So the soul isn’t why you dislike abortion, and here:
http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=16462669&postcount=329
You said:
So what is it counselor? It’s not the brain, it’s not the soul, so why is killing a fetus bad, exactly?
Human DNA? If so, can we excise cancerous tumors? They have DNA and no brain and no soul.
Wisconsin already requires a “counseling session” and 24 hour waiting period. If there are women who really do not understand that being pregnant means there’s an embryo in their uterus (something covered in health class when I was in school in Wisconsin, but perhaps educational standards have declined under Walker), perhaps this could be mentioned to them at the mandatory counseling session. If simply being told isn’t as effective in changing women’s minds as being forced to submit to an unnecessary, unwanted, and unpleasant medical procedure then maybe it’s not the information that’s making the difference but rather the inconvenience, embarrassment, and discomfort.*
But if the mandatory ultrasound does result in a significant drop in abortions in Wisconsin, I doubt it will be because a lot of women changed their minds. I suspect it will be because requiring an additional pre-abortion procedure complicated things on the clinic end enough that they weren’t able to take as many patients.
*I’ve never been pregnant, but I have had an ultrasound of my uterus for legitimate medical reasons. The ultrasound itself doesn’t hurt, but it has to be done with a very full bladder and “holding it” that long is painful and stressful. I was willing to put up with this because I wanted to make sure there was nothing wrong in there, but had this procedure been required of me because the governor didn’t trust I knew how babby was formed I’d have been figuratively and perhaps literally pissed.
So, according to you, we shouldn’t have a safety net that helps care for the least among us because that’s forcing people adhere to Christian doctrine?
If you look up the definition of “opposite” you might find your post next to the one you quoted.
The funny thing, of course., is that people like you would be the first to cry foul if you were subject to the consequences of your own philosophy.
How would you like it if you were on trial some day and your judge had quotes from the Koran posted on the wall, or you were prohibited from pushing an elevator button from from Friday sunset to Saturday sunset, or in school your kids were required to recite prayers from a different religion than yours?
Okay, then, yes, “in this case” a minority of hard-right woman-haters have pushed and enacted of anti-abortion measures which certainly appear to be against the will of a majority of the people there. See Abortion, a losing issue for Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker Is that close enough to “in this case” for you?
“Stray off the desired path”? Really? Many, if not most, of the republicans pulling this crap ran for office, and got elected, on a “jobs, jobs, jobs” platform. (And “Run! Gay Marriage” and “Guns: Cold Dead Hands, yadda, yadda”.) And I simply cannot believe that a “feature” of our electoral system is that we expect, or even anticipate, that those elected might ignore the will of the majority - NOT the minority! Forget the “precise will of the people at any point.” That’s just nitpicking and you know know it. The elected republicans have gone way, way off the deep end and they have used all manner of slimy underhanded chicanery to do it.
God willing (He got Obama re-elected, didn’t he? 
), they’ll be voted out of office asap. And IMO, it cannot be soon enough.
Yeah, that’s right, because only Christians would ever think to have a safety net that helps care for the least among us. :rolleyes: Because nobody ever took care of people that needed help until Christ was born, and nobody in non-Christian countries ever take care of people that need help.
Good thing our fine Christian legislators voted for the SNAP food stamp program. Oh, wait…
Good point, Lobohan. Could it be a beating heart? Probably not since scientists can create a beating human heart in a petri dish. And I’m pretty sure nobody’s introduced legislation to save those.
It would not at all surprise me if most Americans were against this type of law. But the Virginia legislature was duly elected by the Virginia electorate, and legislatures pass laws all the time that the majority is against. There is nothing special here, the good folks of VA can kick the bums out next election cycle. And I don’t say that as an empty threat. The Republicans are either 1) idiots who don’t realize that their antiquated ideas on sex and abortion will seriously affect their electoral changes; or 2) Serious fanatics who value ideology over electoral success.
This is a stupid, stupid law, and in the long wrong may actually bring some change in the direction most of us would like to see as people get tired of having Republicans try and get abortions banned or curtail their availability beyond what the people really want.
It is already difficult to accurately quantify abortion incidence per state because women can just go out of state (hence counted in that state’s statistics). It would be even more challenging to measure the impact of sonogram laws, as abortion rates in the US have been generally declining since the mid-90’s (attributed to greater access and use of contraceptives). So, how to attribute a decline directly related to viewing a sonogram, when women can go out of state for an abortion, or over the border to buy misoprostol in a Mexican pharmacy or purchase it over the internet?
If the limited evidence available about the impact of mandatory waiting periods, which require an additional in person visit before the procedure (like the sonogram law), is any indication:
That’s got zero to do with my post. The point is that just because a philosophical position might be shared by a religion, it doesn’t make the position a religious one.
Now, do you care to comment on the points I actually have made?
You’re making my point for me. Thanks!!!
Happy to help those what need it.
I admit I haven’t chatted with magellan in a while, but I don’t recall him being this stupid.
I’m sure my memory is at fault and his stupidity level is constant.
And that exact point is what the post you tried to disagree with made.
For example, atheists think murder is wrong even though it is one of the 10 Commandments. On the other hand, trying to make the 1st Commandment into law would be difficult to defend.
I don’t see any difficulty in defending a prohibition on interference with the internal development of alien civilizations. Pretty good idea, actually
That’s the Prime Directive. The 1st Commandment is “A robot may not injure a human being or, through inaction, allow a human being to come to harm.”
I had a pelvic ultrasound a few months ago to see if there was something wrong down south (there wasn’t), and you’re right—it is horrendously painful and nerve-wracking to hold 32 oz. in one’s bladder ahead of time and then until they’re done with the procedure. I nearly threw up afterwards from the stress.
Not that people like Walker or Bricker even give a flying urinal about such matters.
Cite. Please point to this post you claim you made. Perhaps I was in error. Or we’re referring back to two different posts.
Yeah, TWO posts. TWO POSTS! Not one post, but TWO POSTS!
An update:
After some consideration of this issue, I wish to revise my position.
I still support the ultrasound requirement, as long as the law gives the option of either kind of transducer. I no longer support a law that requires only a vaginal transducer.
I no longer support a law that requires both a surgical facility AND hospital admitting privileges. I see no reason to believe those requirements are anything more a pretextual attempt to stop abortions by imposing onerous requirements, and not in any way a good-faith attempt to stop abortions by convincing anyone that an abortion stops a human life.