I Hate Car Shops!

The BBQ Pit
1

I have to scream and yell about this.

My car got a flat tire last week, and today I finally had the time to take it in to get it replaced. While I was there, I decided it would be a good idea to get the alignment and brakes done.

I was on a bit of a tight budget this time around, so I got some pretty cheap tires, and the alignment wasn’t too expensive. I tell the con artist behind the desk that I also need my front brakes replaced… he tells me they’ll take a look when they’re putting on the tires and tell me how much it will be.

So, at this point I’m feeling pretty good about myself, I saved some money on tires, I’m finally getting the alignment done, and I figre the brakes will cost maybe $50-100, depending. They have a gigantic sign on their front window that says BRAKES SHOES AND PADS! $29.99!.

I’ve been around the block a few times, I know that the $29.99 won’t include everything, but still, I figure that estimating $100 tops is a pretty safe bet for a simple replacement of my front brakes.

So after I’m sitting around waiting for about 2 1/2 hrs, they tell me that… wait for it… the brakes are going to run me $280!!!

WHAT? Ok, I’ve had some jobs in the past that were really a lot harder than they look, so I try not to pass judgement on people when things seem to not be worth the money I have to pay for them. But give me a break! First off, the parts themselves apparently cost $80… they had to use “authentic mazda parts” or they’d squeak or something. But how hard is it to put some f’ing brakes on a car for christ’s sake??? I’ve seen it done before, I’ve done it before myself, but I don’t have a garage or a decent enough jack that I can use, so I figure there’s no harm done in paying a little extra to have it taken care of when I buy new tires/etc. But jesus christ, people, it’s not fucking rocket science! Sure, I’m willing to pay a few bucks extra if it means feeling a little more confident that my car will stop when I want it to, but $280 for BRAKES? ARGH!

So at this point, what am I going to say? No, put my old, unsafe brakes back on the car so that I can wait until next weekend to try and go to another place that will try and rip me off? I mean, by the time they’re going to have my car done, it’s like 6pm, and I’m booked tomorrow. I can’t really drive the thing around for another week and feel safe. I like to KNOW my car is going to stop when I hit the pedal.

I should have known better, but god it pisses me off.

Oh, and then after they do everything, they want to charge me another $120 to REPLACE MY POWER STEERING FLUID? Now COME ON guys, that can’t be nearly as hard as the fantastic feat of engineering that is PUTTING BRAKES ON A CAR. At that point I basically told them to shove it since I’m going to have trouble putting food on the table during the coming week. Maybe I’ll just trade the car in for a Mountain Bike.

2

Sounds like a good idea to me. Unless the pads are completely worn out you can probably get by until you have the money for the work and can get referrals to a good mechanic.

I’m reminded of one shop had that had a sign saying “We fix the $59.95 brake job.” I’d take that $29.95 brake job sign as fair warning that the shop lacks integrity, but if you shop for price that’s what you will get, a lot of lowball estimates that will be exceeded. The more honest mechanics I knew tried to make their estimates on the high side and give the customer a pleasant suprise when the final bill was below the estimate.

3

They may want some cash for checking the brakes though, and that seems fair to me if it’s at or below that $29.95 price.

4

Pretty much every auto shop I’ve ever dealt with was crooked like that. I got an estimate once for $400 to repair a dented door, after they had inspected the damage. I figured it was a good deal, since other places had wanted to charge me upwards of $700 to fix it.

So I after I had dropped it off with them, I got a call a few days later saying they needed to straighten out the frame, and that it’d cost me an additional $300.

I don’t know if there are any dopers here who work in auto shops, but I can honestly say that other than having routine maintainence done, I’ve NEVER had a godo experience with an auto shop. All of them seemed to be out to rip people off. And that’s what inspired me to try to learn to do that stuff myself.

5

Not long ago I had to have some major repairs done to my truck. It might actually have been less expensive to replace the thing - its not a new truck - but dammit, I LIKE my truck, so I start shopping the prices around… I get quoted $1,100 a couple times but then find someone willing to do the job for $825… So I schedule the work and take the truck in… Now mind you I have a writted wuote in the manager’s handwriting stating that $825 is the price… While they have my truck torn apart they give me a call and tell me “Oh, by the way, you need an additional $980 worth of work done to your truck.” WHAT? They have more than doubled their original quote! I managed to get them to come down on their additional quote by over $500, but even now the truck is not running the way it should considering what has been done. I’m convinced they intentionally did things wrong in order to get me to spend still more when it breaks down again.

6

While not knowing the vehicle owned by the OP, I do my own brakes, being a former mechanic.

Pads are typically around 30$. Pep Boys is sorry they ever did lifetime warranty pads, because I saved my receipt.

Disc rotors should be turned to relieve any runout (irregularity in true linear turning plane) and any scoring. The inner oil seal must be replaced also. While off the vehicle, inner and outer wheel bearings should be inspected and repacked with new grease.

The cheap $ is to get you in the door. If a shop does a proper and thorough brake job, they can’t do it for $30 and make a profit.
Marking up my material costs, and adding in what I charge others for my labor, I need to charge myself $150 at minimum for a brake job, assuming no problems are found.

7

And that’s what bugs me the most about the whole auto-repair industry. If I could just get an honest price the first time, I think I’d me much more willing to accept the bill.

I mean, imagine if other businesses tried to do that: A grocery store advertises that they’re selling two liter pepsis for $0.55 and when you go to buy them, after you’ve had them rung up, the checker suddenly announces that they misprinted the ad and that it’s actually $1.55. Gah.

That’s not directed at you, danceswithcats, rather it’s directed at auto shops in general.

8

The answer is, don’t take your car to auto mechanics that quote ultra-low prices on bill-boards!!!

Ask people who’ve lived where you live for a while where they take their car. Odds are, they know a good, honest, reputable, skilled mechanic. Maybe they run their own place, maybe it doesn’t have super duper specials advertised on their sign. They’ll quote you what may seem at first to be a huge price, but you’ll be pleasantly surprised when the actual bill is a tad lower than the quote… and you’ll have the peace of mind of knowing a skilled mechanic has worked on your car.

But, these guys typically don’t have flashy ads on television, or signs that advertise engine rebuilds for $29.95… they don’t need them. They rely on repeat business and word of mouth…

9

Don’t try to jump down my throat here; these experiences happened when I was 16, and some time has gone by since then. I know a little bit better than that now.

Regardless, my point still stands that it’s an extremely shady way of doing business, and I think it’s just skirting fraud or whatever the proper legal term would be for that type of deception.

10

Former mechanic here. over the years I have worked at gas stations, independent shops and at dealerships.
Never in all the years that I have worked on other peoples cars for money have I ever ripped anyone off on a brake job, or any other repair. I never felt the need to as I always had enough work to stay busy.
This is not to say that I never had to increase an estimate. There are times when after disassembly it turns out that more parts are required to do a proper repair than you thought up front.
I have seen more times than I care to recall, chain shops just nailing customers to the wall. One example Car comes in with 25,000 miles and has 4 rebuilt brake calipers on it.
Me “Had your brakes done at Midas?”
Cust. “Yes. how did you know?”
Me “You have 4 rebuilt calipers on your car.” (Midas always sells 4 calipers)
Cust. “They told me I needed them.”
Me “Well sir maybe you did. But if you did it would be the very first Volvo I have ever seen that did not get at least 100,000 miles from the brake calipers. My car has over 200,000 miles on the factory units.”

desdinova’s advice is right on the money, find a good mechanic and stick with them.

11

You can often only find a good mechanic after being seriously burned by bad ones.

Once I took a Civic in for a brake job…didn’t have the $500 so I said just let me have it back…halfway down the road I saw my front passenger tire shooting ahead of me and bouncing off cars down the road…they had lost the lug nuts.

I just had a $1000 clutch put in the 94 Pathy. I hemmed and hawwed before getting it done but finally needed to drive out of state for an emergency.

The dealer who did my $700 waterpump/timing belt in August did a fair, honest job. However, his “ticket-writer” whom I had talked to extensively concerning my worries about bad/unthoughtful mechanics had quit. He had been replaced with a moron who could not remember my name or car details (4wd, manual) one minute after I told him (and a computer record of the August job in front of him)

So I went to my bosses Nissan dealer…she had a ten year history with her “ticket-writer” and he came recommended. They lent me a car for two days and washed the Pathy…that was thoughtful.

However, when I got it home there was a large air socket still hanging off a transmission hanger, and a breather line hanging down, two bolts OBVIOUSLY missing. They had that thing on the lift for TWO days! If that’s the kind of work they do that I can see…what happened during the clutch replacement??? I was furious. They’re not doing the upcoming $700 manifold job, no matter what assurances I get.

Now, I know that stuff was minor (and ps the clutch does feel good, so kudos)…but what if they overlooked a major thing in there and I crash??? I HATE HATE HATE bad mechanics. And bad mechanical engineering. I try to do most of the work myself, and if I had a garage I’d have done the clutch. (I miss my old slant 6)

Don’t get me started on the IDIOT who designed the location of the last two spark plugs…they should enshrine his name and email address on the firewall so I know who to curse when changing the plugs.

Heeezzzz, Heeeezzzz

12

I am not a mechanic, but the one mechanical thing I have done is to replace the brake pads on the car.

It is not too difficult usually. Take off the tire, remove a couple of bolts. Slide the brake pad from the calliper (the thing that holds the pad in place) then stick the new ones in.

The only thing that is a pain in the ass in if there are pins holding the pads in. (For me.) Also, screws and whatnot tend to be stubborn and tight.

What you need is a screwdriver, a hammer, a jack and a tire iron. I worked in an Auto Zone type of joint for a while and you can easily get these brake pads for 30 bucks (any price that ends with 99999 apes me).

13

Unfortunately, it’s the same on this side of the pond…

My door lock stopped working on my Peugeot so my Dad and myself took off the door panel and found the probem was a small washer on the back of the lock barrel kept falling off. Fair enough we thought, we’ll just go to a Peugeot garage and get a new one. Took it into a garage, they wanted to take a look just to check that was the problem. A few hours they phoned up saying I needed a new lock barrel and lock linkage costing £200! I told them just to leave it alone, I’ll just use the passenger door and climb across. OK they said, collect it tomorrow. So I wandered in to collect my car and they said they were going to charge me for finding out what the problem was! ‘Well, it took a long time to get the door panel off and find the broblem sir’. This was the door panel that was on the back seat as I took it in, and I had already told them what the problem was ffs. I refused to pay on the grounds that they didn’t quote me a price as I took it in. A few weeks later I went to a scrapyard and got both lock barrels changed for £40.
Man I hate the big garages.

14

I went through a lot of grief finding a reliable mechanic. On top of all the other things mentioned in this thread, add the occasional “Don’t bother your pretty little head about it, honey.”

I kept asking friends and co-workers and such if the folks they went to were reliable–and then tried the shops that people recommended. A friend’s parents recommended a little independent shop not far from my house. They were superb–polite and respectful, never a “honey” or the least bit of condescension. Honest–they always gave an estimate before they did any work, and if they found, in the course of the work, that it would be more, they called me to let me know what the story was. They did excellent work, and when, say, a new part they’d installed turned out to be bad, they fixed it for free. One of the techs there even gave me advice on how to avoid a more expensive repair. So I married him. Saved me a world of trouble, believe me.

I’d still be recommending that shop, except the owner decided to get out of the business and sold it, and the new owners–well, they’re not quite so impressive.

15

Oh, anyway, the point of my little anecdote was, desdinova is right–you have to ask around and find the shops people are happy with, and remember that anyone advertising low low prices (but somehow has a huge advertising budget) is going to try to scam you.

16

About the OP and Mazda brake jobs.

I replaced my 98 Mazda 626 pads and rotors (all disc brakes) last summer. I used quality OEM parts, not Mazda parts and it’s the squeekiest damn break job I have ever heard. Within 2 weeks I got a very loud squeek every time I stopped, right at the end of the stop. I can only imagine a least one pad is a little loose and is vibrating in the caliper. I took off the pad I suspect is causing the problem and wet sanded it down with brake cleaner, this fixed the problem for a couple of weeks and now it’s noisy again.

Research on the web suggests this is not an uncommon complaint with newer pads and certain types of rotors.

17

Once I had a shop tell me I needed my automatic transmission fluid changed on my manual transmission car…

Another time, I brought my car in because it was leaking clutch fluid, but they tried to tell me I needed a whole new clutch. He even argued with me about whether I was having problems with the car staying in gear!

18

Oy.

Not all garages are like this. I worked at a garage for 3 years (started as a cashier, ended as an evening manager/garage tech). We never quoted low prices and “switched” them, we never offered flat prices for anything, even oil changes, and we didn’t overcharge a customer unless it was an honest-to-God mistake. My boss might have been a cheap bastard when it came to paying his employees (I made a whopping $6.25/hr after three years :rolleyes: ), but he refused to cheat customers.

Hell’s Bells, there was one time a lady came in for a repair that would have been about $1,200, and my boss told her that she should go to the dealership she bought the car from and see if it was still under warrantee (it was a slightly older car) because it would cost over a grand. She did go there, it was covered and she got it fixed there. My boss lost over a grand because he was honest with her.

So not all garages are scum.

19

It took me awhile, but I finally found an honest garage in the Portland area. None in Vancouver, all the Vancouver places are bad.

My brother-in-law suggested to me a shop run by this guy. (And that’s all there is, is the guy who does everything.) My BIL had taken his car in for brakework and asked the guy to do some other regular “maintenance” stuff. The guy did the brakes, then called my BIL and told him the “maintenance” was only necessary if he felt like giving him a lot of extra money, because the car certainly didn’t need it. (I put maintenance in quotes, because this is stuff a dealer would have insisted was absolutely necessary asap)

So I took my car there. The guy was fantastic. Good work, honest. Squeezed me in because I was in an emergency type situation. Excellent place! All work goes to him now.

20

<minor hikack> If you don’t mind my asking, what shop is it? I know someone who could definitely use an honest mechanic in that area. </hijack>

I love small garages. In my family, it’s almost blasphemy to go to a shop for something you can do yourself, so if you go to anyone at all, you have an obligation to find one that’s honest and relatively inexpensive. That usually means a small shop, and finding the best one in my area is kind of a hobby for me.

In Utah County, there’s an out-of-the-way place run by a 70 yo man named Libby. He’s been fixing cars for decades, and now does it more or less for a hobby. He runs everything himself, and charges a miniscule amount for labor (think $10 on a $500 repair), no matter how hard the repair is. Getting repairs done through him is unbelievably cheap, and they’re done right. You can easily save hundreds of dollars. The downside?

#1, he’s perpetually grouchy. You park your car on his lot, quickly say what’s wrong, ask how much, and run outta there. Anything more guarantees you’ll get yelled at (Think Soup Nazi). #2, he takes his time. Expect to wait at least a month for your car, no matter how little the repair. Because he’s so cheap and good, there could be 50 or more people waiting ahead of you, so waiting 5 months for your car is not unheard-of.

Some small shops are much worse than the larger ones, though. People expect them to be better because there’s a closer relationship between customer and mechanic, and they rely on reputation to get business. That’s not always true. I went to one in Idaho, and paid $1500 for a new transmission. It broke down again a month later, and I found out they put a used one in and charged me full price. It’s amazing the things some of them get away with.