They just signed Kareem Hunt. I thought no team would be low enough to want him. I was wrong!
Oh for fucks sake. I’m not even saying this as a Browns fan, because I said what Kareem did was no big deal when it was a news story originally.
He fucking pushed a girl over who kept trying to instigate him into a fight. The guy could’ve fucking murdered her in 1 second in any number of ways if he wanted to. Yes, he could’ve walked away from the situation, but the actual assault against her was the most minor thing he could’ve done for her.
The reason he was cut from KC wasn’t even that he did this thing, because it wasn’t that big a deal. It was because he lied about the details of several incidents, breaking the trust the FO had in him.
What Kareem Hunt did was about 1/5000th as bad as what Ray Rice did, but you’re going to act like this is a crime against humanity?
This is just agenda-driven outrage and possibly virtue signalling.
One of the 32 teams was bound to sign Hunt. Unless you expected Hunt to remain un-signed forever?
He pushed and kicked a woman, and was held back a number of times when he tried to go after her. There’s plenty of places where you can go see the video. It for sure wasn’t “no big deal”. It was assault. Believing that this isn’t ok bhavior is not virtue signalling. It is being a f::cking human being.
(Edit this was in response to Senor beef’s post)
Maybe so. In which case they should expect some questioning of the decision, and having to eat some shit for it. My Steelers retained Rothlisberger after some (alleged) incidents. These incidents were not on tape and difficult to prove, but they still got a fair bit of grief for retaining him. Appropriately so, IMO. Had these incidents been on tape or proven beyond reasonable (i.e. not die-hard, willfully blind fan-level) doubt, retaining him would have been inexcusable.
0:41 he shoves her. This woman is calling him a nigger, and he pushes her away from him in a very casual way.
She continues to talk towards him aggressively, you can see it in her posture.
At 0:43, he pushes his friend away for trying to restrain him. At that point, the woman hits Kareem in the face.
At 0:50, his friends drag him away, two of the women aggressively follow them in, probably still shouting slurs.
At 0:57, one of the women push Kareem’s friend, who was trying to counter-instigate. This push throws him off-balance into the woman, behind him, that his friend is trying to get out of the fucking hotel room because she’s there to instigate more of a fight. The rebound from this collision knocks both that guy and the woman he was trying to prevent from approaching closer onto the ground.
Both of those things were brought on by the aggressiveness of the group of women. In one case, the guy further outside of the room simply put himself between her and the door so she couldn’t advance. In the other case, the woman had managed to get her way into the room still screaming, and the other friend was dragging her out of the room.
At 1:06, Kareem comes back out with an aggressive posture, with one of them women holding him back. At 1:11, he gives the woman that punched him in the face the most fucking token half-hearted kick I’ve ever seen, which wouldn’t injure a toddler.
What video are you guys watching?
If I was following Kareem Hunt into his hotel room, shouting “NIGGER” at him, while his friends tried to keep me away, do you think he’d settle for giving me this token light kick? No, he’d fucking destroy me. Oh, but I’m a man, and I’m strong enough to defend myself, right? Not against a fucking 22 year old NFL running back. That guy would probably kick the shit out of me with only slightly more difficulty than he would do it to that woman.
The group of women acted far more aggressively towards Kareem than Kareem and his friends acted towards the group of women. They yelled racial slurs at him. When Kareem and his friends attempted to retreat into his room, the women followed him determined to keep instigating. The removal of the one woman from the room, which looked like a perfectly proportional and necessary amount of force, ended up knocking Kareem’s friend down when he was hit in the back, to which he came back out and tried to intimidate the women into leaving. At this point he could’ve easily destroyed and literally killed any of these women in seconds, but instead gave an extremely half-ass token kick to one.
Acting like this incident is some horrible crime and Hunt should be unemployable and marked for life, and that any team that does employ him deserves total failure, is fucking absurd. Kareem isn’t even the instigator in this incident, he was attacked more than he attacked, and when he did “attack”, it was without any real force or intent to harm.
At no point was the amount of restraint placed upon Hunt sufficient to actually stop him from fighting these women if he wanted to. His friends aren’t going to actually be able to hold him back if he didn’t want to be held back. He responded to aggressive instigation and being hit in the face with an aggressive posture meant to intimidate and a deliberately pathetic half ass kick to one of them.
The group of women were the instigators here, as far as we can tell, and were reported to be shouting racial epithets at the group. That said, I think Kareem and his group of friends actually responded with far less than the average level of reaction you’d get from a group of young black men against an aggressive group of women calling them “nigger”, especially given that Hunt is near the pinnacle of human strength, agility, and fitness and could’ve easily murdered everyone there without putting much effort into it.
Yeah, the Steelers lost me for good when they signed Michael (convicted dog fighter) Vick.
Does he stand for the National Anthem?
Until the investigation concluded at least. I understand wanting to sign him because he’s an amazing back but it’s only been a few months since this broke.
So if the NFL concludes their investigation and gives him a 4 game suspension… at that point, it’s okay for teams to sign him, but before that they deserve perpetual shame and loss?
I read a story in the Cleveland Plain Dealer sports section yesterday (by Mary Kay Cabot) in which she fawned over Browns’ general manager John Dorsey’s faith-based commitment to give “second chances” to problem players (including Tyreek Hill, who choked and punched his pregnant girlfriend, but is now a “model citizen”).
I would’ve asked Dorsey what second chances of this nature he has given to marginal talents, as opposed to stars. :dubious:
I’m with Beef on this one (and I wish the Browns hadn’t signed him because now their RB group is fucking awesome).
The Bengals drafted and signed Joe Mixon…remember him? The 18 year old collegiate player that was being taunted with racial epithets by a white woman and he socked her in the face so hard he fractured it?
That was more egregious than what Hunt did…but Mixon was only 18 years old and has been nothing but contrite since then (and hasn’t gotten into ANY trouble).
Did he not deserve a second chance either?
The newsreader of the video posted in post #6 said, “after they spent the night with friends in a party bus”. I wonder what kind of “party bus” they are referring to? Was this a large SUV owned by one of the participants in this dustup, or did it belong to a profession charter service? Do video’s of the ride exist?
In the hotel hallway video, both sides seem to be pretty aggressive. Both sides seemed to have experience intervening in/breaking up fights.
This is a ridiculously dishonest assessment of that video.
I broke it down second by second. Tell me what I’m not describing correctly.
Personally, I think you’re all discrediting actual domestic violence by trying to pretend that this bullshit is anything like that. People get trapped in abusive, horrible, relationships where they’re bullied, controlled, and hurt by their partner.
To even pretend that some woman hounding the dude, following him into his room when he tries to leave the situation, shouting nigger at him, and punching him in the fucking face, who in return gets a tap that wouldn’t hurt a toddler as if those were similar sorts of crimes, just because it involved a man making contact with a woman, is fucking absurd. I am mystified that anyone thinks this is even within 10 tiers of what Ray Rice, or probably like 25% of NFL players, did.
Because you know actual domestic abuse is probably super common in the NFL, right? A bunch of kids who’ve been told from an early age that they’re king shit, that they can solve their problems with violence, demands them to live up to super testosterone-laden “manly” standards means it’s probably everywhere. People in the NFL kill people with DUIs. They beat their spouses. This is fucking nothing - this is trivial in comparison.
I’m not really sure there’s a lot of value in debating the facts of the case. We’re both looking at the same video, and if you look at it and say “no big deal” (as you do) and I look at it and say “yes, big deal” (as I do), I think we’ve sort of reached the end of the line on that conversation. We disagree, and that’s OK.
I do, thought, want to comment on the two sentences quoted above. First of all, yes, what Kareem Hunt did is not as bad as what Ray Rice did. But: (1) no one is using the phrase “crime against humanity” in either case. If asked to describe what Kareem Hunt did, I’d say “assault.” If asked to describe what Ray Rice did, I’d say “assault of significantly greater severity.” But (2) “what Person X did is not as bad as what Person Y did” is not a valid defense of Person X’s actions.
More importantly, though, the second sentence. This is becoming an epidemic, not just from you but all over the place, and I don’t know why this instance of it got under my skin but it did and so here we are. Claiming that anyone who disagrees with you is either “agenda-driven” or “virtue signalling” is bad faith arguing at its worst. Please stop doing it. I disagree with you about Kareem Hunt, but I have no particular agenda and I’m definitely not virtue signalling (whatever the hell that actually means). But having watched the video, I see no particular reason why he deserves a spot in the NFL and his association with the product makes me less interested in consuming it. You disagree with me - and again, that’s fine - but why do you assume I’ve come by my opinion any less honestly than you came by yours?
First off…no tape exists with audio. So you’re taking the racial epithets only on Hunt’s word. May or may not have happened.
More glaringly, you entirely characterized this as some NFL player acting in self-defense and acting with restraint. Nevermind the part where he went out of his way to get in a good kick when she’s on the ground and doing nothing.
The whataboutism that you’re spouting is fucking ridiculous. In today’s new climate, it’s a real problem.
Explain to me, using detailed observations from the video, what specifically he did that was so outrageous, so egregious, that he should be denied a career in the NFL.
Feel free to break it down moment by moment as I did, and explain to me what you see that I’m apparently missing.
Also, estimate for me the average number of players on each NFL team who has done something worse than this.
Also, do you think that Hunt’s reaction is less than, the same, or more than what you would expect out of the average young black man who has a woman following him (even into his room as he retreated), hitting him in the face, and shouting “NIGGER” at him?
Do you think the kick he gave to her could’ve possibly resulted in injury? What percentage of his potential strength do you think he’s using to take that action? Do you feel that it was a serious attempt to harm the woman?
More questions, if you don’t mind:
What would you think if this video was identical, but it was a group of men instead of women who were instigating the fight?
Do you feel like Kareem demonstrated restraint in the situation at any point?
Do you feel that he retreated but was continually hounded anyway, at any point?
Do you think at any point he was attempting to disengage from the situation but could not do so because of the tenacity of the instigators?
These are open to anyone.
Again, I’m not interested in going through this moment by moment with you. We’re both looking at the same things; is there really any chance that I’m going to convince you or that you’re going to convince me? All I’m trying to say is that it shitty to imply that other people arrived at their opinions about this less honestly than you arrived at your own.
I don’t know. It’s not relevant. The existence of worse things does not make a bad thing better. Freddy Got Fingered exists, but Batman v. Superman was still a bad movie.