I don't know where to live.

In My Humble Opinion
1

I’ve been giving this a lot of thought recently. While it may have to do with my upbringing in the South of the US, it could be due to other factors alltogether. As you may know I’ve spent a considerable amount of time in Europe in the past three years and have gotten to know alot about the European way of life. I’ve met many friends and seen a lot about how the culture here is completely different. When I left to go to Germany in May of last year, I didn’t really know for how long I would be staying as there was a possibility of graduating from overseas. However, after realizing how stressful and difficult this would be, I have decided to go back to my university in America.

I’ll sidetrack a little here to explain how much I hate my university back home. It is a SEC school with a very high percentage of Greek involvement. When you go to bars, etc a large percentage of people 80 are in a fraternity/sorority or are highly involved with such people. My problem is that, I tried to fit in with such groups when I initially arrived as a freshman, and I did indeed get into a Fraternity, but I got into what I believed at the time to be a very bad one. My “friends” at that time weren’t really there for me either, so I basically had an awful social life. This was completely my fault, I suppose. But, do I really have to give an explanation here why I don’t like the Frat/Sorority scene? I would rather keep my identity secret, but it is a very bad situation on my campus. Girls are mainly interested in what Fraternity guys are in etc. Now I’ll admit that there are probably people who aren’t inclined to be complete assholes or bitches, but the sad truth is that they aren’t so numerous, and I don’t really have so much in common with them I suppose. I can’t tell you how sick of seeing these Freshmen driving around in their brand new Chevrolet Tahoes or GMC Yukons who think they are the shit. Basically its a product of spoiled children, immaturity, and the first opportunity to get away from athority to some extent. I could get along with the “other crowds” but I don’t feel like I should be in a minority. I just really hate people that are very superficial. I just don’t want to be fake. I hate it if I wear clothes that are slightly different I get stared at, etc. In any case, conformity is extreme on this campus and anyone that goes against it is harshly ridiculed. Also I am not really in favor of the socially competitive attitude that people have there. Not only do I have to have the coolest friends/have the most and cutest girls/and be the most popular, I have to try others from trying as well. Now I won’t lie there are the smarter people, who are different, but then again they are held into place by others waiting for them to screw up.

Its also very conservative, which also is part of the reason I don’t think highly of Southern conservatives. Its not conservativsm based on some sort of rational thought process, but rather some sort of weird emotional thing.

So that’s a good explanation of life at my university. I hope I did a good enough job so that might ring a few bells with some of you folks there.

My life in Europe has always been very good, in comparison. I like most of the people I met here. My roomates in Spain were very nice to me and sort of forced me to be their friends :cool: They always tell me that I can visit whenever I want and I plan on doing it for the second time this Spring. All of my ERASMUS friends that I met in Spain are all still close as well. Some of the stark contrasts that I found and liked.

More liberal
Realistic attitude towards sex and relationships (ok for women to approach men)
Less focused on money and job success
More focused on fun and pleasure
Its not important to have a cool car/clothes
Its not terribly important how much money you make

These are just some of the important things I noticed but mainly people in Europe to me seem to be less interested in superficial things. At least when I say that I mean the people I saw and talked to which could be a strange crowd because they were all university students.

But I have noticed that there was very little social “competition.” Not so many people strive to be the most popular. As far as I can tell, everyone just wants to go out and have fun. Even though you have an aquaintance who is in another circle of friends, you don’t instinctivly bash them to try to raise your status. Much more laid back in my opinion. If you like a girl, just go talk to her without having to worry if she cares about (my friends, my car, my clothes, what her friends will think about such superficialities). People seem to make friends very easily here as well.
<<Sidenote here: I have, after my freshman year in college, noticed that my friends back home were still cool guys to hang out with and weren’t so snobby about such things. However I can’t really have much in common with them as they are into heavy drugs and are basically going the wrong way with their lives>>

NOW I will get on the the main point of my problem. I have never been to other parts of the country very much. Sure I have met a few people from other parts of the country, but I am not so sure about if I would like those parts either. A couple of people I know from California really irritate me. My exgirlfriend (who was German) stayed with her parents for a few months. During this time she was probably subjected to the worst parts of American culture you could get. This was in northern california btw. For example, when they went out to eat they would go to Applebees instead of something with a little more culture. Either that or fastfood. Now the daughter talks about Germany in the most horrible way. I will be the first to admit that Germany isn’t so hot in some ways, but to really compare the food is a little silly, especially if you think a nice meal is going to a chain restaurant. She would always talk down to me because I was from the south as well. Honestly I don’t need that kind of shit and it happens too much in all of America as well. But I did really make fun of her about Arnold! She was so upset.

I also have known some people who lived in NYC and such. They were some okay people. I didn’t really like them so much either, however. I noticed a couple of groups. There is the Fratboy like group that is usually EXTREMELY rich in NYC. The other is the sort of “Alternative Subculture” that gets on my nerves as well. The people in this sort of Alternative culture are nice and seem to be genuine enough, but there seems to be this sort of self-serving pleasure they recieve for being avant-guarde. I am sorry if anyone here would claim to be a part of that group, but I think its true. It seems like they should just be wearing a sign that says “I’m different”

These are just my opinions and I in no way try to validate them beyond what I have written here. If you think I am wrong then please inform me. That’s why I am writing the thread, I want to know what parts of America I should consider and why.

Basically I’m down on America at the moment because the social life there has always been very tense and competitive in my opinion and there are so many entry fees (money, popularity, etc.) But in some way, I’ll never be able to get rid of my desire to be happy in America because its my home country. I haven’t been able to find my niche so far (the one that I have found in Europe) but I hope maybe some people would show me.

Having said that, if I decide to go to live in America, it would probably be NYC. I think that it would have the best chance of having something to offer me. I also would like to try Miami because of the whole latin thing that I dig from my time in Spain, but I think Miami could be a very superficial place. I am just looking for a place where its normal to be unsuperficial.

But I’ll graduate in either May 2005 or December 2004, and after that I’ll look for work. I have German, and Spanish Language skills and a degree in International Studies, and possibly German Spanish and Economics (depending on how much I want to work) I’ll probably go somewhere to work for a couple of years just to have some fun, but I don’t know where. That’s part of the reason I am asking about America because I don’t really know where I would like to go.

What’s the deal with Austin, TX btw?

2

Although I dont know where you should live, my sister was/is in an international program and when she returned to her home university from being oversees she decided to join an international dorm at her uni so that she could hang out with the folks from the other side of the pond.

3

If you can manage a road trip across the U.S., that might help. Many cities have an international flavor, if that’s what makes you comfortable. SF and DC come to mind.

4

Just MHO, but I’d say give living in Europe a shot if you can support yourself. (What I mean by that is that AFAIK it’s more or less a universal requirement to have a work permit to be able to work, and also AFAIK an employer has to apply for the permit, you can’t do it yourself. In other words, you basically have to have a job lined up ahead of time, which means your best shot might be to get hired by a U.S. company and see if they’ll send you to Europe. Apologies if you already know this.)

I’ve been in Europe for 10 years now (the first 2 1/2 in Brussels and since then in London), and while I still figure I’ll move back to the U.S. permanently at some point, I’m in no hurry whatsoever to do so. FWIW, I grew up in Washington, D.C., and also went to an SEC school (clue: it’s in central Tennessee), so my background may not be all that different from yours.

5

In my town of Santa Cruz,CA. we have a University here that just might be interesting to you. The campus is one of the most beautiful in the state and they certianly are liberal and would probably meet your criteria nicely.Its a great place to live but fairly expensive.

6

I’d say look around and find a different college. They’re not all the same. Mine had hardly any Greeks and no status-worries about popularity, money, careers, or clothing–rather the opposite. (I had one friend who wore an incredibly ratty old bathrobe and no shoes for a semester, for example.) But my college was perhaps a little extreme.

Or stay in Europe, if you like that better.

And, may I say, as a happy resident of Northern CA, that it’s one of the more down-to-earth areas to live in I know. Feel free not to move here, though; we like the low population, and it’s getting less low by the day.

I’m not quite sure why you feel you shouldn’t have to be in a minority. What exactly is wrong with being in a minority? Most people with some principles or brains are, sooner or later.

7

My daugher did a year’s exchange in Istanbul, and when she returned back to the States, she had a difficult time with adjusting to “Americans”. She still longs to return to Istanbul, and is making plans to return in the near future.

My advice would be to look into living abroad if that’s an option. You’ll always be an American citizen (barring something bizzare), and can always return Stateside. Take advantage of it while you can.

8

I don’t think there is anyplace that meets all your qualifications, especially #2.

There is a direct correlation between a city’s “liberalness” and the cost of living. Consider the most liberal cities in the United States; Berkeley, Califoirnia; Boulder, Colorado, and Santa Fe, New Mexico. There are a few exceptions, though – Chapel Hill, North Carolina and Lawrence, Kansas come to mind. The cost of housing in Austin isn’t too bad, either. All those cheap liberal cities, though, are islands in a conservative sea.

Less focused on money and job success: probably want someplace with a Latin orientation, where people work to live instead of live to work. Cities that have a large percentage of overachievers and Type A-types, like New York and Denver, probably aren’t for you.

Cool car/clothes: not so much important, but rather an indicator of success, and really important in Type-A cities.

Income: again, I found folks more judgemental in Type-A cities.

For larger cities that might offer some of what you’re looking for … I’ll say Portland, Oregon would be my first choice, with Austin, Texas coming in a distant second. Portland has a very earthy population, the cost of living is reasonable, and the city is perhaps one of the best planned in the United States; great public transit, vibrant pedestrian districts, and a very active downtown. Good beer and Powell’s Books are icing on the cake. When I was stranded in Austin for a few days, I was probably approached by more women than in any other place I’ve ever visited or lived.

Smaller cities … Santa Fe, New Mexico if you can afford it. Fort Collins, Colorado … likewise, but more family-oriented and a bit Type A because of its proximity to Denver; it’s basically like Boulder before Boulder became too cool. Las Cruces, New Mexico if you’re looking for diversity and authenticity a’plenty; it’s easy on the eyes, you’ll have cowboys and Wiccans living side-by-side, and there’s quite a few geeks thanks to WSMR and NMSU, but there really isn’t much urbanity there. Maybe Ithaca, New York; Eugene, Oregon; Bend, Oregon or Ann Arbor, Michigan?