VP debates have traditionally been sideshows at best. They might predictably provide news headlines the next day and perhaps a couple days more for pundits to promote their theories of who ‘won’, but apart from that, they’re quickly forgotten.
Do you think tonight’s VP debate might assume more importance given the age and health of the Presidential candidates? If so, what’s the likelihood of tonight’s debates moving the needle one way or the other? Lastly, is it possible this debate is more important because the American public may not be able to otherwise watch an actual debate this election season.
Yes, I think it’ll be more important than in the past because a lot of voters understand that either of these two could be president in the next 4 years.
If I’m Harris, I’m attacking not just Trump but for Pence directly, for enabling and doing absolutely nothing other than licking boots.
If I’m Pence, I’m trying to paint Harris as a BLM radical sympathizer who communist tendencies.
I think they will go after each other directly more so than in past VP debates.
No undecided will decide based on tonight. No voters will swing because they were more impressed with one or the other or disliked one or the other more. No one already decided will be more or less energized by this either.
The value of tonight is to launch each of them in their runs for 2024. Or to kill any such dreams they each may have.
Yeah - pure sideshow material, right next to the geek!
-A lot of people want Harris to attack and score points off Pence/Trump, but I question whether that is the best approach. Given recent trends, the best thing could well be to NOT do anything that makes the news. I think she has far more chance of turning OFF some voters, that bringing others on board. The main thing to show is that she is “Presidential” - in traditional, non-Trumpian terms.
-Further, 4 yrs ago Pence proved his impeccable teflon qualities. He is just going to stick to his talking points like an automaton (even tho I expect Harris would be far more capable than Kaine was.) She’s not going to rattle him, so she shouldn’t try. If she does, her attempts will look ineffective at best.
-Finally, tho I did not watch too much of the primary debates, Harris impressed me as the type of candidate who strains a little too hard to jam their “zinger” in, in a style which impresses me as extremely forced. Look, we all can see her gender and the hue of her skin, and anyone who cares can find out more than they wish to know about her family, education, background, etc. No need to deny who she is tonight, but I think it would be inadvisable to seek an opportunity to stress her identity with various traditionally underrepresented groups. If any black/Asian/female/whatever voter is predisposed to vote against Biden because of Harris, I have a hard time imagining what she could do to sway them - without losing at least as many other votes in the process.
Well, I just watched some young people on CNN (I think) talking about this very subject. They said they are undecided and that the VP could make up their minds.
I think it’s important for people to like Kamala or at least not hate her. Given how old Joe is, I think it matters more than usual.
For the last 4-ish years, we’ve seen no end of Trump acolytes and sycophants playing stridently to An Audience of One (DJT).
Every witness for his ‘defense’ in the Impeachment hearings … Brett Kavanaugh … and on and on. Do the dance, get the reward.
Wedded as he is to polls, POTUS must be acutely aware that he’s double-digits behind right now. Amped up as he is on God Knows What (apart from the usual Diet Coke, Sudafed, and junk food), he’s got to be in rare form.
So my guess is … he’s kept Pence in something of a cage with Michael Vick training him.
I suspect a full frontal assault … until and unless he pops a spring or something.
I suspect–and this is my complete armchair punditing–that you’re right here. Pence is a known quantity, in the way that off-brand Liquid Paper is a known quantity. The debate’s not going to be about him.
Harris has two groups she needs to connect with:
Racist assholes who watch Fox News and think that a black woman from California is gonna be super angry and like Stalinist or something, but who think BIden’s not so bad and are getting uncomfortable with Trump’s increasingly unhinged behavior. She needs to win them over somehow, or at least make it hard for them to maintain their prejudice about her.
Voters who are unsure what to make of Trump’s nutso freakouts in the past week. She needs to contextualize those freakouts and make them seem as terrifying as possible, so that group either votes for Biden or decides to forgo the two-party system.
Pence, of course, needs to stop her from succeeding at these goals, and also reverse Trump’s freefall in the polls. I wish Pence full success, and by “full success” I’m referring to success at becoming a better human being who stops being a lickspittle for a deranged wannabe tyrant and actually stands up for anything good that could possibly come from his religion.
I guess that makes some sense (tho I truly question the competence of someone who couldn’t choose betw Biden/Trump w/o looking down ticket!)
She could clearly distinguish herself as someone who is aware of the interests of others than white males, and whose spouse allows her to be in a room with someone of a different gender… I mean, Pence has the bigot bible thumpers locked up. Kamala just needs to appear sane and aware of the modern world, w/o going overboard trying to establish some “street cred”.
I doubt the debate will be too important despite the age of the main candidates. Trump and Covid just loom too large and there is not space for much else.
And I agree it would be a bad idea for Harris to spend a lot of time attacking Trump. Get some jabs in sure, but her focus should be showing she is competent and ready to be President and a mainstream Democrat rather than a radical who will drag the administration to the left. Doing these things are both in her immediate interest of winning the election and her long-term interest of positioning herself for future races.
You’re right - given the age of the two men at the top, this debate has greater significance.
It will also be more substantial on the issues than we got last week. That’s a low bar.
Harris in 1v1 interrogations as a Senator is mightily impressive. From her Judiciary Committee duties she has made Trump nominees squirm which is a large reason she gained popularity despite only being in her first term.
Pence is calm and collected. He’s the antithesis of his boss in communications and while I expect him to be wildly dishonest because he has a record to defend, I think he is underestimated. His goal tonight is to reassure older voters and Republican moderates to not ditch the train.
Given the events of the last 6 days, this event is extremely important. It may be the last debate of the cycle and Pence may end up being the Candidate. This is the first time a member of the Trump clique has been under real scrutiny since Trump was diagnosed.
That said, I agree with @dinsdale Pence has truly teflon superpowers and it will be hard or impossible to knock him off his game, as seen 4 years ago. I don’t know what that means for what Harris needs to accomplish in these 2.5 hours and we’ll see where she takes this. Pence will just stalwartly be Pence, 1st Lieutenant of the Tower of Mordor.