Sure it does, for most of herd-of-kids-they-can’t-afford people I see the filing for either isn’t the end result of a sudden unplanned, catastrophic event but simply the culmination of a series of ill-advised financial investments or of a long-term ailment. Either of which should have telegraphed at some point that of all things they wouldn’t be able to afford was to keep on having babies. Sure, sometimes sudden unplanned, catastrophic events do happen, e.g. accidental death of a money-making spouse, out-of-the-blue crippling stroke, whatever, but they are generally the exception to the rule.
Of course. And as mendacious little petty bureaucrats, you and your co-worker must pass judgement on the clients’ worthiness to receive someone else’s largesse, as well as there worthiness to possess their own children, because your co-worker’s physical condition is their fault. Followed of course by a discussion of how ungrateful they always are.
One of our “yes, lets adopt” critical moments came when I realized I was avoiding too many of these people and situations, and having really bitter feelings toward people I liked - all at the expense of my valued friendships. But we never had an overwhelming biological imperative to breed, so perhaps we moved through that much quicker than others (though when we first got on the fertility rollercoaster, we expected to conceive or remain childless - so it was there). Years later, I regret missing a few showers because I was so caught up in my own drama that I couldn’t be there - it seems so selfish now…though at the time sitting there was really painful.
Got that right. Somebody has to step up to the plate, wanker.
Yeah, well, it’s tough to have a system without people to run it, wouldn’t you say?
I know exactly what your going through. My wife and I have been trying to concieve for about, 15 months or so now. We’ve gone to doctors, tried medications, we just finished our third month of in-uteral insemination… which failed. We have an appointment with a reproductive specialist on Friday the 9th. I have high hopes for it, unlike most of the issues I’ve heard, the problem is with me, the male, not with my wife. So hopefully we will get a positive result.
You don’t have to respond to this but, if you have a low count or poor motility, our reproductive endocrinologist told me to take One-a-day vitamins for men. My swimmers were at an OK level before. After I started on the vitamins the count increased and they were more active. The nurse said she had never seen a count as high as mine! Yeah, I bragged about that for a while.
I went back and forth for a while. Leave this one alone or blast the fucking shit out of the insensitivity.
You disgusting slime, awaken from your petty little selfish infantile “me, me, me, me, me, me, me, me” world to slither out from wallowing in self-pity and pit parents for no reason other than a self-centric view of the universe, incognizant of others’ sufferings and while lashing out at the woes which normal life bestows on all, would – willfully or through gross negligence – awaken again the deep felt loss.
I cannot but point out to this poster child of clueless insensitivity that whatever self-imagined lows of life that the poster has seen, she is so much better than a greater share of the more than 6.5 billion inhabitants of the world.
You whimper like a beaten dog for the price which you must buy another human being, but where, pray god, do you think these children come from? Do they grow on trees? Do you think that any child thrown up for the largest bidder is there because his or her choice?
Yes, indeed, I can’t tell you how many peasants I met in China or Vietnam who were growing babies for rich Northern Americans, and couldn’t wait to sell their flesh and blood to the highest bidder.
** xnylder**, you pit my wife and I because we can get pregnant, but we’ve buried our child. Fuck you! Fuck you! Fuck you! Fuck you! Fuck you! You ask for pity because you would have to spend money and decorate the baby’s room. Try decorating the baby’s room and then bringing home ashes to place in it. Who in god’s green earth do you think you are?
Maybe it’s best that you can’t have children. Fuck off.
Thanks, but it seems my problem has something to do with varacose (spelling?) veins. I also have been taking my vitamins for awhile now.
No you fucking despicable little cunt, it’s crushingly depressing to have a child who dies on you. Pit my wife for her ability to bear children, and then run away when she wants to end her life to be with that child in the after life.
Oh, I’m so sorry, I’m supposed to feel sorry for you because you can’t buy children as cheap as you think they should be. Sorry folks, slavery ended a while back. You can’t get that fire sale you wanted? What? A life is expensive because it costs $20,000? You have no idea how precious live is? Take that fucking money and burn it bitch.
Paint that bedroom in blue because you know it’s a boy, then bring home ashes, which, by the way, come in one color – a light shade of grey – and see if they fucking match that room. If they don’t, then pit other parents for fate which brings them children whose colors match their rooms.
You aren’t ready for a puppy, let along a child. Fuck off.
How much does a new born child weigh? How much does an infant’s ashes weigh?
You pit my wife who can conceive, but only show pity for yourself, with not a single thought for those who bare children only to hold them while they die.
How sad that you can’t buy children cheap, that they would cost as much as a car. You have no idea the value of life. You are the lowest of the low. You are the scum of the world to pit my wife who brought my son into the world for his 400 minutes of life.
Seriously, if you can only think of yourself, you are better off without children.
TokyoPlayer,
Given that I have friends who are in the same situation as you, only completely different, I’ve been thinking of typing a post starting with “You know, getting pregnant is only the first hurdle. Staying pregnant for 9 months is the next one, and still doesn’t guarentee a healthy baby.”
But my friends are lucky. They already have two healthy children, and have been assured by the doctors that whatever it was that caused their third child to develop improperly is a fluke, not something with a 25% chance of occurring with any future pregnancies. Still, they have struggled and grieved through the last several months before the baby was born. They held their baby and loved him as long as he lived (a few hours). And now, they must deal with the emotions that come from having a pregnancy but not a baby.
I don’t blame the OP for being frustrated because life is not fair. But that doesn’t give the OP unlimited rights to rage at other people. Especially those who have done nothing to harm her.
TokyoPlayer, get some therapy. Never hurts.
Jesus you’re a jerk.
While I too did a :dubious: at the OP, and got my hackles raised, I still feel that TokyoPlayer’s response was waaaaaay over the top. Losing a child must be the most painful thing that can happen to a person (I can’t begin to imagine how devastating it would be) but pain and hurting should not be used as a game of one-upmanship.
Certainly, one can rail at the attitude of the OP, but to claim that her experiences are necessarily invalid because yours are worse is wrong IMHO.
Hey TokyoPlayer I just wanted you to know I’m sorry for your loss. Reading your words gave me a sharper and clearer sense of appreciation for everything I have been given in my life… and I don’t even have kids. There aren’t really words for this kind of thing, but that’s all I really have right now, being that this is a message board. If we were face to face and we didn’t have to speak, the communication would be much clearer, I assure you…
hugs & Olives,
Christy
To the OP, okay I didn’t want to touch this with a ten foot pole… it’s going to be a few years before we have children, but even then we’re planning on adoption, so infertility shouldn’t be an issue. The fact is I can’t relate to what you’re going through and I probably will never be able to, but it’s clear you’re in pain and I’m sorry for that.
But I can’t let go that your response to spending $20,000 on an adoption likened it to getting a bad bargain. I mean come on.
That’s such a complete and total objectification of human life it really actually… I mean it disgusts me. And it also rings totally false, because if you’re willing to spend this $20,000 on all these medical treatments to make you fertile, then how is that not exactly the same thing? Is that child somehow of more value because it came out of your womb?
If you truly feel that way… I just don’t get it.
Look, I’ve had a lot of painful experiences, I’ve lived in a world where it seems at times that everybody else has it better than me and doesn’t appreciate it. And me thinking that way was of course, utter bullshit. Everyone experiences pain and suffering.
The great Viktor Frankl, who survived the Holocaust (though his wife didn’t) has remarked something along the lines of, “Suffering is like a gas. The tiniest amount will fill the largest spaces of the soul.” This was a man who saw and experienced unspeakable atrocities, and yet he would sit down with a client, a man who was depressed because he lost his job, and truly feel empathy for that man’s suffering… and despite all he had been through, he was adamant that the thread of suffering is a burden we all share, something that unites us.
I tried to take a lesson from that, and let go, and appreciate what I do have. Yes, there are people who can conceive and take it for granted… but conception doesn’t mean the same thing to them as it does to you, so it’s a moot point. Maybe they got raped in a back alley when they were 12, who knows? Maybe they resent you for having a husband who doesn’t beat you.
Whatever you do with your pain, I beg of you, don’t let it make you bitter. It won’t do the world any favors to have more bitterness. The key is to be open to the pain, to feel it fully and accept is as an inescapable part of life, so that the next time you see someone else hurting, you remember what it was like and you use that empathy to reach out to them in compassion. It’s a tall order, hard to do, but I think we all have a responsibility to at least try.
'Cause you know, prenatal care, baby deliveries, and hospitals stays for mom and baby are free for all women who can conceive naturally. :rolleyes:
For recommending therapy after a tragic loss? I wasn’t being snide you idiot.
I’m with olivesmarch4th. I’m more bothered by the whining about the adoption costs. And I’m guessing it was the “but I don’t wanna spend money on a nursery but not be guaranteed a baby!” shit that set Tokyo Player off. Many people who lose their newborns come home to an empty, decorated nursery, and a fortune in bills. And they’ve got an actual (as opposed to theoretical) child to mourn.