Part of the price tag of supercars like Lamborghinis and Ferraris is that they have a pretty limited run. So all the technology and engineering that are put into them have to be recovered in cost over a low number of units. And some of them are made by hand. And there seems to be something of an intentional effort to keep the production numbers down to give an air of exclusivity that you can charge more for - at least that’s the impression I get from hearing that many of those cars have years-long waiting lists.
But let’s say a big manufacturer like Toyota decided they were going to crank out tens or hundreds of thousands of, say, the Ferrari 258. They could recover the engineering costs over all those units, they could design a more automated production process, they can use the full weight of their manufacturing base on the project. And their goal was to sell as many possible, trying to maximize units sold while taking a profit margin similar to most consumer grade cars.
How much of the 258’s $230,000 price tag would they be able to shave off while still maintaining quality?
I’m a body-in-white engineer, but I have no idea how the the super-car bodies and chassis are put together, nor even what the materials are that comprise it. Body and paint shops are the major operations that can benefit the most from automation, so unless the body/chassis costs can come way, way down, mass production may not be that much of a benefit.
Are you willing to swap carbon fiber (super expensive) for steel (dirt cheap)?
If so, then what other compromises are you willing to make? Corinthian “leather” substituted for genuine, soft, deluxe calf-hide? Let’s assume we keep the drivetrain the same. With the increased volume, the vehicles will meet the sales limit for government emissions, CAFE, and so on, meaning an increase in price.
I know, I’m a nerdy engineer who can’t answer without accumulating a lot more data. In the most general sense, though, for any vehicle of the same size and class, built from similar materials, mass production can cost roughly the same within a reasonable range. But exotic sports cars don’t fit into any existing vehicle size, class, and materials, and so it’s difficult to say.
They do… what do you think the Nissan GT-R, or Honda NSX-R is? They are sport cars with performance comparable to a Supercar for roughly 1/3 the price of a “Marque” supercar.
Other brands make similar models… go play Gran Turismo 5 and you’ll discover a few more of them…
BTW Toyota’s Supercar is the Lexus IFA but because they are trying to create “Lexus” as a premium marque they are charging the same as exotic supercar manufacturers… unlike Nissan and Honda who chose to make a model with supercar performance under their own branding and charge less for it.
The Chevrolet Corvette is available for under $50,000 and will get you from 0-60 MPH in about four seconds. You can get more power for more money, up to the ZR-1 ($111K, 0-60 in 3.4 seconds). I don’t know how much the handling improves as you spend more money. The ZR-1 is basically the same engine but with a supercharger, a device that shouldn’t cost more than a few thousand dollars; they’re basically charging an extra $60K because the ZR-1 delivers amazing performance that people are willing to pay that much for.
They sell a lot of Corvettes, but still nowhere near the production volume of, say, the Honda Civic. Get the numbers up, and I’ll wager you could get something like a ZR-1 for under $50K.
Today’s cars… such as the basic Mustang GT… ARE super cars relative to cars of the past.
Heck, numerous typical family sedans are doing things that super cars couldn’t do in the past.
This might help answer the question.
Everything in a super car will get cheaper over time and become available to the masses. What happens is that the initial outlay (investment) in the technology (say ABS or Stability Control) is recovered, and then the technology, paid for by the rich people everyone loves to hate, is made available (now that it is paid for) to the masses.
I have never been behind the wheel of a Corvette, or even been within spitting distance of a Lamorghini, but power alone does not an expensive car make. What makes those really expensive cars so expensive (topping out at the Bugatti Veyron at $1.7 million, as of 2006) isn’t just that they go fast (although they do). They are expensive to build not because the demand isn’t high enough to mass produce them but because that’s how you have to build them for them to be the product they are. If you mass produce them then they couldn’t be the same car.
I agree with CookingWithGas and disagree with this:
So, Toyota is charging an additional $280,000 (the difference in price between a Lexus IFA and a Nissan GTR) just so they can preserve the exclusivity of the Lexus name, and they are pocketing the extra money? :dubious:
Anyway, I’ve often wondered about what the price of a Corolla would be if Toyota manufactured only 1,000 cars. At first I thought that it would have to several hundred thousand dollars just to recover the costs of R&D and the manufacturing plant, but then I realized that making 1,000 cars does not require a plant like this: Toyota Motor Manufacturing, Kentucky.
You’ve fallen for the marketing spiel my friend. Thats exactly what they want you to think. Take a look at the lap times for the Top Gear test track posted by “The Stig”, a trained racing driver.
Notice where the Nissan GT-R, Corvette ZR1 and Audi R8 are? Right up there with super cars that cost 4-10x as much as they do.
If you buy a “marque” supercar you’re paying for the “snob value” and the fancy trim options, not performance. And the build quality is sometimes distressingly poor on some supercars. hand made does not equal quality in some cases, compared to the build quality from a modern mass production line. I’m judging this from hearing the mechanical reports of a fairly rich relative of mine who owns a Maserati Gran Turismo and a Ferrari 458 Italia, and checking out the inside of the cars myself.
If I had enough money to buy a Maserati or a Ferrari I’d buy the GT-R and use the extra $250,000 for an investment property instead.
“Nissan claims the GT-R can reach a top speed of 311 km/h (193 mph),[24] Motor Trend recorded a top speed of 195.0 mph (313.8 km/h).[25] It has been tested to achieve 0-60 mph (97 km/h) times as low as 3.2 seconds with “launch control”[26] and 3.8 seconds without[27]”
Where is your Supercar owner driving where they go more than 311 km on the open road? Even on the german autobahns that’s plenty. Anyway those figures are comparable to a supercar in top speed and acceleration, not Veyron top speed maybe but it’s up there with the Lamborgini’s, Maserati’s and Ferraris.
Nat Geo channel did a show on making a Ferrari, they are pretty much hand made. You have all kinds of options for the interior, they have 20 or so colors you can get for the leather. They show it a few times a year.
That’s what you are paying the extra 200,000 for, but it makes no sense in economies of scale terms. I can buy a Nissan GT-R for $100,000, spend $50,000 on after market tuning and interior and also have it in any color and interior style I want, and I’m still $150,000 ahead.
Of course the Nissan GT-R will get withering stares of disdain at the golf club…
I guess you pay all that extra money because heads turn when you drive a Ferrari vs. a Nissan GT-R. I saw a Lamborghini on the street and I asked my son if he knew how much it cost. He said “More than our house, right?” and he was correct. Now I have a bigger house that costs more than that car, but not by much.
Even if Toyota made a lot more cars for $50,000 how many would they sell? Not many people pay that kind of money for a car even if they are loaded.
When we were visiting my wife’s parents in West Palm Beach Florida we were almost crashed into by an idiot test driving a Lamborghini. I’m assuming it was a test drive because it was only two blocks from the Lamborghini/Exotic dealership, and because he was all over the road.
I wonder what kind of a bond you have to put up to be allowed to take one of those off the lot for a test drive? I’m sure they don’t allow you to walk in off the street. I almost wished he’d crashed into us, just to see the look on his face as he stared at the wreckage. It would have been worth it.
I don’t know that you need to pay to test drive a Lamborghini but you probably need to not show up in jeans and a T shirt. If you have a business card that shows you are a doctor or lawyer you can probably drive one easily.
You can’t simply slap a supercharger without some serious mods on the engine (stronger pistons, better cooling, better cylinder heads, etc), especially when there’s a 50% increase in horsepower (430 vs 638 for the ZR1). It will explode the first time you floor the gas.
Also I bet just the carbon ceramic brakes alone cost an exta 5K.
