I don’t know of any major or middle size corporation that will accept a graduate from a non-ABET accredited school. When Cal Poly SLO’s Electronic/Electrical Engineering department was put on a few months probation in the 80’s, a lot of students wondered out loud if they be able to get a job after graduation. That’s how important these credentials rank in the real world.
My neice has applied to several schools. However, her HS is just now sending out transcripts, so if she’s missed the boat by not applying to a particular school, there may still be time. But my OP was asking if it 's worth it to pay for an expensive private school rather than a less prestigeous, less expensive school. She’s applied to many schools, both expensive and less expensive.
Hearing from people who’ve actually attended these schools, and others, gives food for thought and seems to be providing an active discussion.
StG
As a Hoosier who spent a lot of time at Rose, let me say that if she got into a comparable program elsewhere, then send her elsewhere.
Yes, it has a strong nerd culture, which I respect. However, (at least when I was there), it was 90% male, and the campus was so isolated that frat parties were the biggest thing on the weekend. Also, if you do manage to leave campus, you are then in God-forsaken Terre Haute.
(My apologies to any Doper Hautians, but your town sucks.)
Something I haven’t seen mentioned yet: some schools emphasize hands-on learning (more extensive labs; more publicized, out of class “group” projects like concrete canoe or solar car; those sorts of things), others emphasize theory. SpouseO’s an Electrical Engineer who started at Michigan Technological U (hands-on) and finished at Wisconsin (theory). He liked the hands-on, but felt the theory made him a better engineer than he would’ve been had he stayed at Tech for the entirety.
I’d tell your niece to research what type of learning dominate her prospective schools’ curriculum (both by looking at the catalog and talking to people there) then matching that to the type of learning she likes to do best.
I’ll also give a shout-out to Wisconsin (my alma mater): outstanding school. I second the worry of other posters that if she goes to such a small school (I know nothing of Rose, but it sounds small and specialized) and finds out that engineering isn’t for her, she has limited options for moving into something else (outside of transferring). Wisconsin’s got an excellent, highly respected engineering school, but it’s also got world-class programs in bunches of other fields, too. Yeah, it’s known as a party school, but it doesn’t have to be - there’s definitely something for everyone, and it’s easy to find your niche. And she won’t end up with crippling debt. Wisconsin’s one of the best values there is, in my experience.
If she’s really looking, MTU’s a great school, too. It’s smaller, quieter, more hands-on. Because it’s smaller, frats dominate the social scene more than they do at Wisconsin, but again, you can avoid them (it’s just harder). It, like Rose, tends to be more male-dominated (something like 70/30), but lots of those men are hot, so it could be a good trade-off. The guys I knew were serious students who also loved to have fun (pretty much like every where else). Oh, but you gotta love snow.
Uh - well in this light, and without my glasses, with your hair that way your screename kinda looked … nah - I got nothing! :o (I know I’m can’t be the only one who thinks that embarassed smilie looks somewhat obscene . . .)
And the otherworldly reflection is the only thing my POS gun has going for it. Suits my paintball role as a slow, ineffective target. Now the beast my son is carrying is one seriously tricked out sniper’s weapon!
What about University of Waterloo in Canada? Pretty much the highest ranked engineering program in the world. Plus it also has the largest co-op program in the world, which gives its grads - especially engineers - terrific practical experience as well as contacts in the professional community.
Also, since nobody else has mentioned this, the U.S. News’ school reports are fundamentally flawed. The methodology behind them is, well, terrible. You can find dozens of articles about the many problems inherent in measuring a school’s “excellence”, here are two if you’re interested.
Basically, just because the school is ranked number one does not mean that the schools ranked under it are fundamentally different. The different between school one and school ten might be a fraction of a point. Meanwhile the difference between school ten and school eleven might be five points. Also, the indicators they use to compile their rankings are not directly related to the learning experience; they’re based more on reputation and resources than, say, student/professor interaction.
Just a caveat emptor.
Dinsdale - That’s okay - I once had a priest try to recruit me for the priesthood. I told him that unless things had changes vastly in the Church in the last week, I wasn’t qualified. And buy yourself a better gun - you need to be able to trounce your son.
Spezza - I think the possibility of a Pheonix girl going to Canada is pretty remote. She thinks 60 degrees F is cold!
StG
Hold on a sec.
Checking for ABET accreditation is in general a good idea, for exactly the reason user_hostile mentions. However, in this thread StGermain’s niece is looking at top-ranked engineering schools. It’s a pretty safe bet that their standard programs are accredited (because otherwise they wouldn’t be top-ranked). Non-standard choose-your-curriculum programs might be an issue.
Also, to correct a bit of misinformation: Schools don’t receive ABET accreditation, individual programs within the school do. It’s not unheard-of to have a school with an accredited EE program and an unaccredited civil engineering program, for example–normally because one of the programs (civil, in this case) is a brand-new program and not eligible for accreditation yet.
Finally, there’s no correlation between accreditation/nonaccreditation and engineering/engineering technology programs. Engineering technology programs are different from engineering programs, but are also accredited through ABET as engineering technology programs. (Lest there be a misunderstanding, ET programs are required to call themselves “mechanical engineering technology” (or whatever) programs.) Engineering technology programs have their place, and they’re perfectly fine for preparing students for more hands-on technology careers. It’s just important that students understand that an ET degree is not equivalent to an engineering degree.
My understanding of the architecture business is that you generally create a portfolio of work and that your career is largely dependant on the quality of that porfolio.
As a general rule, the better the school you went to, the more competetive it makes you in the job market. And as a general rule, you want to get some experience working for a big name firm to build credibility in your field. Accountants generally want to start out in the Big-4 (Deloitte, Ernst & Young, PWC or KPMG). Consultants want to start out in places like Accenture, Bearingpoint or McKinsey (or the Big-4). It’s probably a good idea for a civil engineer to work for Turner or Bechtel for a bit.
Competition for those companies can be tough because they are well known and everyone applies to them. It’s not uncommon for those firms to only recruit at certain schools or have GPA cutoffs unless you have some specific skill set.
There are a lot of small engineering firms too.
I mean it depends what you want to do. Do you want to design skyscrapers in Dubai or do you want to inspect roof trusses in condo complexes in western PA?
[quote=“WordMan, post:18, topic:484414”]
My $.02 as an undergrad Computer Science major back in the day.
/QUOTE]
Same for me.
What she should be looking for is exposure to lots of fields.
Not even out of hs and already focused on engineering car seats for the rest of her life? That is too focused, and it concerns me. In her career lifetime, cars may be going away, and well, it is not like detergent that you can tweak a bit and everyone will go buy new and improved anyway. The total market is 1 per lifetime for every baby max.
I agree with analytical skills as being valuable. So is alumni connections (where my top school is weak). So is exposure to related programs - in her case, usability of items. Being able to team up with people with complementary skills in the same project is immensely valuable. In my mind, Stanford is second to none in that area, MIT maybe a close second.
Not everyone will be able to go there of course, but I think that having to explain to others that your school is “tops” means it is not tops, at least not when you need it to be most.
Even though it is my field, I’d encourage a kid to think long and hard about computer science as an undergrad area today as the bulk of the jobs are gone and never coming back. Anything related to automotive engineering, well, I don’t know, but it is worth considering if it is a gamble. Plastics design and manufacturing? Are those jobs mostly gone to China too? I dunno, but that is why I say it may be too soon to specialize that much before committing to a career path. A quick glance at the Rose Hulman web site makes me think they are nothing if not focused.
I disagree strongly with this, and I speak as an experienced hiring manager. A resume is a concise ad, and it is the potential the hiring manager is looking for. Not saying no one not from a top school can ever get a job, but if she wants to work with the best, use her entrepreneurial skills (remember that in the OOP), she is going to be better off with a great school, exposure, and alumni connections., compared to a school you have to explain to the hiring manager (if the hiring manager ever actually sees the resume - HR is a giant screen to get around first) Is Rose-Hulman the place for that?
I think this young lady will get good grades and be active in extracurricular anywhere. So why not aim high?