You’re “utterly astounded.” Really? I have a hard time believing you don’t expect such skepticism when telling people you’re a Vampire.
Even assuming the truth of your beliefs, you would be like a Nigerian man who actually does have a fortune in wealth that needs to be transferred to US banks complaining that your e-mails get immediately put in the spam box. I would feel bad for the guy, but I wouldn’t really blame the recipients.
Eh, I’m not sure. I get that most of the vampire stuff isn’t meant to be taken literally and I’m all for pushing the limits of what is considered possible in terms of mentality and mortality, but what I was carping about elsewhere in this thread is based mostly on the superiority that goes part and parcel with the vampire thing.
Illuminatiprimus, as you’ve probably seen in the past, religion gets a pretty hard ride around here. So do people who say they have some kind of secret truth that they won’t share because the rest of us aren’t ready. I know it’s a personal topic, but none of my criticisms were personal and I hope they weren’t taken in that way. As a Satanist you can probably understand my view that the vampire temple is obviously a metaphor. What I was picking on isn’t the goal you appear to be looking for, because I respect that. But the way this particular metaphor is laid out, I have some issues with.
I am always suspicious of a belief system that says “we know the secret to power, wealth, health and pleasure” but then forbid any of their members to discuss it with non-initiates. When I hear that, I don’t think religion, I think multi-level marketing scheme.
Most churches say it’s OK for you to discuss your beliefs with your neighbour or your co-worker.
Also, choosing the name “Vampire” is unfortunate because for most people it means blood-sucking undead / immortal creatures of the night. When you tell someone “I am a Vampire” then they will probably think that you are deluded, unless you accompany it with a definition saying that you are using the word “vampire” in a different way than the common usage. Unless the members of the Temple of the Vampire believe that they really are blood-sucking undead / immortal creatures of the night?
If anything, most of them are a little too okay with it. 
People said the same thing in IP’s “Ask the Satanist” thread, but I think this kind of misses the point. There are some direct parallels to vampirism here and it’s being used both as a selling point and as a metaphor, so if they had made up their own term and supernatural creature, it wouldn’t have the same association.
I can’t speak for these people or pretend to be aware of the exact manner in which they are defining the word “vampire”, but;
I am aware that there are people who use this term in the context of drawing off or stealing energy from other people. This does NOT involve blood, big pointy fangs or goth fantasy.
And if you think that this idea is pure fantasy, then you haven’t met some of the people I’ve met. Hell, every time I’m in the company of my mother, I get seriously tired and start yawning. I feel drained when I leave and I know it isn’t her intent. (She keeps mentioning that I’m always tired, always yawning. I haven’t told her that it’s HER.) My ex-wife was a Sympathy Vampire, creating and feeding off the sympathy of others. My ex and I knew another couple who was seriously intense and very social, and whenever they left, we completely crashed, because they’d whipped up and drained off every ounce of energy we could muster.
Definition wise, there are many definitions of a great many words in the English language. Most of us don’t go around, or expect others to go around citing the exact definition (ie, “Oxford English Dictionary, definition 3”) of said multi-definition words. If you’re confused, ask. If you (generic you) chose to assume a specific definition in order to feed your own need for abusing others, then as I’ve been saying elsewhere on this board recently; that says a lot more about the content of YOUR character than it says about your victim.
This thread provides endless hilarity. Not just because vampire guy can’t talk about being a vampire, but because if that link was a Scientologist link there would be none of the deep consideration of his feelings.
Illuminati put a link out about his silly religion and thus it entered the domain of conversation. I can think of one really easy thing Illuminati could have done to make sure that he didn’t get permanently tagged as ‘that vampire guy’, but it is probably a bit late to not sign your posts with the website. Apparently this is one of those perfectly legitimate religions that forbids its adherents from discussing their faith, but permits website links to buy stuff. Oh wait, the only other religion I can think of that fits that bill is Scientology.
In short I reserve the right to make fun of people who trail their goofy beliefs behind them on the board like Linus with his blanket. I admit I am ill informed, but I am not likely to become more informed, by the explicit choice of the religion’s adherents, so I will go with what I have.
Really? What are the parallels? I am curious to know more about this religion. At my Unitarian Church this year the curriculum for the Religious Education (RE)classes is “world religions”, and since I’m on the RE committee I aim to improve my knowledge of different belief systems. If the Temple of the Vampire is using vampirism as a selling point, I wonder what segment of the population they hope to attract.
I am familiar with the concept of the psychic vampire. I have two of them running around my house, ages 6 and 2. But since we don’t know if this is the definition used by the Temple of the Vampire, this is also unhelpful in helping to define their intent. My point is that if you are going to use a term without explaining it, but not in the sense of one of the most common usages, then you (generic you) run the risk of being often misunderstood. Like if I called my business “Computer repair” and spent all day telling people on the phone “don’t bring your PC in the shop, I only fix abacuses.”
I only know what I’ve seen on that Web page and in a bit of the page FinnAgain posted. But obviously, these people don’t worship vampires or think they are vampires who have to hide from sunlight and garlic, just as Satanists don’t worship Satan and don’t think he exists. Satanists use Satan as a symbol for things like taking control and responsibility for your life and answering to yourself instead of accepting authority. I’d say these guys are doing the same kind of thing, emphasizing the dominance and strength of vampires, their solitude and their immortality to represent what might be possible for people. Some of the same features Satanists see in the devil, it seems to me.
Does this invite misunderstanding? Yes, but clearly, these are not people who mind being misunderstood. I’d say most of them probably feel somewhat misunderstood already. They don’t want everybody to be in on what they’re doing or approve of it. The people who do this are going to see the positive interpretation of vampires here and find it at least intriguing rather than repulsive.
So you claim. Odds are you’re wrong.
Human skepticism.
But you can speak on your own behalf and of your own thoughts and conclusions.
We are sure you’re a very nice and worthy person and we would love being friends with you, vampire or not. Some of us are just convinced that temple is a bunch of b.s.
Are they really in a position of ignorance, though? Maybe they know more than you and you are the ignorant. Maybe you’re just unpleasantly surprised because you now have some cognitive dissonance to resolve.
But you are special to us, like little Elian Gonzalez once was to Florideans and Cubans. The SDMB regularly takes interest into a lost lamb and starts teasing and poking it until it’s dead or hidden. Kinda like a a toddler might lovingly abuse a cat.
I’m sorry, Gozu, but I talked to the mods and we’re not going to accept this as the board’s new slogan. Sorry.
I don’t know anything about this Temple, other than having read the book linked to in this thread, but I’ll make a couple of comments, which probably aren’t going to make me very popular with the (literal or figurative) blood suckers.
Firstly, I’m willing to bet that they use the term ‘Vampire’ because it makes them sound badass, just like LaVey took on the term ‘Satanist’ because if he called his enterprise ‘The Church of Sadistic Social Darwinism’, he would have had to explain to everyone what that meant. Here, he could let people decide what it meant, and then deride them for not understanding the ‘true’ meaning of his religion.
If you aspire to being any sort of vampire, then you’re going to have to back up your words with action. Are you prepared to spill someone’s blood when they don’t want it spilled? Are you willing to have them respond by possibly smashing your face in? Do you then go and get the rest of your vampire gang to take them on 10:1? How then are you better than the school bullies who hurt you so much that you need to find a metaphysical way to get back at the world?
If you’re aspiring to be some sort of ‘spiritual’ vampire, or ‘psychic’ vampire, you have to ask yourself if you really want to be associated with those people who drain you with their stupidity, or their arrogance, or their bad habits, or their bad smells. The fact is, pissing people off and making them get a headache when you’re around is one of the easiest things you can do. No secret knowledge required. I meet someone like that just about every day, and they didn’t need the book.
If you’re using the word ‘Vampire’ in a way completely unrelated to anyone else’s understanding of the word, you’re just wasting everyone’s time.
I think it might be slightly unreasonable for a secret society called “Temple of the Vampire” to expect that others should automatically take their organization seriously-- not just here on the SDMB, but really anywhere on the planet. The “Vampire Bible” and its associated literature may well contain profound insights and valuable keys to personal fulfillment; but they pretty much lost any opportunity for a credible first impression when they chose a monkey skull with big ear wings for their website logo.
That said, I approve of their moxie; and I think the comparison with Scientology is unfair. Whereas Hubbard and his successors spent an enormous amount of effort to conceal the dubious nature of their system beneath a veneer of respectability, the Temple of the Vampire appears much more upfront (or at least as upfront as a self-described “secret society” can appear).
“Welcome to our website! Here’s our wing-eared monkey skull logo! It’s our very obvious signal that we’re not especially worried by accusations of silliness, so bear that in mind when you pay good money for our secret vampire lessons.”
There’s a good reason why images of Xemu riding his interstellar DC-8 don’t appear on the Scientology website.
I still don’t get it. Either you want people to know about your religion, in which case you tell them about it; or else you don’t, in which case you don’t advertise for them on message boards.
I’m all for religious tolerance, it is purposely hiding this mystical privileged information I disdain. I’m against all attempts to restrict the flow of information – except national security-type secrets where lives are at stake, and even then I’m skeptical that it is necessary.
In other words, IP, I think what you’re getting here isn’t hostility towards your religion, but mostly anger that these Vampires aren’t coming clean with what they actually believe. From the FAQ:
“Control how we are represented” sounds like “We don’t want people to make fun of us”. Otherwise, the best way to make sure you aren’t misrepresented is to make sure that the curious are well-informed and by making accurate information about yourself and your organization free and easy to obtain.
Anyway, don’t worry about being made fun of. Hell, the Jehovah’s Witnesses go door to door to make sure you know all about them, and these Vampires can’t be any kookier than them. Just let it all out, and the truth shall set you free.
If the Vampire Bible is to be taken at face value, one is supposed to affirm “I now am taking your life energy, your blood, your soul.” while, er, doing exactly that to the “victim”. However, it cautions that you shouldn’t “cause the physical destruction of your prey” by sucking them dry since that would violate the “first Vampiric Principle: Never Waste Food!” :eek:
Meanwhile the website states that the Temple does not tolerate crime.
Thus we see the stark difference between the letter and the spirit of the law.
Hmmm… perhaps Illuminatiprimus doth protest too much?
An undead whoosh lives forever…
What I find intriguing is the way they recruit members. Apparently, they are able to determine that someone is worthy of accessing their secrets by analyzing the possible recruit’s willingness to part with funds. No questionnaire to be filled out. No telephone or even email interviews. No personal meet-and-greet to see if someone is sincere in wanting to join up.
Just the ability to send a check or money order is needed to access the secrets of The Temple Of The Vampire.
High standards, indeed.
It does indeed.
Love the user name, BTW.
Nevermind. Really, really beaten to the punch.
I demand a recount.
Sigh
I had decided to bow out of this thread as I wasn’t going to like what was being discussed, but then I resolved to be a little thicker skinned. No, I can’t speak on behalf of the Temple, but as others have said I can speak on behalf of myself.
If the Temple was a cult/scam telling me what to believe and charging me for the privilege I would have been out the door so fast it might as well have been revolving. The Temple’s axiom is “Test everything, Believe nothing”. There is no belief involved here, everything is presented for one to validate. If I am less sceptical of anything I have learnt since joining it is only because I have tested it out for myself and know it to be the case, not because I was told to.
As for the charges of “send us $19.95 for the secrets of the universe”, if you spent money on a training course to build personal confidence/assertiveness, learn how to better manage and make use of your finances, encouraged and advised you have to improve your health and extend your life - would you expect/demand all this to be free? The best things in life aren’t, I’m afraid.
Also regarding “recruitment”, how is anyone being recruited? All I have done is what many Temple members do, make the path to the website available for people to explore themselves, the next step is up to the one doing the exploring.
I’m quite resolved to being mocked for my association (particularly by people like fruitbat who state they’re ill informed but will keep kicking anyway) and this is a rather tiresome repeat of the “Ask the Satanist” thread where a lot of people piled scorn on something based on their own preconceptions and prejudices without any real knowledge. By all means go right ahead, if that’s what makes you feel good about yourself. Indeed I’m entirely happy to make fun of the batshit beliefs that other people have (like believing in the magic zombie Jesus-on-a-stick will make me live forever, or that blowing people up in the name of peace will get me into paradise) but as I’ve said what I’m presenting here isn’t a belief, it’s a method. What I have presented can be validated and doesn’t stand on its own authority, I don’t need people to “respect” it because I know it works and that’s all that matters.