How racist is America?

In my experience, the proliferation of visible racism is much greater now than it was 8 years ago, but systematic racism has declined. This is due in no small part to policy to prevent actual discrimination. Being someone who looks at facebook once or twice a week I can say that it is not just Caucasians who are advancing in terms of public vitriol for different social groups due to stereotypes based largely on statistics (%of minority populace/%of minority crime/incarcerations), the vast majority of my non-Caucasian, especially African American, friends are far FAR more into social activism, which means race relations, than they were eight years ago (due similarly to statistics - ingrained prejudice studies etc.)

America is the least racist it has ever been, the discussion of race is just more out in the open, which I think can only eventually lead to positive change.

Yes, absolutely, undeniably. Of course, there are degrees. “Hang 'em from a tree!!” vs. “Deny him/her a job due to the funny sounding name.” How to quantify it? Hell, I don’t know. But it’s there for anyone with open eyes to see.
White men, fill in this blank: I feel (blank) about my daughter falling in love with a Black guy.

A topical view from The New Yorker: Suppression of the Black Vote

I don’t think more than a tiny fraction of Americans are racist. But most Americans are somewhat blind to systemic and institutional racism in the country, whether willfully or not. Our criminal justice system - both at the enforcement level and our courts - generally disadvantage minorities, particularly African-Americans.

I’d say that the US is far more classist than racist, and the unfortunate prevalence poverty in racial minority communities makes a lot of classist behavior seem racist.

The hard part is teasing out what’s what; for example, if a white couple chooses not to send their child to the local 50% black elementary school, is that racism, or is it not wanting their kid steeped in poverty culture, or is it because the school is underperforming? It could be any one or all of those reasons.

People are racist, but they generally do not recognize it because their idea of racist behavior is very narrow.

The typical racist does not think they hate one ethnic group. They’re not physically attacking people, not spitting on them, and so they conclude they’re not racist.

That same individual will not hesitate to deny someone a job or an apartment based on their ethnicity. They won’t hesitate to say that the only reason ‘that kind’ of person got ahead is because of affirmative action that denied one of their ‘own kind’ a job – even if the person is a Nobel-level genius. They won’t recognize the systematic challenges that people of the other ethnicity face that makes life a challenge for an entire class of people.

FWIW: I find the question impossible to answer for a number of reasons, beginning with using the singular America rather than Americans, but even using the plural that’s a lot of people to talk about using just one word about anything, from racism to religious preferences, whether one is a vegan or eats meat, likes to watch sports or can’t watch a sporting event for beer (me).

While I understand that whether one cares for people of other races is of far greater moral significance big picture-wise than whether one prefers vanilla to strawberry ice cream, there are degrees and gradations of racism, from the “not my cup of tea” kind to the more extreme"not in my neighborhood" sort to the ultimate and extreme “lynch 'em” or “deport 'em” variety.

My sense is that racism, however one chooses to define it (whether to include ethnic groups rather than only non-Caucasians), is widespread. As others have mentioned on this thread, and I agree, we are as a species rather “group coded”, and I find what strikes me as the lazy tossing around of words like xenophobia ludicrous, as we are in my opinion as coded to react suspiciously, oftentimes startlingly, to anything foreign, whether it’s mouse in one’s kitchen, a possum living under one’s front porch or a new neighbor or co-worker of a different race or from another culture.

To get on my high horse for a spell: I don’t think that prejudices, racism, the misunderstanding and sometimes the refusal TO UNDERSTAND other kinds of people from oneself is something that we can change to a one size fits all morality and make it stick for all Americans, let alone human beings. Nor do I think that this is desirable.

We are all different as to how we respond to different things, and this includes, needless to say, other people. In my opinion we’d be wiser to be broader and more realistic when we get moralistic about racial matters, stress justice and respect for the rights and beliefs of others, the largeness of the world and, equally important, the largeness of ourselves, as individuals, by which I mean our basic moodiness, our ambivalence, our willingness to grow and change, and in many cases a refusal to do so. This is the human condition. I see no reason why we cannot grow and improve as a society and ultimately a species and retain our individual aversions, quirks, even prejudices regarding other kinds of people, and still, at the end of the day, retain our respect for the rights of all human beings.

End of sermon. To return to the original question: yes, racism is very widespread in our society, and it’s hugely aggravated by confusion, an unwillingness to view ourselves realistically, and stop using words like hate to describe the way some people are ill-disposed to others on account of their racial background. We’re so stuck, so hung up on this issue; and the words we use to describe our problems are, in my humble opinion, themselves a huge part of the problem.

Here is a perfect example of a racist act committed by someone who doesn’t recognize they are racist.

I agree. Obama’s presidency and the recent election have resulted in a lot of rocks being kicked over and there are a lot of gross scuttling things about. But they were always there, and now that they’re out in the open we can stomp them more easily.

Right now? Oogy, but that’s because she’s eight. When she’s dating age I pledge to hate black boys who want to date my daughter exactly the same amount as white boys who want to date my daughter.

Asking about ‘America’ tends to lead to comparison to other countries. But systemic race issues have a lot to do with history. The ‘race’ problem in the US has been and still is more intense as it relates to people of African descent than anyone else, and Canadians and Europeans never had race based slavery in their own countries. Big historical difference, not that makes anyone automatically morally superior/inferior, just a big difference.

Otherwise IMO on the systemic level a lot of talk of racism in the US is just politicking, a newer form of the kind of ethnic politics by which Irish, Italians would lobby locally for their interests. Now it’s more national, in terms of eg. ‘race’ preferences for Hispanics, or the immigration issue. But IMO the idea of a ‘white society’ systemically biased against everyone who isn’t ‘white’, while it contains some element of truth historically, is a lot less valid than the idea of a society historically systemically biased against blacks. The historical baggage of past racism isn’t as heavy for groups most of whose members are recent comers (Hispanics and Asians), and OTOH again there was serious bias against white groups (Irish, Italians, etc). In case of Africans it was worse than any other group except arguably the much smaller Native group, and most people of African descent in the US have deep roots here, compared to a small % of Asians or Hispanics who trace much of their heritage to people badly abused in the US in 19th or early 20th century.

And IME mainly in major urban area’s and as middle class, there really isn’t a monolithic ‘race problem’ between/among whites, Hispanics and Asians in the US. OK at least according to what you see on TV there is one at the bottom of society, say in prisons. But in everyday middle class life, not such a deep problem IME. But vis a vis blacks, it’s very real top to bottom of society. That’s not ascribing ‘blame’. It’s just that besides navel gazing to define ‘what racism really is’, the idea that it’s some monolithic issue between white and non-white is manly inaccurate in the US IMO.

I guess it is. I mean … how can she not see that.

Fwiw, you wouldn’t hear or see that comment in my part of the world after the early-mid 80s.

No, it really isn’t. It’s an example of blatant racism that almost anyone would recognize.

You need a much more subtle example of racism.

Really? People are just fine with calling white people - particularly men - apes when they’re big. And they’re fine with NCOs calling troopers apes. And no one complains when the verb ‘aping’ is used.

Sure it’s insulting, and meant to be. But racist? No.

Previous discussion here with a variety of viewpoints.

It’s impossible to distinguish without serious indicators of intent, which I don’t believe were sufficiently demonstrated in this case.

As to the OP, yes the US is very badly racist, but not in the way most people think. It took a while for me to come to terms with it, but we Americans are batshit insane when it comes to race. We’re virtually incapable of even describing another human being without defaulting to “that tall mexican guy” or “the white girl next to the short black guy.” It’s partially because we tend to use race, rather than nationality, as one of our chief identifiers. That’s reinforced by just about every piece of media that comes out of the States. It’s also because we reinforce that by constantly harping on it. Standardized test? Doesn’t care where you came from, what educational or disciplinary procedures shaped your formative years, what your parents income or professional background was… nope, it cares what color your great-great-great-great-great granpa was… and we’re crazy enough to just go with it. Business as usual.

Unfortunately, the brain is idiotic. Evolution is effective and all, but it doesn’t produce “perfection.” Once you have separation of that sort, it becomes impossible to prevent bias from having overwhelming influence. We get categorization errors left and right, along with all sorts of fallacies and such… and it’s intrinsic to our brains, so while you can fight against it you cannot eliminate it.

I realized it speaking with a friend from a far less racist country, when they couldn’t understand why I’d always use a race rather than a more accurate descriptor (“that tall, olive skinned straight haired man with the anglican nose” vs “that tall mexican”). I tried feebly to say it’s a summarization of characteristics, but lets be honest: I’ve known “short, pale skinned blonde haired women with an upturned nose” - hardly a stereotypical Mexican - who was 110% Mexican. It stuck with me and got me to soul searching.

MANY of America’s racial issues stem from this automatic categorization. Countries that form identities separate from racial characteristics tend to not have racial problems.

I think we are more. People have had to listen to a black president give orders for 8 years, which would rile up some latent racist tendencies in some people.

I’d say overall the trajectory of racism is improving. Racism that would be acceptable in the north 100 years ago is probably frowned upon in the south in 2016 (as a guess).

Fox news treating the Bundy clan as heroes for standing up to the police, then calling on the police to be more authoritarian when dealing with black people.

Conservative whites calling for government surveillance of Muslims because muslims are sometimes involved in terrorism, while ignoring the fact that white right wingers are considered by law enforcement to be the biggest terrorism threat in the US.

I’m a white from South Africa. I grew up during the apartheid years, and lived through all the apartheid issues.

I also lived and worked in the United States for 5 years from 2000-2005, a lot of that time in the southern states.

I can tell you that racism is far worse in America than in South Africa. There is a level of bitterness and hatred that I’ve never seen here. However bad things were in apartheid South Africa, on an individual level people of different races always tended to get along reasonably in daily life, and they still do.

They criticize Michelle Obama for wearing the wrong clothes, being an authoritarian for wanting kids to eat vegetables, or disgracing the office by showing off her shoulders. They suddenly turn into third wave feminists when someone brings up Melania’s nudes.

Several Obama scandals which read like Onion stories, such as mustard-gate, the coffee salute, or the terrorist fist jab. More partisan than racist, perhaps, but the constant undertone of the fever swamps of conservative rhetoric about Obama was that he was alien to American culture and not legitimate. Not one of us.

The problem with charges of “racism” is that it’s a broad swipe and it often fails to account for degrees of racism. I think we’ve been conditioned as a society to rebuke racism, which is a good thing, but we’ve been programmed to the point where we cannot have an honest discussion about what racism is, and the degree to which we are ‘racist’, which is counter-productive.

I don’t think the majority of people who voted for Trump are angry bigots. Some are, but not all. But I do think that there is a combination of bigotry and, more so, what I term as ‘racial insecurity’, which is anxiety over the loss of status as a majority. Most Trump supporters don’t have a conscious dislike of minorities, but they’re uncomfortable with the idea that this may no longer be an Anglo-American society. To that extent, there’s a lot of “racism” in this country, and will be for a long time, probably until whites get more comfortable knowing that they’re not a majority and can accept living in a truly pluralistic society.

There is no question at all that this campaign was about racial insecurity. The proof is in the fact that Donald Trump, a New Yorker with a well-documented history of conduct and statements that fly in the face of Evangelical Christianity, won the Deep South over Ted Cruz. He didn’t just win some of Dixie - he won ALL of Dixie. Over someone who in past years would have probably swept that region himself. What those primary results told me was that voters had something else on their minds other than God. It was the preservation of ‘their’ society.

The problem with the question “How racist is America” is that it never asks the three most important words in the English language.

COMPARED TO WHAT?