You mean, he’s like…“easy”?
grienspiece said
Do you truly mean that you would swallow an op-ed piece from the NYT, no matter that it was from a conservative or a liberal veiwpoint? I doubt it.
If you meant that you would trust the NYT, in a news article, then I suport you. But we ain’t talking about news articles here.
SPOOFE asserts
At least Claude Raines redeemed himself by shooting Major Strasser at the end of the movie.
No doubt we’ll have to wait for longer for anyone to redeem themselves in a december thread.
At least december, to his credit, starts these abominations in the Pit.
Er, no. That was Bogart.
You been here longer’n I have, and you’re surprised about that?
andros. You are correct. I made a mistake.
Raines did redeem himself by saying “round up the usual suspects” rather than having Bogart arrested.
Yeah, but wasn’t he like, invisible?
I agree. I never agreed with this war, but I am grateful that it was done with maximum efficiency, and at least tried to keep civilian deaths at a minimum. I honestly expected a higher death count on both sides. I’ve never been happier to be wrong about something.
Please disregard. I initially made the wrong reading of “appalled” and realized before I could turn back.
FTR, I do not believe my initial post was uncalled-for, SPOOFE, assuming for the moment that you were including me in your comment.
Just so we get this straight. You’re not arguing his premise in this thread. You just want to bash him because he’s December.
Got it.
Bash december? Perish the thought! The man is a treasure, a true believer who is never dissuaded. You can depend on him! Just when you think there isn’t the slightest chance of a plausible argument, however far fetched, he comes up with one. We would be as much the poorer without him as we would without Collounsbury.
Wrong? Well, yes, and so what? Our country is currently ruled by men who would cheerfully smear turds on thier shoes and try to buff them to a high gloss!
elucidator:
As I said in the thread about naming the current scandal, the name for it has to have the word shinola in it somewhere. I must be picking up on your vibes.
The turds or the shoes? I’m leaning toward saying that if US intel said the turds were laced with something, and the administration wanted to smell like shit, they’d turn that into “the turds have laces; you can put them on and walk in them.”
Either that or something about Kurds and arsenic…
Arsenic and Old Laces.
In december’s world, the BBC is part of the slanted “liberal media,” and should not be trusted to report what really happens.
The only reliable source of news is Bill O’Reilly. :rolleyes:
State of Iraq
What a fucking surprise, our professional blog-spotter and Op-Ed column regurgitator has found some items to rip out of their context to support his little fantasy world.
I suppose it would be amusing were it not trivializing the danger in which some close colleagues and friends of mine presently have put themselves in, in Iraq, as well as being grossly distortive of the present challenges and dangers. Should want to understand current problems and challenges – and let me emphasize, it pretty fucking important to me professionally insofar as we’re preparing to put 3 digits of millions on the line over the next seven years if things play out right – one should pretty fucking well want to deal with reality, and not ideological pimpery of motherfucking fantasies by drooling morons and lying shysters. Of course two of chief morons and twits in residence, Milly and Greeny are here to whinge on and piss their pants as always. Bloody ‘Depends’ commercials they are.
[quote]
I reiterate the same sentiments, with provisio you are far more of drooling ideologue than I had thought.
You may see my GD thread wherein I cite to actual reports on the actual conditions. I note for example that officials in country advised against using the Amman-Baghdad highway in convoys of less than four. They further note that insecurity is widespread, and that cholera and other water borne disease is a serious issue.
Not that any factual information will have the slightest impact on your dim and hardening remnant of a brain.
Funny, his comrades seem to have a different view of things, in private and in public documentation. For all that, his statements hardly support your spin that current reports are ‘exaggerating’ conditions on the ground for political purposes. What he does indicate, and to an extent he is right, is that things are not as bad as they could have been. True, that is quite true. However, that is not the same as your initial argument.
I further note that businessmen doing business on the ground, such as the GM of Riyadh Cable who was intimately familiar with pre-war conditions describe the security and infrastructural situation as rather awful. I’ll note that Fadi Ghrandour, head of Aramex, a formerly NASDAQ listed transportation solutions firm (like DHL, focused on the Middle East and Asia – taken private last year or the year before) stated to me that although they are operative to serve NGOs, they send their people in Baghdad home by late afternoon because of the risk of car jacking and assassinations. That’s an improvement over a few weeks ago when noon was the cut off. I further note that per convos with others, such as the CEO and COO of MENAFN, conveyed to me their understanding that even experience businessmen with deep Iraqi connections do not dare travel about without teams of bodyguards, such is the state of the security situation.
Now, Ward is right, the worst case scenarios did not come to pass. That is rather different than the conditions being good and december’s predictable spin that ‘liberal’ media are distorting the situation.
I would also take with a grain of salt the statements in regards to the electrical grid insofar as in personal convos, CPA-I officials told me that they did not yet have consistent electrical power to their own hotel and Arab businessmen with whom I deal have not described the situation as having reached pre-war levels. Jaffa, in a personal conversation, described how rough work is, being fired upon every time he tries site inspections, returning to a hotel in central Baghdad (part of CPA-I setup) where the elevators can’t be used as you never know when the power will cut out, and where water is not regular. That’s CPA-I residence. Now imagine the rest of the country. In terms of prewar service, well, I can only point you all to the questions posed during the war as to why Baghdad was lit-up 24-7, no blackouts, and the lack of commentary on electrical outages in this period.
The Iraqi electrical grid was running on baling twine and gum, sanctions being the major reason. I suppose blaming this on Sadaam is more or less correct in a very general sense.
More correct, however, is blaming the lack of control post war, which by all accounts had led to a serious deterioration in conditions across the board.
In any, you are contemptible lying scum who’ll stoop at nothing to spin whatever ideological fantasy you have. Trivializing the danger in which my amigos in CPA and in the NGOs are in presently, and for that matter the US and other service personnel, for the mere purpose of pimping your little fantasy world is frankly disgusting.
But further the security issues:
ISM 12/06/03 Security up-date
General
The overall trend of developments in the security situation remains of concern with a total of 12 incidents being noted. The key areas of concern remain as previously reported – Baghdad and the hinterland regions to the West and North.
In the past 24 hours, coalition forces conducted 8 raids and a total of 2.595 patrols throughout Iraq, including 253 joint patrols with Iraqi Police. A total of 264 suspects were arrested. Concerning the weapon turn-in program that is almost over, Iraqi citizen have delivered to CF weapons collection points a total of 85 pistol, 72 semi-automatic rifle or shotgun, 363 automatic rifle, 40 machine gun, 120 ant-tank weapon, 10 anti-air weapons, 230 grenade and other explosive devises.
The exchange rate IDinar US$ is 1450 IDinars for one US$ [CL: Relatively steady FXR]
Baghdad Region
The Baghdad region is the current key area of security concerns. The possible use of surface to air missiles along the approach/take off path for aircraft from Baghdad airport (BIAP) is a new development of concern to IOs/NGOs as well as to CF. [CL, n.b. non USM flights are currently suspended The region of Ramadi and Falluja is the scene of on-going military operations, with regular clashes between CF and Iraqi anti-CF forces taking place. **Safety on the main highway passing through this area (Baghdad-Amman highway [CL: highway 10]) remains an issue, there are frequent reports of criminal armed attacks on the 50 km section of the highway near Ramadi, including 2 armed attacks in the past month upon diplomatic convoys travelling from Jordan to Baghdad and approximately 20 such attacks upon NGO vehicles in the past 2 months. [CL: does not count private convoy attacks, also said to be signif.]
Northern Region:
There have been 2 security incidents reported in the Mosul region.
Central Region:
No security incidents reported.
Upper South Region:
No security incidents reported.
Lower South region/Kuwait border:
Three security incidents reported.
12/06/03 @ 15:30 Map of security incidents in Baghdad (Sources C.F., UN and INGO)
- HWY 01 Muzhik Ash Shawi, 11/06 @ 22:00. Ambush. C.F. patrol fired upon with small arms and RPG. Fourth attaks in that area in one week.
- 08 Km south of BIAP runway threshold. 11/06@17:00. Possible surface to air missile launch.
3. 30 Km south east of BIAP runway threshold. 11/06@17:00. Possible surface to air missile launch. - Mansur: 11/06 @ 09:00. Attempted of kidnapping of young Iraqi women. Exchange of
gun fire involving diplomatic security personal. One casualty.
Canal
12/06/03 @ 15:30 Map of security incidents in Iraq (Sources C.F., UN and INGO)
- Basrah: Smuggling of explosive devices. 11/06 @ 11:00. C.F. detained seven Iraqi’s involved in an attempt of smuggling explosives.
- In Kuwait: HWY 80 near Safwan hill, 11/06 @ 22:00 Sniper attacks.
- Basrah: 10/06 @ 15:00 Shooting incident. No further details
- Mosul: 12/06 @ 01:00 Attack on C.F.
- Ramadi: 12/06 @ 01: 00. Attack on C.F. C.F. patrol attacked with small arms and hand grenades.
- Mosul: 12/06 @ 01:00. Attack on C.F. C.F. patrol engaged by small arms.
- Fallujah: 12/06 @ 24:00. Ambush attack on CF. C.F. convoy attacked with RPG.
- Fallujah 09/06@19h30. Attack by armed criminals on diplomatic convoy.
Now as to the state of infrastructure, the latest report has 16 hours of electricity in Baghdad, which remains less than prewar levels per my understanding.
In regards to health, let me first note that both CPA-I and UN officials noted in briefings that I have attended or have been briefed on that the health reporting system in Iraq has completely broken down so no one really has a terribly good idea as to actual conditions, and in this context I speak to health professionals, not moronic dilettante ideologues driving through expecting to see “cholera” on the roadside.
I do share an extract from the UNOHCI briefing: Briefing NOTE to media Baghdad 12 05 03
For an actual analysis of the rebuilding effort, I refer interested readers to the thread that Tom linked.
So the lying sack of shit is trying to move his goal posts/
Now we start the land of December revisionism, where up is down, warnings are reports and blogs are facts.
[quote]
A couple of weeks ago I saw articles talking about widespread starvation.
P/quote]
Cite if motherfucker, cite it. Not warnings of potential starvation, not cautions as to potential problems if proper steps were not taken, actual reports of widespread starvation.
And? It was correct. Your staggering hypocrisy and idiocy is at once loathsome and incredible.
Medical supplies had been looted, destroyed or were unavailable before they began to be moved in with combined efforts by the coalition forces and UNHCR.
Partly alleviated problems does not mean they did not exist.
Well, it is in fucking shambles and it may very well be largely out of commission for a long time, but I rather suspect that what you are weaseling at here are the warnings that the oil infrastructure might be blow up or destroyed in combat. Now that did not happen.
So, moron boy, let’s keep things straight. Warnings are not factual reports, they’re warnings of scenarios that must be taken into account.
And again our resident moron makes sweeping declaration about a subject he knows nothing and indeed less than nothing about.
Certainly the occupation is not going fucking swimmingly, now is shit head? The little bit about security, and the items I have noted, not to mention the mass demonstrations against US presence, the recent upswing in organized violence against US forces….
Yes, this all speaks to an occupation that really has won the hearts and minds of the Iraqis, now hasn’t it? Oh yes, I know, its those convenient Saddam loyalists, at the heart of it. Oh and the Iranian agitators. Oh let’s not forget the Turkish Spec. Forc. in the Turcoman connexion.
Of course Saddam loyalists do indeed play some role in this, but the numbers and level of support rather imply an Iraq not thinking itself as ‘liberated’ – and in the same manner the Shiites show little enthusiasm for American forces, only tolerance, although oddly the Saddam resurgence in the North-Center may drive the Shiite Islamists to collaborate more with the Americans (and vice versa).
Bull fucking shit. That precisely what you meant to do, your original comments in that moronic thread, and above, were not to prewar motherfucking reporting, you claimed it was current situation that was exaggerated, and not we have the typical, patented December motherfucking weaseling and your usual display of contemptible hypocrisy.
That is lie. A complete motherfucking lie. You are contemptible lying hypocrite and scum. Even now due to security issues, while materials are around, there are serious issues in getting supplies to hospitals and medical supplies remain an issue. You can check out UN clearing house information on the evolution of the situation.
What makes this hypocritical lying posturing so contemptible is that the fact the supplies ran out need not be denied at all – given the looting and related circumstances, it was understandable and the coalition and UN have worked hard to correct the situation, although again, getting supplies to hospitals and clinics is problematic due to the security situation.
In addition to the UN sites avail I point those less moronic and blinkered to the following reporting:
Iraq’s medical emergency 10 May 2003
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3014871.stm
Baghdad’s hospitals in crisis 7 April 2003
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/2924995.stm
]
Since this is your own little made up red herring, I am sure we can all be happy. It has fuck all to do with your original claim, you contemptible piece of lying garbage.
However, insofar as noted by CPA-I briefings themselves, most of the population is unable to supplement rations and insofar as there are serious problems in distribution due to insecurity, ‘starvation’ in the sense of malnutrition and serious undernourishment (versus starving to death) is indeed a bloody problem. Widespread hunger is and remains a problem since the collapse of the regime.
Supplementing information provided supra and also avail through UN and international coordination sources I note the following BBC stories to illustrate:
Iraqis’ cupboards still bare
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/from_our_own_correspondent/2970158.stm
Daily hardships continue for Iraqis
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3050429.stm
Baghdad diary: Hard times
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/2980635.stm
Well, that should make everyone feel all warm and cosy, now shouldn’t it? For all that it is not at all clear that this is the case, insofar as sabotage, including recent attacks on pipelines, continue to disrupt production. Sales to date are not from current production.
For an actual view of the sales negotiated, including status, see:
Iraqi oil flows again 12 June 2003
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/2986118.stm
Now fuck the hell off, you lying hypocritical piece of contemptible filth. I’m sick to my stomach with your faux concern about Iraqis, Palestinians and others, your whinging distortions and hypocritical ideologically driven posturing, and your thinly disguised bigotry.
There was a house cleaning and it has now been transformed into “Coalition Provisional Authority” in Iraq. CPA-I in my notation. See my thread on reconstruction for further information.
december is right. The glass is half full. It just happens to be half full of my urine on the day of my annual STD test.
Drink up, pal.
FYI it’s not Al Jazeera that I work for.
Well a smear against Istara, followed by:
Since you bring nothing to the table you contemptible little worm, why not shut the fuck up.