I have changed my mind about the Clinton email scandal (and so should you)

[adaher]

No, only a scandal when you lie about it is the lesson here. Remember the old adage, it’s not the scandal, it’s the coverup? Scandals have a tendency to go away when people come clean about them.

[Truman_Burbank]

So, there was no problem with way Clinton, Rice and Powell ran their servers when they were SOS? Oh, I see, only when Clinton did it, that was different.

[Sam_Stone]

Rice and Powell did not ‘run servers’. Only Clinton had a private E-mail server. And I may be wrong, but I don’t recall anyone accusing Rice or Powell of transmitting classified data through their public E-mail accounts.

[adaher]

The IG report said that Powell did. Rice did not. But Powell also never denied anything. He cooperated completely with the IG investigation. Clinton did not.

[Kolak_of_Twilo]

@adaher

No, only a scandal when you lie about it is the lesson here.

If she had lied to the FBI about this she would have been indicted for perjury as I understand things, so again - only a scandal when it’s a Clinton. If your last name is Powell, not so much.

[adaher]

She didn’t lie to the FBI, she lied to the public. That’s what caused the plunge in her approval rating. Instead of coming clean, she clammed up and just let the story drip out over months, with each new revelation further damaging her standing.

To the extent the Clintons are treated differently, it is because they think their actions are none of your business. Even their supporters have shaken their heads about their entitlement issues.

[rat_avatar]

@Sam_Stone

Rice and Powell did not ‘run servers’. Only Clinton had a private E-mail server. And I may be wrong, but I don’t recall anyone accusing Rice or Powell of transmitting classified data through their public E-mail accounts.

Not a huge Hillary fan, mostly because she is way to conservative with social rights but the “classified” items she sent were not at the time she sent them. It was still a very stupid thing to do but it is very typical for everyone to try and avoid IT. But even the FBI has cleared her of sending known classified material and Powell just didn’t get caught.

[Ravenman]

@adaher

The IG report said that Powell did. Rice did not. But Powell also never denied anything. He cooperated completely with the IG investigation. Clinton did not.

Conservative logic: Powell turns over nothing and cooperates “completely.” Uh-huh.

[adaher]

He did what was asked. Obviously he didn’t keep that email account in the 12 years since he left office. And his reasoning for getting one was that he couldn’t email people outside the government.

Clinton did what she did to evade FOIA.

[Richard_Parker]

@rat_avatar

… but the “classified” items she sent were not at the time she sent them.

This is another example of a talking point that has long-since been rebutted.

Here’s the FBI on this subject:

From the group of 30,000 e-mails returned to the State Department, 110 e-mails in 52 e-mail chains have been determined by the owning agency to contain classified information at the time they were sent or received. Eight of those chains contained information that was Top Secret at the time they were sent; 36 chains contained Secret information at the time; and eight contained Confidential information, which is the lowest level of classification. Separate from those, about 2,000 additional e-mails were “up-classified” to make them Confidential; the information in those had not been classified at the time the e-mails were sent.

(emphasis mine)

I don’t blame you for not knowing this. It is a function of our broken political and media environment. But all of us should do a better job being skeptical of factual claims in circumstances where we know there is lots of incentive to spin and bend the truth.

[adaher]

Rule#1. Never cite campaign talking points. They are almost always inaccurate.

[XT]

Probably already cited, but I haven’t bothered to slog through the seemingly endless pages of wrangling on this, so I figured I’d like to this CNN article and cut and paste some of the salient points:

CNN)FBI Director James Comey said Tuesday that he would not recommend charges against Hillary Clinton over her use of private email servers while secretary of state, removing a huge shadow hovering over her presidential campaign.
But Comey administered an extraordinary tongue-lashing to Clinton and her aides, rebuking them for being “extremely careless” in the handling of classified information and saying the presumptive Democratic nominee should have known an unclassified email system was no place to conduct sensitive government business.

Comey’s decision not to recommend charges likely removes the threat of prosecution in the middle of Clinton’s campaign for the presidency, but the political fallout will continue. His explicit criticism of Clinton’s conduct offered her enemies a trove of fresh ammunition for their assault on her character, honesty and trustworthiness — one of her biggest vulnerabilities.
In a stunning moment of Washington theater, Comey stepped up to the microphone to deliver the FBI’s findings just over two hours before Clinton climbed aboard Air Force One to travel to her first campaign event with President Barack Obama. Adding to the tension, he made clear the White House and the Justice Department “do not know what I am about to say.”

“Although we did not find clear evidence that Secretary Clinton or her colleagues intended to violate laws governing the handling of classified information,” he said, “there is evidence that they were extremely careless in their handling of very sensitive, highly classified information.”
In the first reaction from the Clinton camp to Comey’s statement, spokesman Brian Fallon said that the campaign was "pleased that the career officials handling this case have determined that no further action by the Department is appropriate.

“As the Secretary has long said, it was a mistake to use her personal email and she would not do it again. We are glad that this matter is now resolved.”

Clinton has admitted her use of a private email server — discovered during investigation by the House Select Committee — on Benghazi was a mistake. But she has maintained that she never received or passed on information that was marked classified at the time – a legalistic position that has exposed her to significant political fire.

Comey said that the FBI “painstakingly” combed through every bit of Clinton’s multiple servers and mobile devices that they could from her four-year tenure as secretary of state. He described a series of obstacles, including a server that had its software wiped.

The Justice Department is considered highly likely to accept Comey’s recommendations. Attorney General Loretta Lynch said as much amid a furor last week over her encounter with former President Bill Clinton on an airport tarmac in Phoenix, which sparked claims by Republicans that a fix was being concocted to ensure Hillary Clinton was not charged.

Comey said of the 30,000 emails that Clinton’s team turned over to the State Department, 110 emails in 52 email chains were determined to have contained classified information “at the time they were sent or received,” Comey said. Eight of those chains contained information considered “top secret,” the highest level of classification.

That’s in addition to 2,000 emails that were “upclassified,” or determined to have classified information only in hindsight.

[jayjay]

J. Edgar Comey…wonder who HE’S keeping files on?

[running_coach]

@jayjay

J. Edgar Comey…wonder who HE’S keeping files on?

Everyone.

looks around surreptitiously

[JohnT]

Trump today, September 18th, 2019:

“One thing we haven’t mentioned is technology, they’re wired so we will know if somebody’s trying to break through and you may want to discuss that a little bit, General.”

General: “Sir, there could be some merit in not discussing that.”

Scott Stedman

Some times, when Dotard gets really open about the treason stuff*, I come back to this thread and laugh, and laugh, and laugh. Then I cry, then I laugh some more, and then I remember:

But Her Emails

… and I somber up, because, yes, her emails.

I note that this thread ended about 10, 20 or so days before Trump publicly implored Russia to release the emails. I also note that those emails… if they ever existed… has yet to be released.

Lol, “perhaps there’s some merit in not discussing that”, lol.

*my last time here was just a few weeks ago, when he <confirming…> tweeted the Top Secret document that he <checks notes> took pictures with using his <flips page> cell phone.

But that server! Those emails! They proved, er, fit a narrative, didn’t they?

[JKellyMap]

Thanks for reviving this. Yes, Trump’s hypocrisy is noteworthy. Richard Parker’s 2016 concerns about Hillary were reasonable and well articulated, but he (and others in the thread) rightly noted it was nothing like the incompetence and childish behavior that a President Trump would display.

(Funny comment in that Twitter link: “His kids have the hardest jobs! They have to try and sell what he gives away.”)

[John_Stamos_Left_Ear]

@JKellyMap

Thanks for reviving this. Yes, Trump’s hypocrisy is noteworthy. Richard Parker’s 2016 concerns about Hillary were reasonable and well articulated, but he (and others in the thread) rightly noted it was nothing like the incompetence and childish behavior that a President Trump would display.

Except that this was part of a bigger trend, articulated by a complicit mainstream media, that every negative about Trump had to be met with an equal negative about Hillary. Oh, you can add a hundred disclaimers, but like the errata on page 67 of the newspaper doesn’t change much about the errors in the headline story in the preceding day’s newspaper, it all added up to bullshit false equivalence which is the only reason we have president Trump.

I haven’t changed my mind about the Clinton email (non) scandal (and neither should you).

[guizot]

@JKellyMap

. . . he (and others in the thread) rightly noted it was nothing like the incompetence and childish behavior that a President Trump would display…

The more stridently Trump accuses others of something, the more it turns out he does it himself, to a greater degree. (Such as accusing Obama of playing golf, etc.) This is, indeed, exactly how children behave. We have a six-year-old president.

[bobot]

The orange national security hole in the oval office, and the fact that Americans are yawn about it certainly shine a light of perspective on everything else.

[JohnT]

Yup. Treason is OK if a white man does it and doesn’t make him unelectable.

Having a private email server is an utter abomination unto God, however, if done by a woman and makes her completely unfit for the office.