I got fired...

I lost my job last night. Shift boss made some vague comments about not meeting the service standards and that there were some complaints about me. Nillandra in Human Resources knew what they were.

I was stunned- nobody had said anything to me that I was doing anything wrong, I had always followed policies and procedures, was friendly with the customers, yada yada

So, I called Nillandra in Human Resources. Seems I have a negative attitude. A dealer complained that I had made a sarcastic remark to him on the game (I hadn’t). A couple of supervisors claimed that I would get upset if they corrected something I did (not true). Just a couple of very minor incidents and kind of vague general stuff that they said indicated I had a negative attitude. Moi?

Oh, did I mention that I was the only woman craps dealer on the shift? That boxmen would come down on me for problems that were caused by the male dealers basically ignoring me when I was trying to get information I needed to do my job, (like who does this bet belong to. Um, whose bet is this? Hello, whose bet is this?) The boxman would claim I wasn’t paying attention. That my coworkers were generally very sarcastic toward me? That the whole environment seems to be very sexist? That male dealers would talk back and smartmouth the boxmen and get away with it, while I always tried to be cooperative and do what was asked of me?

I’m pissed. I never caused trouble, never made waves (well, I did make one wave, but they were trying to take money out of my pocket.) I always did my job to the best of my ability, was good and obedient, and got fired, when my male co-workers, most of whom have heavy-duty attitudes get to keep theirs.

What gives here?

Did you like your job?

Only female on the shift and they fired you? Sounds like you could have a good sexual discrimination suit on your hands.

I’m inclined to agree with Zyada. It does sound like your gender was part of the problem. BUT…we only have your point of view. Maybe you really did have a negative attitude or something. But I smell a rat. Usually when an employer is vague about WHY they are firing you, it’s because they don’t have a good reason. Maybe sexism is exactly what it is. Do you have any friends still working there who might’ve heard or seen someone making sexist comments about you? Look into it.

Good luck finding a new job.

I know it’s easy to say and not so easy when you are the one in the situation but my first advice is to not take it personally. Anybody who’s any good has been fired several times and it is no big deal. You are not worth more or less because of that. try to look forward rather than sulk.

Having said that… try to be objective, difficult as it may be. If other people think you have an attitude, then that’s what they perceive and you need to correct that. It serves no purpose to say they are wrong.

Regarding the sexism part, unless you provide some proof I think is bunk and I think suing etc would be a way of wasting a part of your life. You have better things to do.

They hired you and they can fire you for any or no reason just as you can quit for any or no reason. They may have made a mistake and lost a valuable employee. So what? You could have quit for the wrong reason too. Such is life. My advice is to be positive and move on.

I’ve been fired from several jobs and it was never easy that day but soon I was on my way again and never looked back. I never thought of trying to force them to rehire me. I know I would not want to work for someone who doesn’t want me. If you are worth anything you can get a job with people who actually want you.

I often get fired. It just shows you’ve got more than they can handle, which means you won’t miss them.

Every job I’ve had has been beneath me. None of them would impress anyone on a reseme. So good riddance. Freedom is better than fear. Staying, hoping to fit in later is fear.
If you push the envelope they put you in and it stretches, you’ve got a good job. If it tears, it wasn’t the job for you.

Truly sucks, agisophia. Not only cause the way it was done, but because you didn’t see it coming.

Quite beyond the gender issues, you have a genuine case because 1. you were not told the problem in advance and 2. you were not given standards to meet and 3. you were not given a chance to rectify the problem and meet those standards.

Real life? It’s a pit place to work and you’re probably better off out of it. You could push the issue, but even if you win–you lose. Putz employers pushed into ethical treatment remain morph into sullen, resentful putzes.

Will you have an exit interview? ASK stuff; what they expected, what you could/should have done better. You might learn something valuable, and if nothing else it’ll make 'em sweat razor blades.

If not, shrug and go on.

Veb

Um, no. Too many people with attitudes.

TVeblen-

Yes, I will have an exit interview. But the minimal information that I posted was all I could drag out of the Human Resources chick in the space of a half hour phone conversation. Nothing more specific than that.

Sailor- I’ve been in this business for a little over two years, and no-one has ever told me they had a problem with my attitude. I think the problem was the culture of this particular casino. Like I said, a lot of people with attitudes.

Human resources(what happened to personnel depts?)are not going to say much to you as that will give you time to make good responses at the exit interview.

I would look at the company in terms of staff turnover and average age of staff, it usually gives a clue how good an employer is, I also look in the car park - if everyone drives wrecks I leave it alone - people usually want to drive the best car that they can afford to be practical.

casdave, how right your are. Like I said, it took me a half hour to get the minimal info I did get, and I had a good response for each accusation.

The incident with the sarcastic remark, I had said something good-naturedly to a co-worker, and he (possibly deliberately) took it the wrong way.

I also told her that it simply was not true that I got upset when a supervisor would correct something I did, or gave constructive criticism.

Basically, they took a couple of very minor non-incidents, put a creative spin on them and blew them all out of proportion as an excuse to fire me. I have always been a good concientious worker, and have always made an effort to get along with my co-workers, even the ones who didn’t seem to want to get along with me.

Turnover there isn’t that high, although in the past couple of months, they have had a lot of people leave to go work at the new Aladdin- I guess one of the shift bosses went and took a lot of dealers with him.

I told my chiropractor today about losing my job, and she told me that she knows a lot of people who work for the company that owns the casino, and they all say there is a really negative corporate culture there. Also, I worked there all of a month, which really isn’t enough time to adapt to a new job with a different culture from the place I used to work. It also seemed that a really high percentage of the dealers there were very unpleasant people to work with.

Me, I’m generally fairly happy-go-lucky, with a slightly warped sense of humor, and I stay in the business because I genuinely enjoy dealing, I find the job itself is fun, and my main mission is to have a good time doing what I do. Oh, and make some money while I’m at it.

Sorry to hear you lost your job. Are you going to try for another dealer job, or will being fired from that one make it difficult? I think TVeblen had a lot of good points, and so did some of the other people, and I don’t (from the posts of yours I’ve read) see you as someone who would sulk, and I don’t think you’re doing that here.

Is there a Human Rights type of agency there you could call to ask about the possibility of a suit?

I hope you aren’t out of a job too long, and everything goes well for you. Best wishes. :slight_smile:

Sorry to here about your situation. {{{{agisofia}}}}}

This does sound actionable, for the reasons TVeblen listed. “Quite beyond the gender issues, you have a genuine case because 1. you were not told the problem in advance and 2. you were not given standards to meet and 3. you were not given a chance to rectify the problem and meet those standards.”
Sounds like wrongful termination to me. In your exit interview, get copies of everything, …complaints, reviews, the whole file. Then visit an attorney.
Screw the bastards!

Playing devils advocate here re: “you’ve got a case”. First you need to check some things out. Is your state a right-to-work state? Is your position unionized? are you a new employee on probation?

All those questions about “did they tell you about a problem and give you time to do corrective action” make sense ONLY if you don’t work in a unionized environment, were NOT a new employee on probation and do not live in a right to work state.

In a “right to work state”, unless you are governed by a union contract or a personnel policy from the company that says otherwise, an employer can discharge you at any time ** without ** stating a reason. Now, if you file for unemployment benefits, the employer must show sufficient cause for firing to the UE administration before or the employee can collect unemployment.

you don’t state how long you were working there. If it was only a short time, you may still have been on new employee probation (a frequent thing). If you were, employers can let you go for something as vague as “things aren’t working out”.

Now. what to do? well, you may check in with your local Civil Rights office (of your state government) to see if there was a sexual basis (the fact that you were the only female is suspicious, but not proof). File for unemployment compensation. You are more likely to get a specific reason stated.

You mentioned one customer complaint but said “it wasn’t true”. Are you saying the customer DIDN’T complain? or that you weren’t sarcastic? If the former, then something is fishy. If the later, then that’s a problem. If you’re working in customer service and a customer says you were rude, sarcastic whatever, the fact you didn’t INTEND to be rude sarcastic or whatever is not necessarily germane to the issue. Whatever you said or did apparently was open to that interpretation to the customer. You’re better off looking at that incident and seeing if you MAY have said something that could have been misinterpreted and taking the tactic of "I’m sorry that you felt I was being… "

And, as a general rule of thumb, discussions of how badly other employees act is not relevant to a discussion about what your behavior is. I know it seems unfair (they act worse with the bit bosses than I do), but if I’m talking to an employee about their conduct, I will NOT entertain comments about “yea, but Joe acts worse”.

Make this a learning experience no matter what the outcome is. New employees actions will always be looked at more closely than some one who has demonstrated a long history. It is my belief that the general “not getting along with others” is the second most reason for folks getting fired. Employers are generally willing to train at tasks, but if they have complaints from coworkers, customers, supervisors etc. nah. And they have told you they’ve had complaints from customers and supervisors. You deny them. But, again, are you saying the person didn’t complain or were incorrect?

When I teach folks how to get along with supervisors, I tell them that, as a supervisor, I expect to need to tell people (at least once) how to do something right. HOW they react is important to me. If they get defensive and start saying stuff like “well, this is how I’ve always done it” or “But this is a better way” or “well, no one TOLD me to do it that way”, I find it annoying and not particularly helpful. If they over compensate with a 10 minute apology, I’m also not happy. What I’m looking for (and most supervisors) is for you to say “Ok, will do” and maybe “thanks” For some one to make what should be a 2 minute exchange into a long drawn out defense of what they were doing (at the point when I’m pretty much telling them to NOT do that) is not only pointless, but counter productive, and YES, falls into the case of “not taking correction well”

In the exit interview, try and find out as much as possible about how they expected you to handle things. Please understand that I’m sympathetic to you in this situation. I’m not trying to say that you did any of the above actions. Those were just examples of things I’ve seen folks do that got them fired. I’m just trying to offer some courses of action that will be of benefit to you in the future. The fact that these people apparently found you difficult to work with does NOT mean that you’re a bad person or even in general “difficult to work with”. Hopefully, you’ll be able to learn from this and prosper in the future. Best of luck to you.

Since you only worked there a month, I’m assuming it was under a probationary period and they had every right to let you go - I don’t think you have a lawsuit.

But I’m sorry you have to go through the hassle of looking for another job! I hope you find one that’s perfect for you.

Originally posted by wring-

It wasn’t a customer that complained, it was another dealer, and, no I wasn’t sarcastic. It was essentially a baseless complaint.

This was really the only specific thing that they said was a problem. The supervisors saying I got upset if I was corrected or given constructive criticism was simply not true. I have always welcomed any advice people can give me on how to improve my job performance.

Nevada is a right to work state, dealers are not represented by any union, and I was 30 days into a 90 day probationary period. In other words, I basically have no recourse.

Anyhoo, my exit interview is tomorrow, I hope that maybe I can get more specific information then.

Hmmmm. I’ve been told plenty of times I had a negative attitude, but I think that’s just cause I don’t put up with crap and speak my mind, but I still do my job. I’ve found that around here that constitutes a “negative attitude”.

ok, this is what I was getting at. In your eyes you said nothing wrong, but the other dealer complained. In your eyes, you welcome advice about improving your job performance but the supervisors report that you “got upset”.

These aren’t necessarily “untrue” or “baseless”. They are other people’s reactions and assessments of what you said and how you said it.

For example: At my job, I’m authorized to make store charges to the company. One time, I’d gone through the checkout, only to find out that our charge wasn’t allowed that day and the big boss had neglected to tell me. I called MY supervisor, furious that I’d been put in that position. SHE called the big boss and told him “she’s upset”. To this day, the big boss tells the story of me “crying” at the store. Words have plural meanings and especially when you cross cultural age, and gender lines.

So, it’s in your best interest here to try and figure out what you said that could have lent itself to these other opinions. People * generally * don’t take insults out of nothing. Humor, especially, can be misunderstood. There’s a thread on these boards where one member got riled about some one’s comment to her, and asked “should I take offense” and the consensus, was, to other people, that no, the person wasn’t trying to be a jerk. misunderstandings happen all the time.

So it seems at least possible that people were misunderstanding what you meant.

I got fired from a job about 12 years ago. The funny part is that not 2 weeks before getting canned, I asked my boss, informally, how I was doing (I had been there about 8 months). She said everything was fine. Then I get fired.

It hurt like hell! Don’t let anyone tell you it doesn’t. I didn’t particularly like the job, and was actually thinking about getting another one. Yep, it was my pride. And the fact that they lied to me. To this day, I cannot speak to anyone that worked there. I truly don’t think I will ever get over it. I did think about suing them (it was a university, and my boss broke just about ever personnel rule). But I didn’t want the damn job anyway.

However, there was a silver lining. Because I got fired, I was able to take what was to me at that point, my “dream” job. I loved that job, and because I had it, it put in me a position to meet my husband. (I eventually left that job for good reasons, and on good terms).

So yeah, feel crappy about getting fired. Hold a grudge. But be aware that better things are ahead.

There’s something about the specter of this big, strapping, almost six-foot, two hundred pound man going to a supervisor, pointing to five-foot two, one hundred thirty-five pound little me and saying, “She said mean things to me and hurt my feelings”…

It almost seems like a parody of some of the frivolous sexual harassment complaints filed by women against their male co-workers.

Now, mind you, this guy is a seasoned dealer who has never hesitated to let me know, loudly and in an embarrassing manner, if I did something on the game that he didn’t approve of, like coming back from break only one minute early, when he thought he was entitled to an extra three minutes…

I tell this guy, in a very good-natured and friendly way, to just add a zero to get the correct payoff on a bet that he was stuck on, and he goes whining to a supervisor. I think I probably bruised his fragile little ego, because he thinks he is The God Of All Dice Dealers, and I knew the payoff on a bet that he didn’t.

Also, the whole environment was very tense, with dealers not booking proposition bets when I was on stick, then not answering when I asked, repeatedly what a bet was, and having insult added to injury by a boxman accusing me of not paying attention to the game. Also, some of them tried to make it appear that I was not booking bets properly by deliberately ignoring me when I would tell them what a bet was, and asking the players, talking over me in the process.

And sarcastic remarks flew freely, not always directed at me, frequently directed at supervisors and sometimes even players. And I don’t mean good-natured teasing, either. I’m talking very nasty tones of voice. So basically I’m talking about someone who can’t take what they dish out. I never once heard a supervisor say anything to another dealer about being rude or uncooperative.Anyway, I have always avoided making insulting comments to someone who I’m supposed to be working as part of a team with.

Also, about the supervisors claiming I would get upset when I was corrected, I was not told of anything specific that I might have done or said that would lead them to mistakenly believe this. And believe me, I did ask. The human resources twit just kept saying, “Oh, some things that led them to think you have a negative attitude.” In other words, one more trip around the circle. If they can’t tell me anything in particular that I said or did to make them think I was upset, I have to assume that this was cut from whole cloth. A complete fabrication.

Anyhoo, the dice pit is an all-boys club again. I hope they’re all very happy together.

If you had anyone in that hole to corroborate what you just posted, you would have an excellent case for sexual harassment, if your state has the qualifications listed in wring’s post when she played devil’s advocate.

I don’t know how you stood it for as long as you did.