The lil’wrekker has a 20yo friend(female) in a wheelchair. She is also a very small person. So she gets dismissed as a wheelchair bound femalechild. It is very irritating to her. She is otherwise a very capable person. She lives by herself in a dorm room for the handicapped, drives and is doing a full schedule at college and people just cannot help but run to her aid. I have to say she is very gracious when she bats her eyelashes and tells them ‘get lost’. She’s got some stories, I tell you.
I think maybe a bunch of wheelchair bound have the same problem you have. Would you agree?
Seeing as you asked, I think you were kind of a jerk.
As you said, the guy was just trying to make himself feel better by doing a favor for a stranger, even if it was a favor you didn’t need. Would it have caused you any harm to have just stayed quiet or maybe even said “Thank you” and let the guy feel good about himself? You had an opportunity to be nice to somebody else and you went out of your way not to.
But it was doing him a disservice, and he said so much in his OP. Plus, the guy was being disrespectful by asking, then essentially telling him he was wrong about his own needs.
Then why the hell did he even pretend like my wishes mattered? Why ask? Why ask when he had his mind made up anyway? HE went out of his way not to be nice to somebody, not me. I made it as clear as humanely possible that what he was offering to do wasn’t “being nice”. Yet he continued with his behavior. How in the world could that behavior still be considered “nice” after that? It was blatant disrespect to ask me if I needed help with something and then totally disregard my answer.
Maybe he is an actual doorman, just on his day off.
Yes. But I am not “bound” to my wheelchair. I know it’s a trivial matter but terminology does influence perception. I use my wheelchair to overcome the limitations of my disability.
No was not doing him a disservice. In his most recent post (which was not there while I was writing) he says that it is “often times” awkward. I can see this in certain doorway situations and I agree. But he doesn’t say that was the case in the scenario.
Am I being disrespectful if I hold the door for someone else? Am I being disrespectful if I hold the elevator for someone else? Am I being misogynistic if I hold the door for a woman?
Like I said, people often decline help despite it being, you know, helpful. Being a jerk to someone that offers to help is doing a disservice to everyone else in a wheelchair.
Sharp lessons are okay. It’s not a giant deal to be yelled at. Next time that guy won’t make the same mistake.
I should clarify something. I have absolutely no issue with common courtesy. By that I mean people who are in front of me going thru a door who extend the door for me after they have gone thru it. I never have a problem with that. It’s when they race to beat me to the door and then have the pretense of asking if I need help when it’s coming one way or another. And standing in my way should be “making it hard” enough. Maybe if this was a one-off thing, I could have brushed it off and never thought about it again. But this is my life. If not everyday, very common. I was polite and never even expressed anger. HE was the asshole. How could you say he wasn’t doing me a disservice when I clearly articulated that he was? Are YOU now taking what I say and assuming you know the truth as something other than what I’ve expressed?
Nobody’s words are ever taken at face value. Nobody’s. Ever. And if they were, we’d be in quite a mess.
Try this conversation, total face value:
“I was wondering if you’d mind grabbing that box on your way past.”
“What a strange thing to wonder - you’d get clearer information if you thought to ask me.”
Or this one:
“Dad, can I use your car?”
“Yes, it’s good practice for when you’re washing other people’s cars, you can do it this afternoon”
Or:
“Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!”
[No words, Gorbachev walks over and starts pulling at the wall with his fingers]
We can go around with a “face-value fantasy” all we like, but face value is not how humans talk.
And I didn’t even yell. The sharp word were expressed calmly. I know from experience that I MUST take the “high road” in such instances because if I don’t, my words will be marginalized as “angry wheelchair guy” words and dismissed. Hey, they might be anyway but I make it as hard as possible, I do what is in my control.
I think I get where you’re coming from.
If it had been me and I had wanted to school him, I would have done it a little differently. “Sir, did you hear what I said? (give chance to answer) Did you think I didn’t mean it? (give chance for answer) Well here’s how that makes me feel. It makes me feel like (fill in how it makes me feel). Can you see how that might be true? (give chance for answer)”
At that point he might offer an apology which I would accept gratefully. I think the part about what you said that rubs me wrong is you assumed his motive, and you might be wrong. Give him a chance to see for himself, and the lesson will be learned more durably, I think. As it was, I suspect you will be the subject of his dinnertime story about some a-hole in a wheelchair, and he will only be offended, and not educated.
MMkay. How about we limit this to “face value” of basic social interactions amongst strangers. How often are you asked if you need a hand with something (anything) and are ignored? Either you are left to fend for yourself after answering “yes” or have the help forced upon you after answering “no”?
Are you serious?
Are you seriously saying ‘sometimes people aren’t completely Spock-level-comedy literal, and thus we can utterly ignore what disabled people say’?
Why did he even ask if he had already decided he was going to open the door for you no matter what you said?
I can’t tell if you just don’t get it or what. This has absolutely NOTHING to do with holding doors open. It has everything to do with ignoring someone’s wishes.
They guy asked if he wanted help, Ambivalid politely declined and stated why. The guy IGNORED his wishes to do what he wanted instead of doing what Ambivalid wanted.
Yes, sometimes people decline help when they actually need it, but pushing your need to help on a stranger is not acceptable.
Exactly. It’s a pretense, nothing more. Time and time again this happens. That is why I’ve come to learn that my only chance is to be as emphatic and firm and repetitive as possible. Even then I’ll probably get ignored.
I think the guy was kind of a douche for not listening to your emphatic statement about not wanting help. I imagine he’s probably not a bad guy but I also imagine most people don’t have to deal with the shit you have to on a daily basis. I guess you could have refused to go in and waited for him to leave but who knows how long that might haves dragged your day out, the way I see it he’s in the wrong because he undermined your own autonomy as a person and made you feel like you aren’t in control of your life, if only for a brief moment.
No, I’m using ridiculous examples to make a point. There is always “what you meant” separate from “the words you used to try to get it across”, and in any situation involving politeness and customs and social communication, there are layers of meaning that can’t reasonably be ignored. Expecting people to ignore social communication and speak like robots is unfortunately what Ambivalid was requesting. He was requesting it for a perfectly good reason, but it’s still correct that his request gets rejected, because it would ruin society if we really took it to heart.
I’m curious, for these people who didn’t know how to say “yes” to offers of help when “they really needed it” how did you determine what they really needed? What was the criteria used? And if you had noticed in my OP, I said that such oppressive behavior (social discrimination) need not be conscious. I agree, he most likely was not fully conscious of what he was doing. The marginalizing effect of “you can’t get mad at me, I was just trying to help”, is so insidious that it leaves us without an effective voice for change. I know you werent trying to hinder/mistreat, that is the very problem. It’s the underlying mindset that we need help at everything we do and also that what we say is able to be dismissed because we really need it but can’t bring ourselves to ask. The marginalization is insidious.