In which I Pit the poor (overreacting)!!!!

The BBQ Pit
21

The only time, I repeat, the only time I agree to “joint bills” is when I’m paying for clients on my expense account. Someone always gets screwed when you take a lump-sum bill and try to divide it up, and it’s just not worth it.

And I won’t accept it when the restaurant alleges that they “can’t divide a check up for more than 5 people”. They either divide it up or they don’t get paid. It takes all of 15-30 seconds to enter an order into the register*, and when we’re a group of 20 people who somehow are assigned only 2 waiters and also have a mandatory 25% gratuity thrown on for their “trouble” by deigning to allow us in their restaurant, they can fucking well sit a person in front of the register to make out separate bills.

But you know what? I’ve had restaurants refuse to let a party of 20+ very well-heeled business people I am mother-hening into the door, because we want separate checks. And I tell the manager - “Holy crap - you realize these people are going to each spend about $100 a person on food and drinks? With your mandatory tip you’re going to get about $2500 from them in 2 hours - and you won’t have us because you can’t have a minimum wage employee type for 5-10 minutes?” And the absolute stampeding shitheads will smugly fold their arms and send us all on our way.

Utter barking buggering madness. No wonder this economy sucks.

  • Yes, I have worked a register, for many long hours. People who think it’s too hard to enter in 20 orders when you’re getting a 25% mandatory gratuity have a serious disconnect with reality.
22

It’s a lot easier to split the bill like HSHP when the group doesn’t have any cheapskates. In my normal group of friends, people wind up offering to throw more money in to round it out. The guy who ordered lobster will pony up more money on his own, without having to poke and prod. The guy who ordered toast will be told that he doesn’t have to pay as much as the rest.

It’s much more civilized than pulling out the calculator and adding up everyones individual meal.

23

She probably did just that, but the amount you’re going to ask for at the end of the meal - after whipping out your card and saying “haha, I only have plastic today, everybody give me your cash and here’s the amount of cash everybody has to give me” - isn’t on the menu.

“Three bucks. Get a fucking grip”, indeed. You sound like the paperboy from Better Off Dead.

24

This is the exact reason I stopped my “lunch get together on payday” with some of the others at my job. Good Lord, people, ask for a separate check if you’re not going to pony up to the bill. It took me a few times to realize that my companions were “paying for their share”, but for nothing else (tax and tip). And I will NOT stiff a server out of their tip - call me slow, but if five of us went out and MY share came to about, oh, $6 to $7 bucks more cause I WAS THE ONLY ONE PAYING THE TIP, it doesn’t seem quite fair. So I don’t “do lunch” with those people anymore.

For crying out loud, I went out yesterday with a co-worker, his entree was like $4 bucks more than mine but I had had a few beers. The total tab came to $15.13 - he threw in $10, I threw in $10.13 - tell me where else in my area you can go and get a decent lunch for only $10. Waitress got a decent tip, we had a good time, and there’s no bickering. He’s the only co-worker I even WANT to go have lunch with anymore.

I agree with Happy Scrappy - people like he described suck.

25

Jesus, i’m glad i’m not the only person who’s gone through this.

My friends used to hand me the bill because i’m fast and accurate with figures, and can add 20% to a bill and divide it up quickly to work out how much each person owes. Generally i preferred to split the amount evenly among everyone, but i was also willing to take account of the fact that some people ate very little, or that some people had expensive tastes.

But, as you say, it often ends up that someone doesn’t put enough money in, and the person doing the collecting ends up either badgering people for more money, or just making up the rest out of his or her own pocket.

When it’s at a cheap cafe and it only costs a few bucks to make up the difference, i can live with it, but it happened to me when a bunch of us went out for my girlfriend’s birthday last year. It worked out to about $40 a head, and people wanted the bill passed around so that everyone could pay his or her share. I passed the bill around, and each person (or couple) gave me what they thought they owed.

When all the money was in, we were still short of the total amount, let alone having enough for the tip. The problem, with my friends at least, is not really that people are cheap, it’s that they don’t use their brains. They look at the price of the specific items they chose from the menu, and conveniently forget about wine they shared, the drinks they had before dinner, the communal appetisers we ordered, the tax, and even the tip. Somehow, the money for these little “extras” is just supposed to appear from somewhere. I managed to wheedle more out of some people, but still ended up short.

Since that occasion, which ended up costing me about $40 on top of my own and my girlfriend’s meal (it was her birthday, so of course i paid for her), i no longer accept the responsibility of collecting the money. I calculate what i owe, taking full account of taxes, drinks, and a 20% tip, and leave everyone else to battle over the rest.

26

For those who are suggesting that Happy be the bigger man and pay the difference, I have to disagree. If he does this, then anytime she is sans boyfriend, she will think she can get away with this sort of thing. I agree, she’s just being cheap. And I do not think you are overreacting, Happy. It’s the principle of the thing. Especially if she had the money in her wallet.

27

Well, you may have worked a register, but you’ve obviously never waited tables or you’d realize it’s a lot more than simply entering in stuff in a computer. Seperate checks is the quickest way to mess up the kitchen, and thus, seriously fuck up the whole operation of the restaurant. Two or even three is okay, but

20 seperate checks? You’ve got to be kidding.

And $100 a head? Where the hell are you eating?

It never ceases to amaze me how the elite business class that can afford to pay $100 per meal cannot fathom how to do the simple math required to figure out a bill.

:rolleyes:

28

Huh.

I’ve waited tables. I’ve waited a LOT of tables.

I never had any trouble, whatsoever, doing seperate cheques for people. Yes, 20 seperate cheques for people. Give the kitchen a heads up, and it’s fine.

Really, being a waitress is a lot of work, but it’s certain not rocket science, and spliting a cheque isn’t exactly like spliting the atom.

Lighten up already.

29

Well you and I must’ve worked in very different restaurants, then. I waited tables for 8 years and no restaurant I ever worked in would’ve allowed that. The most checks I’ve split would probably be no more than 4.

The difficulty has nothing to do with it, it’s the whole ripple effect it has on the rest of the restaurant. Specially if it’s during the rush.

And heaven forbid if the server has any other tables, as she’s forced to make change for 20 people, or the bartender that she’s trying to get change from, ect. ect.

Anyhoo, my intent was not to hijack this thread. So carry on with the anti-cheapskate raging.

Sorry for the interruption.

30

Rolleyes right back at you. Are you saying that the restaurant could not possibly handle 20 people ordering at once? Then why do they have about 40 or so tables? At lunch time they have all 40 tables packed, with a line waiting for tables, and they seem to do just fine, amazingly.

Are you saying that one person, sitting down in front of a terminal, cannot fathom how to sort out 20 orders and checks? Really? And that, in the case of a large party, the restaurant could not devote an entire employee to tracking the orders and checks?

And you’re making fun now because I went to a pricey restaurant? Conveniently ignoring that $500 or more in tips that those poor, pitiable servers will get? ($500 divided between 2 servers and possibly 2 bus staff and 4 cooks makes $62.50 for 2 hours, or $31.25 an hour in tips. Oh, those poor, poor people! Add to that their salary of about $10/hour (at this restaurant, that’s what they get paid) and you have about $41.25 an hour. How can anyone do such difficult work for such a pittance???)

That’s intelligent. :confused:

(pssst…I hate to break it to you, but alcohol costs a lot. Especially when restaurants charge $30 a bottle for $5 a bottle Australian shiraz. And $100+ a bottle for something out of the ordinary. If you’re going to make fun of how much is spent on business entertainment, ask the restaurant industry how they justify a 600% markup on wine.)

It never ceases to amaze me how little some people want to actually do work to get business. Adding up and totalling and tracking 20 checks/orders is NOTHING. Let’s say at worst it keeps a $10/hour employee busy for an hour. That’s a SOLID HOUR of that person’s time devoted to nothing more than tracking the orders of just 20 people. So, loaded at 2.0 for benefits/overheads, the restaurant could spend $20 to get $2500 in revenue.

Maybe you need my sister, the multiple-degreed accountant to do it for you on contract. She might charge $200 for an hour though. I guess it’s better than sending away $2500 in business.

Like I said - no wonder the economy sucks. I’ve never had a restaurant in Europe refuse to make separate checks for 20 or more people before. They seem to be more interested in getting business than not. Funny that, although I’m sure there are exceptions.

Oh yes, let’s have 20 people all spend 15 minutes scanning and figuring out and arguing over a bill that’s about 3-feet long and includes several starters, desserts, a bar tab added to it, drinks that people may or may not have had, items that the servers tried to sneak on that NO ONE had (which happens nearly every single check…which makes me wonder what the real ulterior motive is of the combined bills) and then have them all divide up the tax and gratuity - never mind the fact that most of us aren’t carrying pocket calculators with us to do that.

And then of half of the people need to hand the servers $100’s or $50’s, or $20’s for change, and then the servers have to run back and forth to make change for them (since most VPs and senior business people don’t carry changers on our belts). The other half will pay by credit card anyhow, and the servers have to run those separately…

Gee, what effort is being saved, exactly, by making one bill? I guess I’m too stupid to figure it out.

Oh, and as a side note? I don’t eat at those places unless someone else or my expense account is paying, lest you just chalk me into the “Yuppies suck!” column. :rolleyes:

31

Oh, calm the hell down.

I hope you don’t get this worked up over everything, or else you’re blood pressure’s probably insane.

Considering 20 people divided up into 4 tops is only 5 checks vs. 20 individual ones, yeah, it does make a difference.

I’ve always worked for smaller restaurants, usually with only two or three computers, so when a server is stuck at one making 20 odd checks (usually you’ve got to do something special, to turn 5 tables into 20, many times having to grab a manager while you’re at it)and then closing out 20 seperate checks and running 10 or so credit cards vs. 5, it tends to have that ripple effect on the rest of the restaurant that I was talking about before.

And unless you’ve actually worked in the industry (it doesn’t sound like you have) please don’t presume to tell me what is and what’s not *nothing. Because obviously you have no idea.

It depends on the individual restaurant, the computer system, and the time of day. I’m telling you that in a smallish restaurant, with a computer system that doesn’t have seat numbers (thus allowing you to easily split a check at the end of the meal) and in the middle of a rush, it’s not as easy as you’re ranting and raving it is. So before you go insulting the restaurant and the people working there as if they’re refusing your business in order to personally slight you, you may want to think about the effect your desires are having on the restaurant.

Think about it. What restaurant wants to turn away $2500 in business? If they do, obviously they have good reason. No manager in her right mind would turn that business away unless they honestly felt it would be too detrimental to the rest of the restaurant and servers to justify doing what you want.

You’ve got a head for business, figure it out.

As far as your accusation that servers prefer single checks because they’re trying to cheat you by sticking stuff you didn’t order onto the check, I’m not even going to justify that with an answer. That’s a cheap shot and does nothing to strengthen your position.

I’m very impressed your sister is a multiple degreed accountant. Is that supposed to impress me?

Also think about the fact that all those appetizers and bottles of wine you’re ordering don’t go on a specific tab, unless someone specifies that to the server. How is she supposed to know? Does she make yet another ticket for those? How do you split those up? Don’t tell me you do it yourselves?? Perish the thought!

32

Whoops, that was supposed to read, I’m very happy your sister is a multiple degreed accountant.

[sub]Must remember not to post pre-coffee![/sub]

33

This has never been, and never will be, a substitute for an actual intelligent rebuttal. And it’s highly ironic, too.

PS - I don’t recall saying where I personally insulted the "restaurant and the people working there ", but I’m sure I must have somewhere…I know you’ll point it out to me, though.

You feel that somehow keeping track of 20 orders is a Herculean task that no one should be expected to do. I think that’s bullshit. And even if you DID have the entire thing on one bill, which completely falls in line with what you desire, someone could sit there with a fucking pocket calculator and divide up the bill per person, then enter it into the register. You do know who ordered what, right? Otherwise, how do you put it on the table in front of them?

But no, you would have me believe that even having a person sit down for 10 minutes (30 seconds per tab) and come up with separate checks is something that cannot be expected of anyone. And here I thought Engineering was hard.

In fact, I think it is YOU who are being insulting to the serving profession in these examples, as I think you are almost saying that servers in restaurants just couldn’t wrap their minds around the concept of splitting a bill. I tend to think that the average server is an average person who has the ability to do this task. And that good servers are pros and experienced and know how to handle this situation. Being a good server is not a brainless job, it’s a matter of balancing schedules of the tables, checking and doing the rounds, handling special requests, checking in the kitchen, handling the money, acting as a saleswoman (of sorts), and being the ombudswoman for complaints and problems.

But then, I wouldn’t know anything about that, because I haven’t worked in the industry, so I guess I’m wrong on that notion.

That having been said, I need to know fuck all about running a restaurant to know that I can take a single bill, note who ordered what (which is something that the servers do in fact know, although now you’ll likely come back with “NO, the servers do NOT know who ordered what, don’t you DARE to presume to tell me what we know!”), and add the numbers and come up with 20 bills. And then enter these into the register. Let’s say that takes another minute per bill (somehow). We’re now up to half an hour. Gee, having a (sadly) near minimum-wage person working for half an hour is so expensive, compared to the $2500 in revenue…you may as well shut the doors and declare bankruptcy if that’s the case.

As to my “accusation” of things being added to the bill - well, my dear, it has happened on every single occasion except one in 7 years of hosting events like this. Even when I have appointed an employee under me to watch and note and keep a parallel list of who ordered what. Funny how there always seems to be one porterhouse too many, or one bottle of champagne that no one remembers having, or even the “double gratuity”, which appears twice on the bill and gets added in twice. But hey, you’re supposed to leave a 40% tip regardless of the quality of the service, right?

Yeesh. Just because you can’t figure it out doesn’t mean that there aren’t a plethora of sharp, experienced servers out there who could do it in a second. And I vote with my very substantial entertainment budget to patronize them. The rest, well, it may not hurt their business in a way that they perceive, but it sure as hell doesn’t help their business either. Oh well, I guess.

34

After reading this post I’m puzzled about how the HELL this OP relates to poor people. The title should have been something to the effect of “Cheapskate bitch, pay your own tab!!”

35

Well, thank you for fighting the good fight on behalf of the intelligence of servers everywhere.

Please.

For the umpteenth time, it’s not a matter of splitting a check in your head, it’s a matter of the tangible, actual consequences of manually splitting a check 20 ways. Would you like me to type that slower for you?

IMHO, you can’t just enter in random totals into a computer in a restaurant. They have to coincide with something on the menu, and that item needs to be what’s entered. So it’s not a matter of the server busting out a calculater, then just “creating” multiple tabs. It’d be nice if you were able to do that on restaurant computers, but you can’t. At least, not in any I’ve worked in.

I’m telling you, in my experience working in the types of restaurant I’ve worked in, that we would’ve probably turned you away as well. I’m telling you why. Bitch and moan and imply that we’re being lazy vs. having good reasons for turning you away all you want, it doesn’t change the fact that you would’ve been turned away. As you have. There are probably other places that’ll be happy to do it. They probably have better computers (I’ve worked in a place with a system that did allow you to do that). Great! Go there! Doesn’t change the reasoning behind why others refused to do it.

Implying that servers and management are just lazy and refusing to do a “simple” task is more insulting to servers and management than my actually giving logical reasons why some wouldn’t do it is.

And I’m genuinely curious as to why your lavish expense account doesn’t allow for paying for your guest’s meals. Making people you’re trying to impress pony up for their portion of the bill doesn’t seem to be very beneficial to the whole schmoozing concept.

36

That’s great, and you missed my point entirely, which was involving the cost-benefit of accomodating reasonable requests from patrons versus telling them to get stuffed and take their business elsewhere.

I have clients who are morally opposed to paying for anything that has alcohol on it, that will refuse to pay part of a bill that has any drinks on it. Seriously, they tell the restaurant that they will not pay the bill when there is alcohol on it unless they have a separate check. And when the restaurant refuses…who picks it up?

I have clients who for religious reasons will not pay part of a bill that has pork on it. Are they being silly? I don’t think so, and I don’t claim to know why they would be unable to do that, but I also don’t know how to help them when the servers won’t give them an individual ticket that does not list pork on it.

In cases where we are all going Dutch, which happens at least half the time, I have clients who need to turn in a bill for reporting expenses. And as required by Federal law in our accounting practices, they must separate out the alcohol from the non-alcohol portion. So what happens? Well, the servers then print out 20 copies of the same damn 3-foot long bill, and each person then has to turn that in to their financial reimbursement people and hope that they believe that they ordered X, Y, and Z, and not the lower-priced A and B on it. Since there’s no proof what they ordered. My company recently has said they have the option to refuse to reimburse any non-individually itemized bill due to auditing by the Feds. They haven’t enforced it yet, but they intend to next fiscal year. So what do I do then when printing out a separate bill is refused? What’s your bright idea?

I have clients who barely speak English too. That, combined with the fact that the fucking bill is not always clear, leads to chaos. Trying to argue over who ordered “Bst. Lg $3.50” versus who ordered “SA SA $4.00” versus who ordered “AM $5.00” with people in 7 different languages is pretty damn hard, and doesn’t make anyone appreciate their experience at the restaurant any more.

And it’s something that they shouldn’t have to be doing in the first place.

37

Lezlers - inthe restaruants I’ve worked in, splitting cheques has been no problem for me (the server), the management, the kitchen, the bus people or anyone else. At one place we hosted tour buses on occasion - of course those 40 or so people wanted seperate cheques - it was done with no problem, whatsoever.

Just because you, or your restaraunt are incapable of splitting bills, doesn’t mean that all restaruants are, or even that they find it particularly difficulty. Attacking Una (and this comes accross as an attack) doesn’t bolster your arguement - it just makes you look foolish.

38

Oh for god’s sake.

So if the Feds told you you could only order green food and nothing with red in it, is that also supposed to be the restaurants problem?

Also, the fact that you keep asking “what if the server refuses to split the check then” leads me to wonder if you’re waiting for the bill to get dropped before you ask it to be split.

If that’s the case, you deserve what you get. That’s just obnoxious.

And you never addressed how the server is supposed to know how to split up the bottles of wine and appetizers. If person A, B and C are all splitting a bottle, who’s bill does it go on?

Your expense explanation answered my previous question about the schmoozing though, so please disregard it.

39

I’m glad this thread came along.

I often go to lunch with a group of people (7-8), and we always get seperate checks. I wondered if we were being an incredible pain in the ass.

40

Alice,

In case you hadn’t noticed, I am only speaking for the places I"ve worked in, and said that there are other places who can do it, such as the ones you’ve worked in.

I’m merely trying to explain why some restaurants may not do it. Una seems to be totally closed to the possibility that there might be a logical explanation as to why the refusal might happen.

As for looking foolish, pardon me if I don’t coil back in shame because of your opinion of me. Your opinion ranks pretty damn high on my “people’s opinions of me that I do not give a flying fuck about” list.