You mean a bigger target than the one that’s already painted on the back of every Republican from the last impeachment attempt? What would a second attempt do that the first attempt didn’t?
As for a call to resign, yes, it would be a wasted gesture. We all know Trump won’t listen.
It is deeply immoral. And it’s tragic. But there is nothing the Democrats can do to stop it unless and until they take over control of the government. Blaming the Democrats for all the people who die between now and then is as wrong as blaming the allies for all of the people the Nazis killed before we were able to defeat Germany.
We can’t stop the dying today. All we can do today is keep fighting until we reach the point where we can stop the dying.
He could have not shut down the government agencies that had been set up to deal with medical crises like this.
He could have started laying in stockpiles of medical equipment and supplies back in January when people advised him he should start doing that. If he had done what experts had told him, we would have built up an adequate supply by March and there wouldn’t have been the crisis caused by short supplies.
He could have started programs to develop tests and vaccines back in January as well and given them priority funding. If he had, both of these programs would be months farther along .
He could have made plans to deal with the economic effects of the lockdown to minimize the damage it caused our country. Other countries did that and experienced a much smaller economic downturn.
He could have publicly told people to follow common sense medical advice instead of encouraging people to ignore that advice.
He could have resigned from office when he realized he was incapable of doing the things I just listed and was therefore unable to carry out the duties of being President.
[quote=“Little_Nemo, post:21, topic:913544”]
You mean a bigger target than the one that’s already painted on the back of every Republican from the last impeachment attempt? What would a second attempt do that the first attempt didn’t? [/quote]
I honestly don’t get this. I don’t see that the impeachment over the Ukraine extortion moved the needle much. Do you really think it put that much of a target on anyone’s back? I just don’t see that.
I think it was the right thing to do, because you’ve got to at least try to remove a President who commits a ‘high crime’ and the Ukraine extortion qualifies.
The difference between that impeachment and this one - well, there’s multiple differences obviously. One big difference is that this is happening right here. The coronavirus cases and deaths aren’t far from most people’s minds. The other is, it’s not something that happened, is over and done with, and all that’s left is passing judgment, It’s an ongoing, continuing disaster in progress, and there’s still much that a unified Federal response could accomplish in the way of saving lives.
He isn’t the intended audience.
ETA: Still can’t get the hang of these quotes. Clearly.
This is one area where I agree with Mitch McConnell: few people pay attention to votes not taken, bills not taken up. And that includes bills passed by one house of Congress, and ignored by the other.
He could have worn a mask, taking it off publicly to speak at socially distant lecturns and replace it immediately after speaking, in the same way that pretty much all leaders whose nations are dealing with the situation effectively - it is called ‘leading by example’
Thing is, the fact that exists a valid counterargument to what you want the Dems to do is enough to show they do not deserve your “disgust.” They have legitimate reasons to be acting the way they are.
And misplacing blame only ever helps those who should be blamed. Making the Democrats out to be the enemy for something Trump and the Republicans caused only helps Trump and the Republicans.
And the Dems need to keep pointing out that, even here, the Repub version of helping out unemployed Americans has been extremely anemic, particularly when compared to what other countries like Canada are doing to try to support regular people through this.
“Canada can afford unemployment payments to people whose jobs were affected by COVID-19. Why can’t our ‘billionaire’ president and his ‘great economy’ afford to do the same?”
The only result of the Dems trying once again to impeach Trump will be a series of ads that say
“While the Chinese Virus ravanged America, Democrats once again put partisan politics ahead of Americas interest. Rather than work with our president to defeat this vile scourge they choose to spend all of their time in trying to bypass the voters just 3 months before an election.”
I agree that having Trump in office is intolerable. Having Hitler in control of France in 1942 was intolerable, but that doesn’t mean that the allies shouldn’t have waited until they were ready before attempting to retake it.
I also agree it was the right thing to do. But I think it’s just wishful thinking to believe that a second impeachment will have a different outcome than the first one did. Trump wouldn’t be removed from office. And nobody whose opinion wasn’t changed by the first impeachment would change their opinion because of the second.
If you agree Trump wouldn’t resign then what do you feel the purpose of calling on him to resign would be? If the intended audience is the voting public than aren’t you saying that the Democrats should be focused on winning the November elections?
You started out by saying the Democrats should be doing something radically different than what they’re doing. But you seem to have come around to saying that you want them to keep following the same strategy they’re following. The main difference between what they’re doing and what you’re saying is you seem to want them to make more flamboyant but empty gestures.
As you can probably guess, I don’t agree with that plan. I feel the Democrats should be portraying themselves as the competent effective party that will get things done if the voters put them in control. A lot of sound and fury, signifying nothing is the wrong message.
A quick tutorial. The key point is you have to put quote tags on their own separate line. Here’s the basic structure of this post:
(QUOTE RTFirefly)
(QUOTE Little Nemo)
You mean a bigger target…
(/QUOTE)
I honestly don’t get this…
(/QUOTE)
I also agree…
(QUOTE RTFirefly)
(QUOTE Little Nemo)
As for a call to resign…
(/QUOTE)
He isn’t the intended audience.
(/QUOTE)
If you agree Trump wouldn’t…
(QUOTE RTFirefly)
Still can’t get the hang…
(/QUOTE)
A quick tutorial…
He could have at least paid attention to what his advisors were trying to tell him in January & February instead of golfing & holding reelection rallies.
He could have been a leader. Even if it was up to the states to do a lot of the legwork, this called for coordination at the federal level. If Trump had gotten an early start making sure we had supplies and infrastructure for testing and contact tracing, and then implemented an aggressive national testing and tracing strategy as soon as this thing started to pick up–before it became politicized, when people were willing to do what it took–we could have had it under control by now.
But all along, Trump has been all about telling his base what they want to hear–that everything is OK, we can go back to normal, and above all, all the problems are 100% the fault of the liberals.
One could go on at length. My opinion is that Trump genuinely thought that all he had to do was stop Chinese people from coming to the US and that would solve everything. It’s hard to think of a good move he’s made since then.
Not that I think the Democrats could have done anything about Trump during this time. Another impeachment would have just fueled the fire and made this more political than it is.
One: You say that the point of an impeachment attempt is to try to save the lives that will otherwise be lost between now and January 20, 2021. I don’t see how the dots connect.
If I understand you correctly, you recognize that an impeachment effort will most likely fail, but want to use it to bring down more Republicans (primarily senators, I assume), who will be forced to “show their hand” by supporting an incompetent president and will then lose votes. Setting aside the fact this isn’t necessary - the Republicans have clearly demonstrated their fealty to Trump already - how will pushing voters toward Democratic candidates save lives before Biden is inaugurated?
Two: What grounds are you proposing? You can’t just impeach a president for being ineffective. The last impeachment attempt was based on very specific, carefully chosen charges that Trump had broken the law by trying to get a foreign power to interfere to help his re-election. What law do you think he has broken here?