I have this irritating computer problem...

Factual Questions
1

Howdy,

I own an HP computer which I have extensively modified since it came out of the box. The computer is running windows '98 2nd edition, has a Voodoo 3 3000 PCI video card, and over 300 Megs of RAM.

Now I realize that a PCI video card is not as good as an AGP one. The computer has no AGP. I think that I should be able to get better results from my video card than I am getting now. The video is consistently terrible. I have updated the drivers, ensured DirectX compatibility, and in fact, done everything that I can think of.

There is one further thing that I have been unable to accomplish. One of my friends suggested that I may be able to fix my video problem by changing my BIOS settings to the specified by the manufacturer of the video card. There are only two problems with this.

1.) The manufacturer (3dfx) has gone out of business since I bought the card. I cannot seem to find the BIOS setting information anywhere. (and before you ask, yes I did run a google search)

2.) I cannot seem to access my BIOS settings screen. No indicator comes up during a boot asking me to press any sequence of keys to enter setup. I have tried all of the common ones that I can remember.

3.) Hi, Opal!

Anyway, thanks in advance for your insights…

2

I have no idea what BIOS settings would significantly help your video card. In all my years of overclocking and tweaking I’ve never heard of making BIOS changes to improve video performance of PCI cards (AGP capable mobos have settings relating to AGP performance).

This by no means suggests that such changes aren’t possible but I would assume if such a change was easy or especially useful I would have seen it documented somewhere by now as a method for increasing performance.

The only thing I can suggest to help you out is to overclock your CPU via increasing the front side bus speed. When you do this not only does the CPU gain a speed advantage but the whole PCI bus does as well. This can lend a speed boost to cards in those slots. Be warned however that overclocking voids warranties on just about everything in your PC and you run the risk of permanently damaging components in your system if you aren’t careful. Do this at your own risk.

All of that said you might want to start getting your head around the idea of a new motherboard and video card. If you play PC games these days (especially 3D) AGP cards are starting to become a necessity (not quite yet though). I saw some benchmarks on the new GeForce 3 video card and when it was running near future games utilizing DirectX 8 features it ran at 20-30 frames per second (FPS) and slowed todays barnburners (GeForce II Ultra) down to under 10 frames per second (unplayable). A VooDoo3 3000 PCI would be insanely slow (at a guess 1 FPS).

3

Since when is AGP better? I don’t think you’d have better performance Vs the risk you take messing with stuff.

However, if you’d give the model number of you puter maybe someone can give you the keys you need to whack to get to the bios setup?

4

First off, I have a PII 266 / Windoze 98 SE / 160 MB pc100 / with an 8mb no-name pci card and it runs most everything fine.

Not knowing your machine’s specs (when, oh, when will people learn to post their specs with each computer question?!), I would suspect that your problems are either with a) the drivers or b) your card settings.

BIOS really plays no role here (unless you’ve got onboard video you need to disable – please tell me you don’t have integrated video that you haven’t disabled)

Obviously memory isn’t a problem. It’s been debated for quite a while, but really, anything over 128megs in a Windows system is a waste of $$$.

Make sure you have the latest drivers for your card. Checking the 3dfx site, they still offer a driver for your card that was released November of 2000. Do you have the latest version? Version 1.07.00? Get it here: http://www.3dfx.com/downloads.htm

Also 3dfx hasn’t disappeared inasmuch as it has been bought out by nVidia. Support will still be offered.

Make sure that within each game that you play, you have the correct video card settings. Some games like to be played utilizing Glide. Others prefer Direct 3d. See which works better for your game.

Depending on what kind of chipset you have on your mobo (specs needed again) you can update the pci drivers to allow for “better communication” between the cpu/mobo chipset/pci bus to put it in layman’s terms.

As the previous poster mentioned, install DirectX version 8 available for free from the microsoft downloads site.

All in all, the speed bottleneck is going to be your cpu’s front side bus (fsb) speed, but again, without you giving any specs, who knows?

And handy, AGP is WAY better for many reasons.

5

AGP has faster data transfer rates. The PCI bus is limited to a 33 Mhz clock while AGP works at a base 66 MHz. However, it gets better for AGP than that. (NOTE: There is a 66 MHz PCI specification but I’ve hardly ever seen it used except in a few server class machines…good for Gigabit Ethernet cards).

PCI @ 33 MHz maximum transfer rate = 133 MB/sec
AGP 1x @ 66 MHz maximum transfer rate = 266 MB/sec
AGP 2x @ 66 MHz maximum transfer rate = 532 MB/sec
AGP 4x @ 66 Mhz maximum transfer rate = 1066 MB/sec

Note: These are theoretical peak transfer rates that are never reached in real world use. However, due to the design and architecture of the AGP specification it is able to come closer to its theoretical limits than PCI is.

AGP also supports fast writes (on some cards) from the CPU to the graphics chip. This allows the CPU to write certain data directly to the graphics board without shuffling the data through main memory first.

Even today AGP 1x simply does not get the job done. PCI based cards are even worse off. If all you’re doing is typing papers or surfing the web then PCI based crads are just fine. If you want rock-n-roll heavy duty 3D graphics then AGP stands far ahead of PCI based cards.

6

My system is an HP model #6640C. It is an amd k6-2 500 mhz processor, and it did come with an integrated video setup that I thought I had disabled. However, I haven’t even seen the BIOS screen, so if I need to disable it in there, then I haven’t done that.

Incidentally, I am aware that if I need to run the real power games, I will need AGP. I am resigned to not being able to run those games on this computer.

However, I am getting really terrible performance out of older games. The video doesn’t even handle 2d scrolling well. Yes, I have gotten the latest drivers. It seems to me that there is some setting change I can do that will release whatever it may be that is holding my machine back.

So, I’d like to try disabling the integrated video, how do I get into my BIOS again?..

7

I cannot say for sure what you need to do, but on my system, upon bootup I’ll have a screen that will come up stating what BIOS version I’m running and it’ll say something like “Hit [ctrl] [alt] [enter] to enter setup” which is what you do to enter the BIOS setup screen.

You should be able to disable the onboard video in your System Hardware settings in Windows. Let me know if you don’t know how to do this. Make sure you have a red “x” over your onboard video icon and that your pci video card is the preferred device. You may not have to do any of this depending on your mobo and bios, it may default to your pci card. It varies.

On my mobo I not only have to disable onboard/integrated video, I also have to to into the bios to make sure that “DAC Snoop” is set to the “off” setting. This may be unique to my setup. Also, there will be a line on my bios that states that “onboard video has been disabled.”

One dumb question: You have the monitor plugged into the video card outlet, right? Sorry, had to ask.

AGP really doesn’t run at any set speed. Instead, it runs as a fraction of the front side bus speed. Correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe that the AGP runs at 1/2 the bus speed setting while PCI runs at 1/3 the bus speed settings in most cases. That’s reason one why AGP is faster. Plus, as mentioned, the newer AGPs can address the cpu 2x and 4x per cpu cycle – something that PCI cards cannot.

Also, you might want to lower your monitor settings. I don’t know what you’re set at but at 1028x760/16 million will give you better speed than higher settings. And of course, 800x640 resolution even faster.

Hope this helps!

8

I cannot say for sure what you need to do, but on my system, upon bootup I’ll have a screen that will come up stating what BIOS version I’m running and it’ll say something like “Hit [ctrl] [alt] [enter] to enter setup” which is what you do to enter the BIOS setup screen.

You should be able to disable the onboard video in your System Hardware settings in Windows. Let me know if you don’t know how to do this. Make sure you have a red “x” over your onboard video icon and that your pci video card is the preferred device. You may not have to do any of this depending on your mobo and bios, it may default to your pci card. It varies.

On my mobo I not only have to disable onboard/integrated video, I also have to to into the bios to make sure that “DAC Snoop” is set to the “off” setting. This may be unique to my setup. Also, there will be a line on my bios that states that “onboard video has been disabled.”

One dumb question: You have the monitor plugged into the video card outlet, right? Sorry, had to ask.

AGP really doesn’t run at any set speed. Instead, it runs as a fraction of the front side bus speed. Correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe that the AGP runs at 1/2 the bus speed setting while PCI runs at 1/3 the bus speed settings in most cases. That’s reason one why AGP is faster. Plus, as mentioned, the newer AGPs can address the cpu 2x and 4x per cpu cycle – something that PCI cards cannot.

Also, you might want to lower your monitor settings. I don’t know what you’re set at but at 1028x760/16 million will give you better speed than higher settings. And of course, 800x640 resolution even faster.

Hope this helps!

Oh, I should also add that voodoo cards have been known to “not play well with others” when it comes to certain motherboard chips. These probs should be addressed with updated drivers, though.

9

I cannot say for sure what you need to do, but on my system, upon bootup I’ll have a screen that will come up stating what BIOS version I’m running and it’ll say something like “Hit [ctrl] [alt] [enter] to enter setup” which is what you do to enter the BIOS setup screen.

You should be able to disable the onboard video in your System Hardware settings in Windows. Let me know if you don’t know how to do this. Make sure you have a red “x” over your onboard video icon and that your pci video card is the preferred device. You may not have to do any of this depending on your mobo and bios, it may default to your pci card. It varies.

On my mobo I not only have to disable onboard/integrated video, I also have to to into the bios to make sure that “DAC Snoop” is set to the “off” setting. This may be unique to my setup. Also, there will be a line on my bios that states that “onboard video has been disabled.”

One dumb question: You have the monitor plugged into the video card outlet, right? Sorry, had to ask.

AGP really doesn’t run at any set speed. Instead, it runs as a fraction of the front side bus speed. Correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe that the AGP runs at 1/2 the bus speed setting while PCI runs at 1/3 the bus speed settings in most cases. That’s reason one why AGP is faster. Plus, as mentioned, the newer AGPs can address the cpu 2x and 4x per cpu cycle – something that PCI cards cannot.

Also, you might want to lower your monitor settings. I don’t know what you’re set at but at 1028x760/16 million will give you better speed than higher settings. And of course, 800x640 resolution even faster.

Hope this helps!

Oh, I should also add that voodoo cards have been known to “not play well with others” when it comes to certain motherboard chips. These probs should be addressed with updated drivers, though.

Have you tried the HP website for BIOS info?

10

In my defense, after each “click” I had timed out and never received a “Thank you for posting” response. Thought it didn’t go through.

My apologies, everyone.

11

Okay, I figured out how to get into my BIOS settings. (f1 btw) However, there are no integrated video options in the BIOS. The integrated video controller (SiS 530) is disabled in the device manager. My monitor is plugged into my video card. (rather than the mother board)

What else?

Thanks for your help so far…

12

[qupte]AGP really doesn’t run at any set speed. Instead, it runs as a fraction of the front side bus speed. Correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe that the AGP runs at 1/2 the bus speed setting while PCI runs at 1/3 the bus speed settings in most cases.
[/quote]

Ok…this is somewhat wrong.

The AGP specification calls for a 66 MHz bus speed. The specification is what all manufacturers work to meet. Every AGP video card can run at a 66 MHz bus speed. If the manufacturer decided to go above and beyond the design specs that’s fine but they don’t have to.

So, in a system with a 66 MHz bus speed (ala Celeron) then there is a 1x multiplier so the AGP bus runs at 66 MHz.

If the system is a 100 MHz bus (older Pentiums and Athlons) the AGP multiplier is set to .66 (2/3) so the AGP bus runs at 66 MHz.

If the system is a 133 MHz bus (or 266 which is really 133 for purposes of this calculation…133 is used by P-III chips and the newest Athlon chips) then the AGP multiplier is .5 (1/2) so the AGP bus runs at 66.5 MHz.

AGP always runs at 66 MHz regardless of what else the system is doing unless someone has intentionally pushed it outside of its specifications (which will never happen at a general retailer). Some newer motherboards allow manual setting of the AGP multiplier so you can independently adjust your front side bus speeds and AGP speeds. So far though those boards are usually used by PC enthusiasts. You’re not likely to find that ability in a Dell or Gateway or HP box.

13

The BIOS you may need to upgrade is not the PC BIOS, but the video BIOS that is on the video card itself.

Other than that, you may have another PCI card in your system that is sharing resources with the video card that is slowing it down. Try removing all your other PCI cards briefly to see if that makes a difference. If it does, put them back in one at a time until the problem reappears and then you will have the culprit.

14

I seem to remember the following from when I intalled a new video card (ATI Radeon AGP) into my HP.

The video card’s manual specifically mentioned that for some HP models, the video display was to be reset to a default VGA mode before installing the new card.

Only then would the new card install correctly.

I don’t know if this only applies to ATI cards, but you could check out the ATI website. I’d check my manual for you, but it’s in Texas, and I’m in the middle of the Gulf of Mexico right now :frowning:

dietrologia - I feel your pain, I’ve double posted twice today with time outs - I think Cecil has fallen asleep on the keyborad screwing up access for us mortals.

15

Aha! If by “device manager” you mean Windows’ device manager, that means that your onboard video is not disabled. I’m not sure that this would affect your video speed, but there’s a good chance that it would. If there’s nothing in the BIOS to disable it, then there is hopefully a jumper on the motherboard. My (somewhat limited) experience with HP machines has taught me that their motherboard jumpers are usually clearly labeled, so you might first remove your cover and take a look at the jumpers. If you can’t find it, have a look at your PC’s support site:

http://www.hp.com/cposupport/prodhome/hppavilion19152.html

and see if you can find anything. Note: there may not be any way to disable the onboard video (I’ve seen this on some mass-market machines) and you might be stuck with slow video performance.

16

Jeff,

I see what you’re saying. Yes, that seems to make sense, because if you adjust the fsb above 150, the multiplier will kick down to 1/3.

Ambumax,

That’s all the help I can give you. Is this possibly an overheating issue? Someone else would have to weigh in on overheating problems with voodoo cards and K6 systems.

For the record, I’m in hearty agreement with Jeff that Dell systems are not tweak-friendly. In fact (according to personal experience), do not buy a Dell system with hopes of upgrading the internal components. Upgrading the mobo is a nightmare… the power supply is proprietary and is incompatible with non-dell boards… ecc memory issues… a bios that doesn’t allow for clock tweaks… the list is endless.