Dude, people have emotions. A man whose wife or partner has an abortion is not all that different from a man whose wife or partner has a miscarriage. Would you say the same thing about a man grieving in the latter case? It isn’t necessary for us to give up our humanity so that no one questions a certain political position that you favor.
Nobody laments a blood clot, you fucking douchebag. What the man in this hypothetical situation is lamenting is the loss of a potential child, the same thing that the women in the OP are lamenting and the same thing that parents lament when a woman experiences an early miscarriage. Because I have observed from your responses in other threads that you do appear to have more than two brain cells to rub together, I can only presume that you are aware of this and yet made a conscious choice to be a total fucking douchebag.
I agree pretty much wholeheartedly with the sentiments of the OP, by the way. Just not Diogenes’ little pile of stinking shit that he felt the need to drop in the middle of the thread.
Thank you. Not that I find what you said in the least realistic; it won’t happen, but the sentiment is very much appreciated.
We (Planned Parenthood) are currently in the throes of 40 Days for Life part 2, and although for the most part these people are non confrontational and respectful, there are some who have asked me to “please find somewhere else to work.”
:eek:
WHAT?? Find huh…? I’m not allowed to say anything to these people, but there are several responses that crowd my mind whenever they say this. “But I love my job…” is usually the first, with your response “And how many almost aborted babies have you adopted?” being somewhere in the mix.
Well, NOW you tell me!
One of the things that saddens me is the fact that so few of our patients return after their procedure for their post AB counseling. We set those appointments up so that we can not only verify the patient is healthy physically and has suffered no ill effects or an infection, but also to help her through the emotional trauma she’s likely suffering.
I believe scones in the UK are generally not sweetened, and that
UK “scone” = southern US “biscuit”
Sweetened US scones are an abomination because they don’t carry the clotted cream and jam as well.
“The loss of a potential child?” What the fuck does that mean? If the potential is never realized then there never was a child and nothing was “lost.” “Potential” is another word for “imaginary.” It’s asinine for the man to try to act like he lost anything. The only reason to lament a miscarriage would be sympathy for the woman who wanted the pregnancy, not for some fucking non-sentient tissue. If the woman chooses to terminate, then there’s nothing to lament. Nothing bad happened. The man lost nothing. Only a self absorbed asswipe would go around marking “birthdays” for a clump of cells (and that’s all that it is, anything else is just magical thinking) that his girlfriend chose to remove from her body.
Yeah, men don’t get to have any feelings at all until after the birth process is complete. What was I thinking? :smack:
Were you completely uninterested in the fetus while you’re wife was pregnant, Dio? You felt absolutely nothing for your future child?
Many men disagree with you. And I have to tell you, not all the women who show up on procedure days are alone. Many of them are accompanied by their SO’s, almost all of whom appear to me to be caring, supportive men who recognize the necessity for the abortion, but still feel some emotional response.
I don’t expect men to feel nothing over what is a very difficult choice. It isn’t asinine that they feel they’ve lost something; what they are giving up and going through isn’t as physical as the woman in the procedure room, but it is still real. I would also posit that those (usually very young) men will some day make excellent fathers. Far better than the jerks who deposit their girlfriends scared and alone at the clinic, then run through the parking lot later to pick them up.
My wife is pregnant again right now. As always. My concerns are entirely for her. I won’t have another child until it’s born. If she were to hypothetically miscarry [knock on wood] All I would care about is my wife. I would not feel that I had lost a child. I don’t think that way. I don’t confuse fantasy with reality.
They’re not giving up anything. Good for them that they’re there for their wives/girlfriends/whatevers, but they can’t “lose” something that never existed.
Kinda like your empathy?
Congratulations to you both.
I don’t believe you. If I did, I’d have to conclude that you were an inhuman monster.
Empathy for what? I feel like I’m being asked to feel empathy for people who are grieving the death of fictional television characters or imaginary friends. These “children” only ever existed in these people’s imaginations.
I’m actually empathetic to a fault. I just know the difference between what can actually suffer and what can’t.
You’re expecting emotion to be logical. Does it matter if they are giving up something physically themselves? They see potential, and it hurts. That’s all that matters. If we ran our clinic based on your assertion, we would be the monstrous baby-killing machine the anti choice crowd portrays us to be.
But we’re not talking about whether or not a fetus can suffer. Men whose wives or partners are pregnant, and who anticipate having a child after 9 months are naturally going to feel an emotional loss if something happens to prevent that. In fact, it would illogical to assume otherwise. People build up expectations for all sorts of things, and are usually disappointed and saddened if those expectations aren’t realized. Whether that’s about buying a house, going on vacation, or having a child-- it’s the same emotion.
A fetus becomes a human by a process, not during an event. By your reasoning, a guy should feel no sense of loss if the baby dies during the delivery process. I can’t think of any men that I know who would not.
You are a very strange man.
Yes Dio, feelings are such simple things.
You’re being a bit of an ass here, and it’s not at all becoming to you.
I can sympathize with their disappointment (and this recently happened to a couple very close to me), I just can’t conceptualize it as a literal loss of a child.
Loss during delivery is quite a different scenario than a miscarriage (which usually occurs within the first 6 weeks of pregnancy) and is certainly not analogous to a voluntary termination of pregnancy during the first trimester. I’m just not capable of humoring the pretense that the loss (especially the voluntary loss) of a non-sentient clump of cells is exactly the same tragedy as the loss of a real, born child. People seeking equal sympathy for the former are insulting those who have genuinely suffered through the latter.
Really? Every recipe I have calls for sugar. And usually butter instead of shortening or lard.
But before I further derail a perfectly good pitting I think I’d better take this somewhere else.
If I’m being asked to sympathize with it, I do. Is that so bad?
Of course it does.
Potential exists only in the imagination. If if it’s never realized, it’s never real.