Timothy McVeigh is supposed to die on Monday. I’m disturbed by this. Once upon a time I was in favour of capital punishment. If you commit a heinous crime, you should pay for it. But over the last several years I’ve come about on the issue. Part of that comes from the many, many years people spend on death row. It seems the person being executed is not always the same person who committed the crime. The years in prison change them. This doesn’t apply to McVeigh because he hasn’t been in prison that long, and his statements indicate that he is not sorry for what he did. If anyone deserves to be executed, surely it is he?
But the taking of a human life, especially in such a beurocratic manner, just creeps me out. Especially since he is slated to die on the day before my birthday. Other civilized countries don’t execute people. I wonder if civilization has advanced to a point where executions are no longer necessary. I’m ambivalent on the issue. I think there are people who “need killing” – that is, they deserve to be executed as quickly as possible, but I find the idea of the state killing a person to be distasteful.
This is not intended to be a debate. I just wanted to state my opinion that executions are disturbing.
I feel you, bro. I’m opposed to the death penalty on principle, and by extension I’m opposed to this execution. On the other hand, I’m not going to be especially vocal in my opposition to this particular execution just because of its high profile. The very thing that makes this case such a big deal is the horror of the crime itself. It is drawing attention to the question of whether a civilized nation should use capital punishment, and that’s a good thing. But taking to the streets now, for Timothy McVeigh, instead of for someone whose guilt is in question or whose execution would be disproportionate to his crime, would amount to calling for an exception, and if I did believe in the death penalty, I’m sure I wouldn’t want to make an exception for McVeigh.
I think it says something that not all of the people who lost loved ones in the bombing are in favor of this execution (although I’m sure most of them are). I think the most civilized thing America could do would be to show that killing is never acceptable, whether it’s an act of terrorism or a punishment sponsored by the state. And not execute McVeigh.
I agree with you. It disturbs me that we’re executing anyone, but what really disturbs me is people’s bloodthirstiness. It’s like, for some people, Christmas is coming and they’re rubbing their hands together in glee. Sick.
Have you seen those geese that people have in their yards that they dress up for different seasons? (I could do another whole topic on the stupid geese.) At Christmas time, they’ll put a little Santa suit on him. On Valentines Day, they’ll dress him up as Cupid. Well, these people in my neighborhood have their goose dressed in a prisoner’s outfit (black and white stripes) with a sign on him that says “McVeigh.” What a bunch of psychos. They’ve completely lost sight of the fact the he is a human being, even though what he did was unspeakably heinous.
I can understand why the family’s of the victims think that this will bring closure and that it might help them in some way to see him gone, but I can’t understand being happy about it.
A few years ago, Florida (my then-home state) executed a prisoner on my birthday. It was very disconcerting, especially since I’m anti-capital punishment.
This year, McVeigh is scheduled to be executed on my lovely Anniz’s birthday. She’s planning to move to the US this summer, and that’s not the kind of birthday ‘present’ I want my country to give her. I will be ashamed to be an American on Monday.
And, C3, not only have they forgotten that McVeigh is human, but they’re also human as well.
I happen to favor the death penalty in cases such as this where guilt isn’t in question.
No, I’m not bloodthirsty. I wouldn’t watch the execution if it were broadcast on TV. I don’t view it as “punishment” per se, which implies that it’s being used to mold future behavior. Whether it’s a deterent to other would be criminals I don’t know or especially care.
I do feel that when someone commits an act so heinous that they are clearly unfit for society, they should be eliminated quickly and as painlessly as possible.
Thankfully, I’ve never lost a loved one to violence, and hope it remains that way. To house and feed a Timothy McVeigh for the rest of his natural life is a waste of resources as far as I’m concerned, and the thought of him living in freedom one day, “reformed” or otherwise, I find totally repugnant.
[rant_mode]
I wish they would kill him and be done with it.
IMHO these “people” aren’t worth the effort/time/money of keeping them alive. He murdered over 100 men, women and children in cold blood. I can not even begin to think of why his life should be spared.
There are also crimes so henious (sp?) that it is hard to believe that a human could commit them. And when I say “human” I don’t just mean a homo sapien. There has to be some brain functions and ethics that go along with being in that group. These “things” lack them. Therefore, I feel no remorse when they are executed.
I have more feeling for the innocent cat that gets run over crossing the street than these monsters. I am serious. They really are monsters. I don’t give a rats ass how tidy and polite they look in jail or court. They still do not deserve anyones pitty or defense once they are convicted of their crimes. I still wish we had capital punishment in this country. How monsters like Paul Bernardo can still breath the same air as the rest of us is beyond me…and the taxpayers of this country are feeding him.
That is my Humble Opinion… and I am pretty sure I will get flamed for sharing it. I don’t care.
Do you think a person insane enough to commit these acts considers the consequences?
Insane person: “Boy, I’d sure like to go out and do some mass murder today! Too bad about that pesky death penalty, otherwise I’d be out there raisin’ hell!!! If I only had the threat of life imprisonment deterring me, well that’d be an entirely different story! Then you’d see some serious killin’ boy howdy!”
One might suspect that the Oklahoma city bombing, supposedly about the Waco incident, was probably more about McVeigh’s ego. But even so, if the perception of violence is enough to incite people to terroristic acts, who’s to say somebody won’t set off another bomb next year on the anniversary of McVeigh’s execution to show solidarity with his twisted viewpoint? When does the cycle of violence end?
I can’t cite (I’ll look if I have to) but I’m rather sure that the death penalty has never been shown to be an effective deterrent. i.e. having it on the statute doesn’t cut the prevalence of such acts.
No, neither can change what has already been done. That’s axiomatic.
What is at stake here (and this is unashamedly IMHO) is the level of civilisation of the society as a whole. In a perverse (in every sense of the word) sort of way I find the idea that the state is the legal, calm, ordered perpetrator of a death to be as abhorrent as some evil psycho committing acts of violence or terror.
Why does everyone keep referring to the number of people killed? Is the taking of one life any better than the taking of 168? Murder is murder. Whether it be 1 or 1 million. Why is killing 168 morally worse, and more deserving of the death punishment than killing “only” 1. The on again-off again death penalty proponents who use this rationale are trying to have their cake and eat it too. They want to be able to execute only the ones they feel have overstepped some limit. What is the number where murder becomes a capital crime? Is it 2? 3? One way or the other folks. There are not different levels of murder. Dead is dead. No matter how you got them there, or no matter how many you have killed. We cannot kill Mcveigh 168 times, and it is pointelss to kill him once. Call it what you will folks, but the death penalty is state run revenge. Revenge is not necessarily a bad thing. But when done this way, it becomes cold and meaningless.
Another thing that has bothered me is all the talk of “closure”. Please. If all this time has not brought those folks some sort of closure, then the death of Tim is not going to accomplish it either. (GD here we come)
For the record, I live in OKC, and pretty much avoid speaking my opinion here. The wound is still raw, and a good portion of the people here cannot discuss it rationally. I don’t even try.
I’m sorry, but I cannot agree with this thinking. Gee Tim, you killed over 100 people who did nothing but happen to be in your path that morning. And you show no remorse for it. But killing you won’t bring them back so we’ll just make you wear an orange jumpsuit so you can sit around and watch cable television and we’ll pay for your food, shelter and medical needs for the rest of your life.
No, IMO this act caused lots of people to feel huge amounts of grief, anger, fear and hurt. Some form of retribution is needed for some emotional healing to happen. And locking someone away for the rest of their life is not proactive enough.
I would personally like to see the person put somewhere (maybe a cage at a zoo) for a day where all the victims and their families can come in and yell and scream and cuzz and bitch him out to their heart’s content and he would have to sit there and take it. That would cause some closure, but some bleeding heart would surely see that as cruel & unusual punishment.
Well, although I don’t see it myself, maybe I’ve characterised myself as a bleeding heart by being anti-death penalty. That said, I would have absolutely no problem with your idea. In fact, I’d probably be pro the idea for crimes less than death. Quite a lot less, the more I think about it.
I find it interesting (and refreshing) that some one admits the execution is about “retribution”* as opposed to “justice”. Thank you for having the courage to say it.
Lon Horiuchi, FBI sharpshooter, intentionally blew off an unarmed womans head from 200 yards with a high-power rife, while she was holding her baby and doing nothing more menacing than standing on her front porch. Will you so eagerly support the death penalty for him?
After all, intentional cold-blooded murder is bad enough when one citizen does it to another. Surely it’s worse when a person, acting in the name of all US citizens and who is sworn to protect all US citizens from enemies both foreign and domestic, murders some one?
Okay everybody, let’s start the countdown until this gets pulled over to Great Debates or the BBQ Pit.
As for McVeigh. Eh. He is a defective member of society. As any piece of defective equipment should, he should be removed from circulation. No more to it than that.
I’m also disturbed by the weird glee that the media/people in general are taking with it. Even though I’m in support of capital punishment (what else do we do with unrecalcitrant criminals? Brainwash them? More humane just to get rid of them quickly), I find the circus atmosphere to be repulsive in the extreme. Gosh, why don’t we just feed him to a pride of lions or something…?
As long as we are just giving our opinions and not debating:
I am completely pro-capital punishment. If you kill somebody I have no problem with society saying you should die in return.
However, I am anti-enacting capital punishment. It is an act for which you can not guarantee 100% accuracy in punishing the correct person and there is no means of reversal.
I recognize that no system of justice is going to be perfect and that an innocent person could end up in jail for life, but at least with a life sentence there is a chance or recognizing the error and attempting to make amends.
