So, it would be genocide if only someone would accuse France of genocide too?
Israel is an imposed political entity based on a religious belief that other people’s land belongs to a group of people that happened to be born from a specific female’s genital pathway.
The rest is just religious intolerance, hate and mental disorder.
You were just told to stop spewing this line, (or provide evidence for it that applies to more than a tiny minority of Israelis). You are about to start collecting Warnings for trolling.
[ /Moderating ]
I’m sorry, I don’t mean to upset people. I will refrain from posting in Israel related posts on this forum.
As a last call, the claim of divine purpose of particular people inhabiting a particular land is irrefutable. This is what I was referring to and commenting about.
Take care. I’m out of Israeli occupation talk 
Probably must have meant ethnic cleansing. BTW, France got a lot of heat during the Algerian war precisely because of its actions.
But I guess France should have followed the path suggested here by other posters and tell the world to go fuck itself with its moral reprimands.
Nor did anyone say they were. Embracing terror and death in the cause of tribalist territorialism is shameful. Refusing to learn from the past is shameful.
The facts scream that they displaced themselves, and to places that others had been displaced from earlier. Now what does their being Jews have to do with it? How is that not just more special pleading?
Using strawmen and excluded middles is, too. Something else that’s shameful is placing all blame and all responsibility for the continued lack of peace there on the Palestinians. The latter has been seen in this thread, the former has not.
Not as shameful as making shit up.
A. What good faith? and B. “Anxious”? :p:p:p
Here’s a clue for you: That’s how democracy works. Is Israel a democracy? Do its people accept responsibility for its government and the policies they have chosen?
Which is what we see in every statement placing all that blame and responsibility on the Palestinians.
Here’s a fine example of that:
You’re the first person in this thread to resort to such a claim of bigotry.
More of your excuse-making.
Here’s more explanation for you: Criticizing the policies of a country’s current government is neither bashing nor a criticism of the country, or an ethnic slur against its people. To make that claim is to totally relinquish any remaining claim you may have to be willing to discuss those policies in anything resembling good faith. It’s simply “Israel, fuck yeah!” with more syllables.
Now do kindly drop the totally-unsupported claims of bigotry you’ve just made here and get back on topic, will you please? :dubious:
The irony of that paragraph.
So yes, you have indeed not learned anything except that “It’s our turn now, baby!” Thanks for the confirmation, at least.
What a shame.
I think you’re being a bit unfair to Naxos by suggesting he was so ignorant that he thought ethnic cleansing constituted genocide.
I’m also a bit confused by the suggestion that France should have “told the world to fuck off” where it’s conduct in Algeria was concerned.
That’s what they did and that’s why Degaulle campaigned on the slogan “Algeria Francais”(sp).
France eventually pulled out because they lost, not because they gave in to international opinion.
You’re placing the responsibility of the lives of Israelis* and *Palestinians on Netanyahu. That’s pretty ridiculous, but since you seem to side with the PLO, I can’t really argue with you much further. There’s nothing to say. You buy into the myth that a bunch of Jews arrived in Palestine and drove out these poor Arabs who were just minding their olive trees.
edit : @ elvis
Well, I’m sure De Gaulle wouldnt have campaigned with a pidgin slogan. He probably would have used French.
That’s certainly not what they did. There was considerable international pressure, especially from the US, on France during the Algerian war.
France pulled out because of international pressure, internal pressure and the costs associated with the war (financial and moral). The FLN hardly ever scored any military victories, but that’s not the point when you’re fighting an anti-colonial/guerilla war.
Aside from its general incoherence, the point of this statement is still something that applies to only a tiny minority of Israelis. It is not so much “irrefutable” as irrelevant. Since you have nothing but unsupported assertions to make on the topic, staying out of these threads is probably a good idea.
This was during the period when France was simply telling the U.S. to drop dead on a whole host of issues. I am afraid trhat you are going to have to document any “international pressure” and just how it affected French decisions. Being forced out by internal pressure and cost is pretty much the definition of “losing” a guerrilla war–just as the U.S. and U.S.S.R. found in Vietnam and Afghanistan.
Okay. So … What should be the border between Palestine and Israel?
See? Apart of the divine purpose to land grab and kill indiscriminately, there’s nothing else that justifies the Iraeli nation at the geographical area they insist to occupy.
Problems in reading tomndebb? Ibn Warraq’s point seemed to have been that France pulled out of Algeria because of military defeat. Anybody with even superficial knowledge of the Algerian war knows that that war was lost following the now traditional asymetric warfare plot. Which is exactly what I wrote. I dont really understand what your remark adds except some incomprehension of what both **Ibn Warraq **and I have written.
I’m afraid you’re confusing the French 4th Republic and the 5th. If you meant the 5th, it backed the US on a whole lot of issues as well, so then again, I dont really see what your point was supposed to be here.
I’m afraid I wont. I’m kind of surprised that a mod would ask for total derailment of a thread that’s already been derailed on a daily basis. If you or **Ibn Warraq **want to open a thread about the Algerian war, go ahead, I’ll join in.
[QUOTE=Naxos]
See? Apart of the divine purpose to land grab and kill indiscriminately, there’s nothing else that justifies the Iraeli nation at the geographical area they insist to occupy.
[/QUOTE]
You mean, aside from the fact that they were already living there before there was a state of Israel? And leaving aside your fantasy that they have been killing indiscriminately, or that this was all part of some land grab?? Your entire rant here is completely fact free, IOW. Why engage in a discussion where it’s clear you KNOW ABSOLUTELY NOTHING ABOUT??
-XT
Hmm… as I admitted in my post by putting in (sp) I wasn’t sure of the spelling. Yes, the proper phrase was “l’Algérie Française” but I’m not sure why you decide to make such an insult since I admitted that I wasn’t sure how to spell the phrase.
For myself, I’ve never felt the need to be passive-aggressive or catty towards westerners who refer to Muslims saying “Allah Akbar” instead of “Allahu Akbar” but such a comment would have struck me as both insulting and petty.
Also, since you later make such a statement as “Anybody with even superficial knowledge of the Algerian war” I would have figured you’d know what I was referring to, some I’m a bit confused by such an elaborate insult.
Actually, I think you misunderstood what I and Tom said. I simply said “France eventually pulled out because they lost, not because they gave in to international opinion” and tom said the same thing.
You then proclaim that France did not suffer a “military defeat”.
Sorry but that’s the same idiocy peddled by some who receive to recognize that the US got it’s ass spanked in Vietnam by a peasant army, but it did.
No, the US suffered a military defeat in Vietnam, France suffered a military defeat in both Vietnam and Algeria and the Soviet Union suffered a military defeat in Afghanistan.
When an army retreats with it’s tail between it’s legs that’s what’s called a defeat nobody how much some people try to split hairs.
I’m sorry but such a comment shows really gross insensitivity to the plight of actual refugees.
Until the recent immigration from the former Soviet Union the overwhelming majority of Israeli Jews were either Jews who’d been kicked out of Muslim countries or Holocaust refugees with the former outnumbering the latter.
You might as well claim that the Vietnamese boat people, the Miami Cubans, or yes, the Palestinians of Jaffa “displaced themselves”.
Not in any post he presented here.
That you jumped to the conclusion that he meant they were defeated in battle is not my reading error, although you might want to consider reading what is posted rather than what you want others to have said.
So, having declared your intention to leave such threads, you return to post, again, the same baseless claim that you have failed to support?
Show evidence or back off.
Dude, you’re the one that again felt the need to pontificate. You thought going for the French spelling of “French Algeria” would add some cachet and failed at it. No need to feel insulted for a snide remark. And, no, going from English to French or French to English has nothing to do with going from Arabic to English or French. Most of the spelling is settled.
Well, apparently you have yet to learn that you dont need military defeat to actually lose a war.
PS:added for tomndebb, considering **Ibn Warraq **just repeated the exact same statement and you posted after him, I think incomprehension wasnt too harsh a word.
Sigh, I said France didn’t lose due to international pressure and you have yet to provide a shred of evidence to support this but instead have simply responded with insults, which you categorize as “snide remarks”.
Anyone we’re off-topic.
This conversation began by you implying that France should have “told the world to fuck off” by Israeli standards, and I pointed out that France had, as Tom also pointed out, told the World to “fuck off” gave the world the finger when lectured on Algeria and eventually retreated because the Algerians beat them, not because the World wagged their finger at them.
Anyway, this conversation ignores the point the Palestinians do not have a remote chance of kicking the Jews out of Israel and into the sea, or across the Mediterranean the way the Algerians did that same to the Pied Noires(again apologies for any misspellings).