack - well, if you’re in a zone where the concentration is high enough that a mask will make a difference, chances are you won’t recognize the symptoms until it’s too late anyway. Soldiers are trained to don masks in nine seconds, max - that should give you an idea of what sort of nastiness we’re dealing with here. But you have an opportunity that a soldier doesn’t have: You can get indoors, seal off doors, windows and vents, and wait for the crap to evaporate. Perhaps throwing a few rolls of masking tape in the kit might be a good idea.

Germs - think normal hygiene, then overdo it. The person-to-person vector for germ warfare is not very efficient in a modern society with our daily showers and cleanliness mania. If an attack is discovered: Gloves, surgical masks, no physical contact if it can be avoided, canned food, bottled water. So get some antibacterial soap and some wet-wipes in the kit.

If you’re at ground zero, no matter what sort of attack, you’re probably out of luck. Your kit should focus on you not becoming a casualty (or just a liability for much-needed rescuers) due to secondary effects: If you have to evacuate or if some part of the infrastructure breaks down.

Let’s hope it never gets necessary.

S. Norman

6

I’m thinking less along the lines of wearing a gas-mask all the time, and more like keeping a bag at home and a bag at work. So if I hear on the news that there has been a release of some kind of chemical or biological weapon, and they are blowing on the winds towards Brooklyn or Wall Street, I can throw the Gas Mask on and try to get the fuck out of town before I get contaminated too.

I’m not really planning on having one at all times. And I understand that it increases my odds of survival minimally. But every little bit matters when your talking about life. If they come out with the announcement that there is a contagion in New York, or anthrax in the wind, I would like to be in a Gas Mask shortly thereafter if possible. I’d also like to be able to help people I run into as I make my escape.

What kind of medical supplies specifically should I carry? And again, where is the best place to buy gasmasks?

DaLovin’ Dj

7

If a terrorist organization has what it takes to make, stockpile, transport, and disperse an anthrax agent which will inflict mass casualties on a city sized area, they will have to be intelligent, well financed, and technologically skilled. If they are, it seems unlikely that they will also be stupid enough to use the one specific type of agent against which the inoculations currently available will provide protection.

A determined suicide attack involving a hundred people willing to infect themselves, and become intelligent vectors of a virulent and lethal pathogen would be far more effective than an air dispersed, or explosively dispersed agent for anthrax. Turnover and laxity of investigation in the food service industry makes a platoon of willing carriers trained in the opposite of good hygiene the cheapest (in dollar terms) delivery system of all. It’s a lot easier to get a job at a sandwich shop, than it is to become a pilot. In the two or three days that you are highly infectious and still minimally symptomatic you can infect a hundred people, far more if the symptoms are initially maskable. With a reasonable second generation alone, such an attack could involve thousands.

So, isolate yourself in a sealed, sterile environment, and never touch anything anyone else ever touched. Or, decide that you are going to live a life worth having, for as long as you live, and then die.

Tris

“For there has never been a protracted war from which a country has benefited.” ~ Sun-tzu ~

8

Just how cool was Howard Hughs anyway ? :smiley:

Rumor has it that Israel stopped export of Israeli Gas Masks, so there’s likely to be a shortage.

9

At least $190 dollars. And then maybe $60 bucks for the bunny suit. Make sure you have good, new filters.

10

You’re gonna shoot the germs?

Give the main anthrax attack both barrels from the 12 gauge and then finish off the stragglers with yer .45…?

“I know what you’re thinking, Staphylococcus aureus…” :slight_smile:

11

I get a catalog periodically that advertises new, sealed-in-the-can, U.S. issue M9A1 gas masks for $20. Over the past couple of years I thought about getting some that I could use as movie props. Can’t get them now!

The thing about them is that even though they were brand new, they were “not for true protection against NBC agents. commercial solvents, or other potentially toxic agents”. I have one that I bought new back around 1981 for use in a film. If the new ones aren’t guaranteed, I doubt this one will work. It’s in it’s gas mask bag in a box around here somewhere.

There’s probably not a lot you can do to protect yourself. The military has “sniffer” units mounted on the back of special humvees so that they can get advanced warning. Not something civilians have. In addition to masks, they also have suits. Remember that some agents can get in through your skin.

As far as basic survival, I have my gun collection. That’s not what it’s for, but an AR-15 can be used as protection in a pinch. I also have REI’s Backpacker First Aid Kit, one in my Jeep and one on my “ditty bag” (I used up a tiny first aid kit on a film set once, and now I carry the bigger one with my slate, tape, and other camera/grip equipment). I also have a compass pouch with some hard candy, a “space blanket”, a firestarter (magnesium), etc. Another bag has more space blankets, instant coffee, candles, and stuff. Of course I have my camping gear – tents, sleeping bags, backpacking stoves, knives, etc.

The most important thing to have is water. Lots of it. You should have at least one gallon per person per day. This is one thing I don’t have, since I drink it instead of saving it.

What about getting out of town? You should have a plan. You should also get out early. The roads will be jammed. Carry extra gasoline. I motorcycle is better for dealing with blocked roads (especially a “dual sport” or Enduro), but you can’t carry as much as in a car. You may also be hassled if you’re carrying an AR-15 strapped across your back.

The best plan is to not be there when the feces hits the rotating oscillator. If you live in a big city, you’re probably screwed. Even if you do get away, if don’t know how to “rough it”, it will be hard. I would avoid people for a couple of reasons: First, they may be infected. The less contact the better. (And if you’re infected, you don’t want to spread it.) Second, some of them might not be community oriented and will try to take your stuff. If you have a place that’s secluded and hard to get to, has a reliable source of water, and so forth, hide. Don’t call attention to yourself. In a true emergency, you’re probably on your own. You may have to kill. In a complete socio-economic collapse, you have to look out for numero uno. Ruthlessly.

Let’s hope we never get to that point.

12

At the risk of turning this into a GD thread, I personally prepared for an attack by bio or chemical weapons at the ballot box last November.

As civilians, we are unable to defend against such weapons of mass destruction except by deterrence or relocation away from the area under attack.

Deterrence, IIRC, involves US policy of retaliation to a chemical or biological attack with nuclear arms. This relates to the definition of “enemy” as stated earlier by the President to include countries which harbor terrorists. Therefore, should Afghani-based terrorist organizations attack the USA with chem or bio weapons, they can reasonably expect that Afghanistan would be quite radioactive as a result of such attack.

If the OP can be stated as, “What can a civilian do to survive weapons of mass destruction”, my answer is, “very little”.

13

Most folks around today don’t remember the “surivalist” phenomenon of the early '80’s. But there are still a large number of survivalist websites, publications and resources kicking around, many of which deal with these topics. For more contemporary resources, check out (of all things) Salon.com - they have an article today at this link: http://www.salon.com/tech/feature/2001/10/03/precautions/index.html which details what may or may not be some effective antibiotics and treatments against certain types of biowarfare. Biowarfare is feared because it could spread widely before being brought under control, thus the damage could be broad-based. It is unlikely that a terrorist group could engineer or breed bioagents of sufficient toxcicity, transmissibility and infectiousness to deliver a debilitating blow.

There is a large distinction between biowar and chemical war, however. Modern chemical warfare is nigh-on instantaneously fatal with LD50 measures (50% of those who receive the listed dose die) for inhaled or skin contact of .0007 grams for some of the more potent toxins. Basically, if you get more than a speck or two on your skin, inhaled or consumed, you’re dead. No treatment, no appeals, finito, te absolvo. Buh-bye. This is the truth which fuels modern Cassandras who scream about a test-tube full of a toxin taking out a modern metropolis. Theoretically, it could happen. As previously pointed out, however, the delivery methods and transmission vectors for such agents make it extremely difficult to mount an effective guerilla or terrorist attack. The damage might be extensive, but it would be limited to only the locality where the attack was mounted.

Of the vectors which modern terrorists might use to attack a metropolis effectively, only the water distribution system reaches enough people and can carry a sufficient quantity of agent to cause real damage. Even then, they would still need a staggering quantity of the agent because it would be dissolved in the medium of transmission. FEMA, President Bush or someone ordered all water plants on top security alert at least two weeks ago, so even this vector appears to be secure. All in all, we are not immune from these types of attacks, but the likelihood of any one American being affected by such an attack is remote.

14

If you have enough warning, you want to get out of the area before the attack strikes. To this end, you’ll want to pack your car with camping supplies plus as many days worth of food, water, and fuel you can. If you have relatives or close friends living in the middle of nowhere, you’ll probably be going to live with them.

In case you don’t get warning before the actual attack, you should also pack a rosary and a Bible, or whatever the equivalent would be for your beliefs, because you can be sure that nothing else is going to help you.

15

Thanks for the nice uplifting post, Chronos. I’ll sleep like a baby tonight.

Re: recommendations of Johnny LA/Chronos/et al., WHY take food, water, etc. with you? As long as you have friends/family within a few hundred miles, you can crash at their place in total comfort.

I think this bio-warfare talk is a bit much. Most people live in low-risk towns, suburbs, and cities.

16

In the unlikely event that we actually had warning of an impending chemical attack, I think I’d be visiting the booze store and the local drug dealer to acquire a few “chemical weapons” of my own to see me through it.

17

Well, aside from the fact that it’s poor form to show up ad someone’s place and eat their food, supplies may be hard to come by even outside of the affected area. And if anything can go wrong, it probably will. For example, you’re driving from L.A. up to your retreat in Oregon. You get to that huge hill at the border and your transmission flies to pieces. It will be a long and thirsty walk, so you need to take your water. Or you may get stuck somewhere for a few days. Flood or something. Maybe an earthquake wrecks a road. Best thing to do is be prepared.