Pssst! that was my point. I was just showing them that their same argument, when swung the other way, seems looney.
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O p a l C a t
www.opalcat.com
First off, that is fine if you want to eat what is served just to be polite… but I do have a problem with you saying it is rude to not do so… so I ask: would you expect a kosher Jew to eat pork if it was cooked for him? Would it be rude of him to stick to his religion and beliefs? I’m not attacking on this, really. I think it is fine if you want to eat something that is fixed for you… but I don’t think I’m rude for not doing so. See what I mean? I just can’t do it… I could never bring myself to eat meat unless I was starving to death and there was no other food available.
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O p a l C a t
www.opalcat.com
Blacks were specifically bred to be slaves, way back when. That didn’t make it suck any less to be a slave. This isn’t a slam of any kind, just an observation.
There are two: the first is that many veggie burgers DON’T taste like meat. They aren’t inteded to. They have a taste all their own and the logic is that they make a darn good sandwich–same reason you would eat a hamburger. The other applies to those burgers out there that DO try to taste like meat. These appeal to people who desire to be vegetarians, but still like the taste of meat. It enables them to live the lifestyle they agree with without having to “give up” something they enjoy. All in all I think it’s a good thing, both routes. Me, personally, I eat the non-meat-tasting ones… the ones that taste like meat freak me out too much. On the other hand, I really like veggie sausage patties, but that is probably because they mostly taste like spices.
And I have to say… Yosemitebabe…you GO girl. I pretty much agree with everyting in that post about the whole food nazi thing, preaching, etc, yadda, et al. I never get in anyone’s face or start discussions about vegetarianism. If someone asks, I answer. If someone tries to argue, I will explain my side. I have never tried to “convert” anyone. Yeah, I’m passionate about the subject. I just really REALLY love animals. A lot. When you ask someone about their kids, they get passionate. When you ask me about my kid, I get passionate. When you ask me about my animals, I get passionate. When you try to make me feel like it’s somehow wrong of me to not want to kill animals…well, yeah, I get passionate.
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O p a l C a t
www.opalcat.com
Same to you, OpalCat! Thanks!
Now that I’m on a roll, and still have a bit of a rant left, let me share some of the statements, arguements, rationalizations (lots and lots of rationalizations) that I’d gladly NEVER hear again:
“It’s the food chain.” (Uh huh…)
“I have to have my meat.” (Who asked you? I didn’t ask you about your meat eating habits.)
“How do you find anything to eat?” (Newsflash to everyone: I am not a small woman. OBVIOUSLY I am finding plenty to eat!)
“Plants have feelings too” (Read my comments above.)
“Don’t you ever crave meat?” (No.)
“Look! I am eating this big hamburger in front of you!” (Do you expect me to faint now?)
“I don’t eat that much meat.” (Didn’t ask you about it.)
“Surely you eat fish and chicken?” (No, they are animals. Vegetarians do not eat animals.)
“I have a friend who is a vegetarian, and they eat fish/chicken, so why don’t you?” (I have a friend who says they are Princess Diana, so they’re Princess Diana then, right?) Seriously, I am SO SICK of this one. Fish and chicken-eaters are NOT vegetarian.
"Can’t you eat this meat dish just this once?" (No. When I told you earlier that I was vegetarian, I actually meant that.)
“I just crave meat.” (Once again, didn’t ask you to share an explanation about your eating habits.)
“Why do you want to not eat meat? It’s not natural!” (Why do you care what I eat?)
I could go on. I probably will.
Damn. I wish there was an edit button.
I feel the need to explain the fish/chicken eaters and Princess Diana reference a little better:
Anyone can call themselves a vegetarian, even if they eat fish and chicken, the same way they can call themselves Princess Diana if they want to. Doesn’t make it so.
If you say that you have a friend who tells you that they are vegetarian, yet they still eat fish/chicken, it will mean nothing to me. No more than if you told me that your friend said they were Princess Diana. I happen to know that your friend is not Princess Diana, the same way I know that your fish/chicken eating friend is not a vegetarian.
That would be false.
“We’re equipped with an all-purpose set of ivories equally suited to liver and onions.”
Wrong again.
“Like the hard-core carnivores, we have fairly simple digestive systems well suited to the consumption of animal protein, which breaks down quickly. Contrary to what your magazine article says, the human small intestine, at 23 feet, is a little under eight times body length (assuming a mouth-to-anus “body length” of three feet). This is about midway between cats (three times body length), dogs (3-1/2 times), and other well-known meat eaters on the one hand and plant eaters such as cattle (20 to 1) and horses (12 to 1) on the other. This tends to support the idea that we are omnivores.”
Once again, the best source for debinking what people WANT to believe is right under our noses all along:
http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a3_087.html
We are omnivores. We can eat meat. We are designed to eat both. But feel free to eat whatever you want - Just don’t go spreading misinformation about it.
Satan: You’re right about humans being omnivores… I was heading there and looking for the book with the info, but was pretty wiped out from work. Excuses, excuses…should post only when fresh & lucid, right? Um-HMMMMM.Thanks for the elaboration and link. I do think that, as a culture, we eat waaaaaayyyyy too much meat to be balanced.
Yosemite: Go Ahead Girl! Thanks for the energetic Pit-worthy contribution.
Don’t ask us why we are vegetarians! If you encounter some preachy veggie who wants to annoy you, go at it, argue with them. But when you ASK THEM first, what do you expect?
Well, at the point, I kinda wish I’d never asked. but…
a bunch of friends and I were out eating, and this one girl didn’t have any food. I didn’t know if she didn’t have money or what, so I offered to share my chicken quesadillas with her. AND I GOT THE LOOK. So I asked her what was wrong and she told me. (please don’t say "well, I’m not like that’)
And even still, I’m not anti-vegatarian, but so far in this thread, I still haven’t heard any logical, supportable (all things considered) reasons, except for those who said ‘just cause they wanted to’.
I don’t believe there is anyone except for Eustace Conway who survives in this world with out polluting it, including me. So when you wear your plastic shoes and lie on your chemical pillows, don’t tell me you’re a better person.
Obviously, there is no right or wrong answer, but go back and read the entire thread again, and look how you present yourself.
All this science, I don’t understand. It’s just my job 5 days a week-- Rocketman
I’m sorry, I must have missed this line. Can you point it out to me?
Rich
You still don’t get it. First off, I never said I’m a better person. Second, are you saying that eating meat would make me better? If not then what is your point? And what is illogical about not killing animals? People like you just totally confuse me. Why do you CARE what I eat? Geez… get a life!
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O p a l C a t
www.opalcat.com
There are a few things I’d like to know:
First, why do you care? Are you in the meat industry? Is business down? What?
Second, what would be a “good enough” reason for you? Would “I don’t like the taste” or
“My cholesterol is lower now” or “I don’t eat things with eyes” be enough? Do any of us owe you an explanation, anyway? I am sitting over here, minding my own business…I do not feel obligated to find an expanation for my personal eating choice that will satisfy you.
Third, why do you care?
Fourth, why do you care?
Fifth, what are vegetarians taking away from you, as a whole? Other than the occasional annoying zealot, how exactly does someone’s personal eating choices affect you? I’m really curious about that one…
Sixth, why do you care?
(Do you detect a pattern here?)
I second OpalCat - get a life. 
Potatoes have eyes.
You still don’t get it. First off, I never said I’m a better person. Second, are you saying that eating meat would make me better? If not then what is your point? And what is illogical about not killing animals? People like you just totally confuse me. Why do you CARE what I eat? Geez… get a life!
You’re right. You didn’t say you were a better person. The girl I was eating with did. I don’t believe I’ve ever asked you, specifically. No, meat won’t make you better. I don’t believe I ever insinuated that. This is the bbq pit, where people come to rant. I was ranting about how this particular situation came about.
and Yosimitebabe, I believe in most your posts, you claimed that you hated to be asked and try to avoid the question. Then why are you here? No one invited or specifically asked you to defend ‘yourself’.
The ‘plastic shoes’? perhaps a little hasty, but if you don’t wear leather, what do you think your shoes are made of? Bark?
And yes, I love the people that say they are vegetarian b/c they have high chloresterol, or don’t like the taste of meat. But the fact that the girl said b/c plants don’t ‘scream’ was positively an attack on my belief system.
Opalcat, your stongest argument, which you seem to stick to is ‘I’m pathetic, and I just don’t get it’. Is this your big gun?
I’m going to go out and get a life and have a margarita, and if you were here, I’d invite you along and we could talk about other things. But, I havn’t committed any of the notrocites (sp) that you are accusing.
So as this thread is only going to get longer with the same ideas over and over, there really isn’t much left to argue. I can only assume you grow your own veggies (to avoid all the chemical fertilization, etc.) and don’t keep any of your animals confined to the house. Because that would be cruel.
All this science, I don’t understand. It’s just my job 5 days a week-- Rocketman
Hey - I’m entitled to rant, and to inform everyone that I am tired of their questions. Maybe if I answer a few of them here, and ask a few of my own (for instance, “Why do you care?”) I can spare being confronted in person by a few less people in the future.
Also, that list of questions that I’d love to never be asked again just need to come out, and this was the place for it!
You still seem bugged that some people think they are “better” than you, and are trying to avoid cruelty. Be bugged. I don’t care. I don’t think that I am better than you based on my eating habits. But I DO think I am better than you because I have a gap between my teeth! (So there… ;))
Sheesh.
← Finding her self posting to often for a lurker 
I am a vegetarian simply because if I can make one being escape suffering, I want to do it. I completley understand the concept of
“the circle of life” and that it is natural to have a food chain, but my thinking is, if we don’t have to kill something in order to live, then why do it? However, I do not think I am a “more morale” person then somebody who is not a vegetarian, nor do I know many who feel they are.
I do, at times eat chicken, but that is only because I don’t eat balanced meals for the most part ( yes I know, my own stupidity). I eat my share of fruits and veggies, but I guess not enough. I have been a vegetarian for 5 years now. I went a while with no meat of any kind, and I got sick way too often, and fainted. My body couldn’t handle it. I am now trying to work out what I eat. My gut feeling on this issue is that everyone should do what they can. If people can only be partly vegetarian for any number of reasons, it is worth it.
And regarding the whole plant eating debate, although I see were you are comeing from, is it really a fair argument? I can’t see how people can actually belive that plants have the same type of feeling as animals. It just isn’t realistic. This brings me to my next point, who here saw Notting Hill? Any fruitatarians out here?
<— Praying this post made at least a minimal amount of sense
Actually, my shoes are largely cork, but that is irrelevant. I never said my shoes weren’t plastic. And I don’t grow my own veggies, and I never said that I don’t do any cruel thing ever in the world. I simply do the best I can. This is why I keep saying you “don’t get it”… because you keep taking what I say and trying to stretch it into some gross overstatement… it makes you look stupid.
And yes I have pets, but I don’t think that is cruel. They have the run of the house and are very happy. If you try to claim they aren’t you’ll just be showing your ignorance again. My animals are members of my family, and they share the same space that I do. If I can live here and be happy, so can they (and they do and they are).
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O p a l C a t
www.opalcat.com
But I DO think I am better than you because I have a gap between my teeth! (So there… )
You’ve created a very pleasant ending (i hope). I am curious if your gap will give you a certain advantage that will someday lead to the extinction of us non-gappers. (just kidding, don’t answer that)
Opalcat, I hope someday you can come to terms that some people just don’t agree. Go ahead and leave your door open a couple of days and see how many of your pets stick around. I have no doubt that they will because you seem to love them a lot, but boy would that shut me up.
All this science, I don’t understand. It’s just my job 5 days a week-- Rocketman
Oh, one more thing…
I’m only adding this b/c it happened during the span of this argument. Last nite, me and some friends were invited to another friends house for a start-up business proposal. We knew his girlfriend was a veggie, but didn’t think much of it when they invited us for dinner too. Dinner which we would later find out was prepared by her. Keep in mind that no one else there was a vegetarian. She served aspargus soup, and eggplant trouffles with some onion type h’ourdervs.
Everyone just sat there and looked at their plate. It was the most uncomfortable silence I’ve ever witnessed.
All this science, I don’t understand. It’s just my job 5 days a week-- Rocketman
Aside from the evil, wicked and nightmare-inducing onions, it sounds pretty good to me.
-Chris, who is always up for a steak.
“ChrisCTP-…the sweetheart of the SDMB…” --Diane
Chris’ Homepage: Domestic Bliss
This is just silly. Why were you silent? You hadn’t even tried it yet and you knew it was bad? You have something against eating eggplant that you had previously mentioned? It sounds to me like your social skills are somewhat lacking.
Someone invites me over for dinner. I mention casually that I don’t eat meat. If they serve me meat, I graciously say, “oh, I’m sorry, I must have forgotten to mention that I don’t eat meat. I’ll just have a few extra carrots, if there are enough!” and the conversation goes merrily on. If there aren’t enough carrots, I go home and have a snack, not thinking any less of the evening’s hosts; after all, it is not the responsibility of the host to see to it that each guest can have whatever they would have ordered from a menu had they gone to a restaurant. If they get offended that I’m not eating what they’ve served me, that’s their business: I can only state my intentions (e.g., I mean no disrespect in refusing to partake of the meat), and if that’s not good enough for them because social customs are more important to them, well, that’s their choice.
To sit there and be silent when something is put in front of you to the point where the silence is noticable and uncomfortable, well, that’s just rude. You couldn’t come up with, “wow, this looks interesting, what’s in it?” If you know you’re allergic to eggplant, be polite and say you can’t have any. If it looks disgusting and you think you’ll barf if you try it, be polite and say that you’ve had eggplant and it just doesn’t agree with you. But don’t just sit there and be silent.
Have you ever heard of Judith Martin?
Rich