And here, for the sake of comparitive science, is this thread in Ebonics:
Audo’ Topic, dig dis: How duz one rap Ebonics
Markxxx
Member posted 12-07-1999 12:12 AM
I dun did some Google search on de subject but all ah’ could find wuz articles about da damn controversy (sp??). Whut duz it mean t’rap it?
I know de verb be be used as in ah’ be, ya’ be, he be, she be. But whut else fo’ ‘esample. Am You’s crib? Etc. Co’ got d’ beat!
But whut qualifies as Ebonics. Is dere some link dat describes dis oda’ dan plum relatin’ t’de issue uh wheda’ o’ not it be a subject t’be taught in farm?
Doug Bowe
Member posted 12-07-1999 12:50 AM
Is you ax’in’ be dis slang, pidgin o’ creole?
Diceman
Member posted 12-07-1999 01:14 AM
Ebonics be plum a euphamism fo’ “Inner-city dialect rapped by sucka’s who failed English class in farm”. Consida’ de heavy use uh de to be verb. Co’ got d’ beat! Now dink about how de cliche pirate in some movie o’ cartoon raps. Whut some call some dialect be real plum poo’ dicshun. ah’ have knode several well-educated brothers, and dey DO NOT rap “ebonics”.
NITWATCH2
Member posted 12-07-1999 01:20 AM
Ebonics?
Dat be plum a real baaaad idea by some Black super honcho t’elevate da damn self image uh poo’ Black kids who gotsn’t learned much mo’e dan slang by ‘esplainin’ doodads t’dem in mo’e slang. What it is, Mama!
Years and years back, dere wuz JIBE, sump’n I’m not even goin’ t’try t’‘splain, but it wuz mainly rapped by Blacks who wuz ‘waaay coo’’ and wuz so’s hard t’dig it dat it got wasted out around da damn 70s.
I know many well educated Black dudes and honky chicks who rap betta’ english dan ah’ do and if ya’ close yo’ eyes, ya’ kinnot tell if de sucka’ rappin’ be Black o’ Honky.
De Night Watch always knows doodads.
Diceman
Member posted 12-07-1999 01:23 AM
quote, dig dis:
I know many well educated Black dudes and honky chicks who rap betta’ english dan ah’ do and if ya’ close yo’ eyes, ya’ kinnot tell if de sucka’ rappin’ be Black o’ Honky.
Let’s not dig into de “soundin’ brother” debate, please.
Markxxx
Member posted 12-07-1999 07:20 AM
So’s basically it would be likes de movie Airplane, when Mrs. Cleava’ wuz rapin’ JIBE.
JoltSucker
Member posted 12-07-1999 07:33 AM
Despite da damn public drashin’ Ebonics gots snatchn, ah’ wants’ed t’point out dat it be a lin’uistically valid dialect wid some consistent grammatical structure. Argue all ya’ wants’ about wheda’ o’ not it should be taught in de farms, o’ wheda’ it wuz glo’ified plum to boost folks’ self-image if ya’ wants’. But make no missnatch, it be a real dialect - it wuz not “invented” by any fool wid an agenda. WORD!
pldennison
Member posted 12-07-1999 07:38 AM
Diceman, uh course, raps nodin’ but da damn Absolute 100% Eternally Approved Version uh God’s Holy English Language Handed Waaay down fum de Heavens and Unchangin’ fo’ Eva’ and Ever, Amen. ‘S coo’, bro.
He also, uh course, duzn’t gots de slightest idea whut he’s rapin’ about. Man!
Any sucka eva’ notice dat no oda’ English regional/cultural dialect attracts nearly as much stupidity, venom and uninfo’med speculashun as AAVE/Ebonics? Hmmm . . . wonda’ why dat is?
Any sucka notice dat da damn same buffoons who spew dat stupidity and venom also rarely rap o’ scribble in fo’mal, standard English? Hmmm . . . wonda’ why dat is?
Quotin’ fum http, dig dis://www, so cut me some slack, Jack.cal.o’g/ebonics/wolfram. WORD!htm (emphasis mine):"a. WORD! De variety knode as “Ebonics,” “African American Vernacular English” (AAVE), and “Vernacular Black English”
and by oda’ dojiggers is systematic and rule-governed likes all natural speech varieties. In fact, all human lin’uistic
systems–rapped, signed, and written–are fundamentally regular. Ah be baaad… De systematic and ‘espressive nature uh de grammar
and pronunciashun patterns uh de African American vernacular gots been established by numerous scientific studies over
de past dirty years. Characterizashuns uh Ebonics as “slang,” “mutant,”“lazy,” “defective,” “ungrammatical,” o’“bugger’d
English” is inco’rect and demeanin’.
b. Co’ got d’ beat! De distincshun between “languages” and “dialects” be usually made mo’e on social and political grounds dan on purely
lin’uistic ones. Fo’ ‘esample, different varieties uh Chinese is popularly regarded as "dialects,"dough deir rapers
kinnot dig it each oder, but rapers uh Swedish and No’wegian, which is regarded as separate “languages,”
generally dig it each oder. Ah be baaad… Whut be impo’tant fum some lin’uistic and educashunal point uh view be not wheda’ AAVE
be called some “language” o’ a"dialect" but rada’ dat its systematicity be recognized. "
Farda’ waaay down: “De fo’m be in African American Vernacular English refers t’an acshun dat snatch’d place lots uh times. It duz not usually refa’ to an acshun dat snatch’d place only once. Dis be de reason dat be sounds betta’ in some sentence likes “Dey usually be tired when dey mosey on down crib” dan it duz in some sentence likes “Dey be tired right now, so cut me some slack, Jack.” In de followin’ sentences,dis dialect pattern be shown
in italics, along wid responses fum some sample uh African American sixd grade children. ‘S coo’, bro.” (Page goes on de show de OVERWHELMINGLY consistent applicashun uh de rule.)
Elsewhere, we find, dig dis:"(1) Some participants in dis debate dink dat AAVE be merely an impuh’fectly learned approximashun t’real English, differin’
from it cuz’ de rapers is careless and lazy and duzn’t follow “de rules.” It be “dialect,” in de deprecatin’ use uh dat
wo’d, o’ “slang. What it is, Mama!”
(2) To most lin’uists AAVE be one uh de dialects uh American English, histo’ically most closely related t’fo’ms uh Soudern
speech but wid differences attributable bod t’de lin’uistic histo’y uh slaves and t’generashuns uh social isolashun. (Fo’ a
lin’uist, t’describe sump’n as some dialect be not t’say dat it be inferio’; everybody raps some dialect. Man!)
(3) And some sucka’s say dat while AAVE gots de supuh’ficial trappin’s uh English, at its structural co’e it be a continuashun o’
amalgam uh one o’ mo’e west African languages. De views summarized in (1) is simply wrong. What it is, Mama! De difference between de
views identified in (2) and (3) be irrelevant t’de issue da damn bo’d be tryin’ t’face.
. . .
But on de quesshun uh wheda’ dere be a definable lin’uistic system, rapped by many African Americans, wid its own
phonology, lexicon and grammar (and dialects! Right on!), dere be already some huge body uh research. Lop some boogie. (Fo’ some useful bibliography see de
web site http, dig dis://www2.colgate.edu/diw/SOAN244bibs.html .) De quesshun uh wheda’ twenty-seven dousand African
American children in Oakland farms mosey on down from families dat rap dat language gots’ta be an empirical quesshun, not an issue
fo’ tappin’ sucka’s’s opinions."
I also urge ya’ t’check out http, dig dis://www, so cut me some slack, Jack.umass.edu/aae/disser