I mean, it’s obviously an unreasonable demand, but yeah, that would be good. First, though, you’d have to define “this type of behavior”. Broadly speaking, it sounds like this tour idea failed due to clashes of personality and egos. So what I’d really be interested in is evidence that this sort of inability to cooperate to organize effectively is more prevalent in the progressive movement than elsewhere, and/or that progressive ideology instills such counterproductive behavior in people who wouldn’t otherwise be inclined to it.
That thin and cracking veneer is all you’ve got left.
The thin and cracking veneer (I agree, good description!) of civility on LHOD’s posts is all I have left?
No, the tour failed because all 30 content creators agreed that the PAC founder’s “microaggressions” were severe enough that they had to cut ties.
Is that the point of contention I should cite?
And once again he lies through “interpretation”. Did this shit actually work in grade school?
At this point we would be happy if you provided a cite that it rained in Spain.
…what?
Are you Ok?
Obviously and unsurprisingly you don’t. Your ego would never allow you to, because then you would have to admit that you were fucking up.
He’s repeatedly offered to post links to this Zoom call about microaggression. Nobody has indicated any interest in sitting through them.
I’d like to see (hear?) the microaggression in question, out of curiosity. I’m not willing to watch the whole call though; these people sound insufferable.
And you, presumably having watched the tape, feel that these people were grossly overreacting. So do you think progressives are more likely than other people to grossly overreact to stuff? If so, why?* If not, why is citing these people’s bad behavior relevant to a broader case against “progressivism”?
- I don’t mean “why do you think that?”, since you clearly feel you have a sufficient body of anecdotal evidence to make a judgment. I’m asking if you think progressivism makes people overreact, or if overly reactive people are drawn to the progressive movement for some other reason?
* behaviour.
And yes, sorry to say, you often come across as an arsehole. I absolutely disagree with much of your political commentary - obviously I’ve seen this mostly in Israel/Palestine threads.
I know a few Israelis - and I assume you are one, though you apparently live in the US - have a reputation for being blunt, but perhaps introducing some nuance would help a little more civilised dialogue.
I do want to check on this. When I say an argument is bullshit, I do not intend, directly or indirectly, to accuse someone of dishonesty. I’m just saying they’re making a terrible argument. Do you read “that argument is bullshit” as an accusation of dishonesty? It’s genuinely not what I meant: I take accusations of dishonesty very seriously, and apologize if that’s how it came across.
Uh, no, I was offering to link Dean explaining that the reason the tour is being cancelled is due to the microaggressions and all thirty content creators agreeing they were so severe that nobody should continue working with the organizer, to challenge your claim here:
It didn’t fail due to a clash of personality and ego, it failed because people decided the organizer and source of funding to the event was a horrible racist who needed to be cut off.
Dean explains all of this on a Livestream of his own, which can be accessed by people who have the TikTok app. I’m not one of them, so I had to rely on what I can find with Google, which is someone (who I think is saying his apology sucks because he didn’t call Zee out before his first stop on the tour, even though he found out about her microaggression the day before):
The original video starts with him explaining it, and then having a bunch of his “orbiters” on to share different perspectives (mostly to question him on why he didn’t speak up sooner). If you’d really like me to, I can download TikTok again and see if I can find a link to his full Live, but if the Chinese government comes for the data on my phone I’m blaming you! 
Yeah, obviously. That’s the understatement of the year.
They’re more likely to grossly overreact to supposed microaggressions, yes.
They’re far less likely to grossly overreact to other things, like blasphemy or non traditional gender roles.
Because the specific thing they’re overreacting to is being overreacted to because of their ideology. Likewise, when right wing people grossly overreact to, I don’t know, a race swapped fictional character in a movie adaptation of a book, that has to do with their ideology.
That’s a chicken and egg question. I’m sure the answer is “both”.
Yeah, I didn’t mean anyone literally believes in an oppression pyramid. I mean they have a massive double standard in how they treat individuals and groups, seemingly or explicitly depending on whether they feel the group in question is more oppressed or privileged in a given situation.
Examples are aggressively calling out antisemitism from (right-wing) white people, but giving it a pass or excusing it from brown Muslims. The different reactions to a woman who says she is afraid of frat boys vs one who says she’s afraid of mentally-ill homeless men on the subway. How normalised it is to criticise Christians and Christianity, vs the care taken not to criticise Islam too much or to blame Islamic extremism on Muslims in general.
Considering who is in power right now, and who is being, officially and unofficially, demonized, “normalized” is not a word I would use.
BTW, do you know the difference between “punching up” and “punching down”?
I don’t suppose any of these people actually issue written statements? You have to sit through their TikToks to find out what they think? I guess I will never know what they think, then, because I don’t have the attention span for it.
But, yes, if you can link to Dean or someone concisely explaining what these “microaggressions” were, and if this explanation seems ridiculous to me even without hearing the other side of the story, that would go a long way toward establishing your point.
Yeah - you can punch up at people who are lower on the oppression pyramid then you, but you shouldn’t punch down at people who are higher up on the oppression pyramid.
That’s the sort of thing no one believes in, right?
Then I suppose you won’t ever know much about the spaces Zoomers are in.
That’s not meant glibly - but no, you’re correct, none of these people issue written statements. Very few of them even put out a concise video summary of what they’ve been talking about. Almost everything is long form conversations on Livestreams. The closest to a concise statement you can get is a clip.
I don’t have any clips of Dean and Co. explaining the microaggressions - in their space, accusing someone of “severely microaggressing against several BIPOC women” is detailed enough.
There are some clips of the supposed microaggressions, but having listened to them I can hardly tell what the supposed microaggressions are.
“Oppression pyramid”?