One of the anti-American comments is the fact that ,compared to the rest of the world, Americans are too ignorant of geography. Is there truth to this? Is it really fair to expect a person from Utah to know about the islands in the Caribbean? Is knowing where Iraq or Rwanda or Checnya is really vital to understand the social problems in those countries?
Would it be reasonable for a person to only know about countries that are important to their nations or affect the world rather than obscure countries like Monsterratt?
I think the issue is that it makes americans look ignorant when they don’t know these things. For example, I have had conversations with canadian friends who know every US state and it’s capital. How many americans can say the same with canadian provinces?
My feeling would be that someone that doesn’t know enough about the world to find Iraq on a map doesn’t know enough to discuss their social problems.
It is not the Geography as ‘map identification’ that is the problem that many non-Americans have with Americans, it is the perceived failure of many Americans to acknowledge the 'Geography as ‘different cultures existing in a particular place’ that is the problem.
Not that they just can’t find it on a map, but the perception that they just couldn’t care because the only important Country is the US and that other countries and the residents of other countries are interesting only in so far as they are subjects of tourism, but are somehow intrinsically inferior morally, socially, culturally etc. because they are not Americans.
This does not apply to all Americans, just those who are ignorant of Geography in the round.
Lack of basic political/geographic awareness is indicative of a lack of understanding of the issues involved. Yes, it’s possible to have an adequate understanding of the issues surrounding Chechnya or Rwanda without being able to pinpoint them on a map, but the inability to do so strongly suggests an absence of general knowledge. And I don’t see how it’s possible to understand Middle East issues without knowing where Israel and its neighbours (and enemies) are in relation to one another.
[size]And I can’t resist the double nitpick - Montserrat (sp) isn’t a country, but a British overseas territory.[/size]
I hope you’re not expecting someone here to tell you “Hey, it’s just fine to be ignorant about Geography”.
This ignorance/arrogance 1-2 punch isn’t confined to being towards other countries, either. I grew up in Arkansas, and when it comes up in a conversation with someone from the East Coast or West Coast, I often get a response like “Arkansas…is that like, near Alabama or something?” :mad:
The other day I was a little surprised to hear our administrative officer - 50-ish, lifelong Chicagoan, has worked in this building for <10 years - ask another worker "Which hallway is on the south side?"
I suspect she could use a tad more.
(To paint a clearer picture - our office occupies the top floor of a building in downtown Chicago.
Chicago is built nearly exclusively on a N-S/E-W grid system.
Our floor is a rectangle with the elevators in the center, so there are 4 main hallways - one for each compass point.
The exterior offices on the E and S have unobstructed views.
The person in question has an E-facing office.
The most fleeting glance at a map will reveal that Lake Michigan - that big blue thing? - is directly E of downtown.)
Of course, I remember going to the top of the Sears Tower with one of my sister’s college age friends.
Upon espying Lake Michigan, she asked what river that was.
I got that all the time when I moved from Ohio to Southern California, it seems that many people here think of the world as LA and Everything Else. One I heard more times than I can count was along the lines of “I know someone from St Louis (south carolina,atlanta, etc), That’s close to there so you might know them” Argh!!! The lack of any basic knowledge of even the lower 48 is astonishing to me, let alone world geography.
I once did a stint as a substitute HS teacher. I would fill in for english, history, math and science teachers who were out sick. So I had considerable experience talking to HS students. One think i did note, most were very bright kids, but seemed to lack curiosityabout the outside world. So perhaps either geography is not taught in an interesting way, or the kids are spending too much time with video games or other activities.
Just an observation.
Well then, allow me to be the first! Actually, there is a certain amount of geography that a person should know, in order to not be an ignorant fool. Knowing the 50 states, and where they are generally, knowing the names of major cities (though not necessarily all of the state capitals). Knowing the names of and general locations of most countries is important.
Knowing the exact details or being able to pick countries out of an unmarked map is trivia. Knowing, for instance, that Honduras is north of Nicaragua and south of Honduras is trivia. Knowing that it is in Central America is where I’d put the cutoff of OK vs. Ignorant.
One should understand their local geography, streets, north and south, nearby towns, cities, parks, etc. Beyond your local area, a general idea of locations, along with the ability to read a map gets you what you need.
Well I have to wonder, why should they? I mean if an American’s business is exporting and importing to Canada, then I expect they will have a lot of knowledge about Canadian geography. But why would someone living a retired life in Portsmouth, Ohio really need to know the names of the cities in the Canadian Northwest territories? And simply knowing such trivia is not enough to really promote an understanding of what it would be like to live there or the culture of the people that reside there.
Why are Canadians so concerned with memorizing US state capitals anyway? Does knowing the US state capital of South Dakota come in handy for the average Canadian?
I think people learn about what areas of the world effect them the most. A lot of Americans know exactly where Iraq is and where Bagdad is and how the nation is divided up and which roads in Bagdad are the worst to take. In short they know more about Iraq than Canada because many have friends and family fighting a war there right now.
What do you think is the best way to learn geography? Study maps? I am really very bad with it, but I’d like to learn. I’m just terrible at memorization.
I was merely using that as an example, not as a guideline for what every person should know. It was to show the point that Americans are quite often viewed as isolationist and not caring about what goes on in the world around them.
It’s just one of the things that shows you have an interest in the world around you when you know the most basic facts. Maybe I’m just getting old, but when I was going through school world geography was part of the lesson plan.
My friend was working at a store and was amazed when I took the state quarters out of the change bowl and arranged them spatially by state. I asked him, “Haven’t you ever looked at a map?” and he didn’t seem to understand the connection.
As a geography major, I’m often embarassed by how much geography I DON’T know. But then someone nearby will reveal a geographic lapse of continental proportions and I feel better.
As for local geography, I often forget that unlike me, other people don’t spend most of their work day looking at a map of the county. Getting directions from someone is frustrating because the’re telling me what buildings to go to and which direction to turn whereas I just wish they’d tell me the parcel number. They get pissed because I’ll give directions based on North/south/east/west whereas they want to know left/right. A big disconnect between us.
Related anecdote that just happened to my GF’s mum (in a pretty cosmipolitan city in California, not some small town in the boonies)… She asked what shots she need for her vacation to Turkey, and her DOCTOR (i.e. educated man, not guy who worked behind counter at McDonalds) had NO idea where Turkey was. I thought that was just crazy, that a DOCTOR in a big city would be so ignorant of Geography. Its not like Turkey is an obscure country.
I’m going to have to agree 100% here. I’ve been all over the US, all 48 lower states, many times. I’ve also been all over Ireland a few times, and through the majority of Europe as well. I would say that the knowledge of Geography is almost the same everywhere I’ve been. I’ve gotten good directions in the US and shit directions in Europe. I’ve gotten people who can’t even find themselves on a map in both places.
I think people tend to forget how big the US really is. It would take the same amount of time, or longer, to go either east west across the US as it would across Europe. The same could be said about going north south. The reason that people seem to know more in other contries is because they live near them. Of course someone in Holland is going to know the countries around them, the same as someone living in Maryland is going to know the states around them.
I think the people around here tend to hang out with people who like to memorize a map, among other things, so your point of view gets skewed. Go ask someone in Italy how to get around and you’ll get the same responses as you do in the US.
