Random musing on a lazy Saturday morning…
So, my sister’s husband is my bro-in-law. Is his sister my SIL? SIL once removed? What about her husband- BIL twice removed? And so on for sibling / marriage combos going outward.
I did a bit of googling and just found generic definitions of an in-law as a “relative created by marriage” but admittedly didn’t too very exhaustive research. Putting this in IMHO because I don’t know if there’s a hard line factual answer…
I’m not sure about degrees, but I find the lack of distinction for terms referring to my spouse’s sibling vs. my sibling’s spouse to be odd.
I think it all depends on how you feel about the other person. When I was married, I never referred my husband’s brother’s wife as my sister in law and I did not view their children as my nieces and nephews. However, I call my nephew’s wife my niece.
What I really don’t understand are grown people referring to their stepmother or stepfather. To me those terms are saved for those who actually had a hand in raising the children. When you are 50 and your dad remarries, his wife is his wife, not your stepmother,
In a word, no.
Your sister-in-law is either a sister of your spouse, or the wife of a sibling. Which, as pointed out by @FlikTheBlue, is a bit confusing.
I had a recent argument/discussion about in-laws. The wife of my wife’s brother is obviously my wife’s sister-in-law. Is she also my sister-in-law? I say yes, others say no.
I don’t think it’s odd because it’s not the only such term - my aunt/uncle might be my parent’s sibling or the spouse of my parent’s sibling.
My Iranian-born wife also finds this to be an unpleasant feature of English. Her native Farsi has specific terms to describe almost every conceivable relationship, as I confirm when I occasionally quiz her out of curiosity (“the son who was adopted by your husband prior to your marriage, what is he to you?” … [brief pause] … “[word in Farsi]”).
To me, it’s no different from the lack of distinction between either of my parents’ sister (“aunt”) and either of their brother’s wife (“aunt”). English is very poor when it comes to relationship terms, relative to some other languages.
I am puzzled. Why is not the child of your husband’s brother not a nephew? That is the classic definition of nephew, the child of a brother or sister, unless they came up with an artificial womb and cloning where I didn’t notice it, a person sort of has to have another person involved to pop a kid out. Wwll it could be adoptions all the way down I suppose.
Any kid of my brother is [well they are] my nephew, and kid of my husband’s sister is my nephew [well, 3 nephews and 3 neices] and I suppose when his brother decides to settle down and reproduce, we will see what his wife/partner pops out.
Try “cousin.” I once had to describe my relationship to someone and I came up with something like “he’s my mother’s brother’s son’s wife’s brother’s wife’s sister’s son.”
I don’t know that I’d say English is “poor” when to comes to relationship terms when it comes to some other languages - I think it’s “different” from some other languages when it comes to relationship terms but I think there’s often a cultural difference in the relationship itself when you use a different term for your father’s older brother’s wife than you do for your mother’s sister , even though in English they are both “aunt”.
Thanks; I was a little afraid I was asking a dumb question, but if Randall Munroe is also confused about it I’m in good company.
The first link in the chain isn’t all that strong necessarily, it’s up to you and some sort of agreement you come to with your spouse. Prolly best to resolve that from the start.
“Poor” meaning “having less,” impoverished, a dearth, being bereft, the opposite of “a wealth of.”
I hold with the dictionary definition, which is also the dictionary definition of the equivalent Norwegian word:
## Definition of sister-in-law
1 : the sister of one’s spouse
2a : the wife of one’s sibling
b : the wife of one’s spouse’s sibling
Why does it stop there? Because it does.
But if my spouse’s sibling’s spouse counts, why does my sibling’s spouse’s sibling not count? Or does it? A 2 sibling / 1 spouse chain seems like a closer relation than 2 spouse / 1 sibling.
It’s usually handled through context, and it’s mostly only confusing if you don’t know your spouse’s siblings.
I mean, I have a brother, and my wife has a sister. So if I refer to my sister-in-law, it’s going to depend on the context of what side of the family I’m talking about. If it’s my side, we’re talking about my sibling’s spouse. If I’m talking about my wife’s side, we’re talking about my spouse’s sibling.
The English terms describe the relative position in the family tree with respect to you, not their actual relation to you- that’s why aunt is the same for my mother’s sister or my uncle’s wife. Aunt is the female term for someone who’s a sibling of your parents, whether by marriage or blood.
You know that dictionaries aren’t prescriptive, right?
Skipping quickly past the true response “Your answer is in my post”/“Because it doesn’t!” Sibling and spouse relationships aren’t fungible, you can’t just count them up and make the argument that way. In my experience I spend a lot more time with my spouse’s sibling+spouse, and my own siblings+spouses than I do with my sibling, their spouse and that spouse’s sibling.
After marriage the couple is now a unit. Siblings are now shared, even if the nomenclature isn’t the same. And those siblings spouses get included, confusingly (at least to some) with the same term as the one for the closest extra siblings.
And none of those apply to cousins. My cousin’s cousin isn’t my cousin unless related by blood. And my wife’s cousins are not my cousins.
I didn’t intend to argue that the dictionary made my claim correct. I intended the statement you quote to be interpreted as why the term is defined the way it is in my subgroup of Norwegian and English language uses, which is “Because it is”. I think the logic I mention in my other reply above might be a contributing factor, but it might also be entirely post hoc rationalization.
I do realize quoting the dictionary is often intended to argue for correctness though, so I could have been clearer.