Interesting Atlantic article - "All The Single Ladies" - It's OK to be single!

In My Humble Opinion
21

msmith537 has clearly watched a lot more of Sex in the City than I have. I’ve never seen it.

I think this can be true, and I think a part of it is that we put so much damn work into everything.

I jog five times a week and hit the gym a couple times. I walk EVERYWHERE. I eat healthy, pretty much all the time. Mostly fresh veggies I cook myself. I have a wardrobe full of well-fit, attractive clothing that makes me look fabulous. I have a collection of slightly uncomfortable shoes that make my legs look killer and put swagger in my walk. I shave what seems like acres, every day. I artfully apply my make-up so that it looks natural and attractive. I have all kinds of potions that smell wonderful and keep my skin soft. I keep my nails trimmed, clean, and lightly polished at all times. I have a complicated hair washing regime that keeps my somewhat thin hair looking good- and it takes time and money for the products that do that.

Basically, I am always well turned out. In a suit, on a date, or in a club, I’m at my best. And that takes work.

AND I bust ass for my career.
AND I bust ass to be graceful and charming in social situations, when I’m awkward and shy by nature.
AND I bust ass to keep my life together, my finances in line, my health good, my house spotless etc.
AND I bust ass to keep my family happy and be a good friend.
AND I bust ass to keep challenging my mind, to keep learning, etc.

I’m not super fabulous, but my life is good, in part because I work really hard to keep it that way.

And then some guy who hasn’t seen the gym since high school, lives in a pigsty, slacks through life and lives off frozen pizza comes knocking on my door?

Men who would never dream of dating a chubby girl have no problem packing on the beer belly- I’m sorry, but flab is just as unattractive to us as it is to you. Men who would pass me up if I cut my hair short happily gladly walk around with nasty dandruff from their Suave 2-1. Men wouldn’t like it if we wandered around solely in baggy cargo pants and stained tee-shirts. but they adopt that as their uniform. Men with nasty, gnarly faces never look at other women with nasty, gnarly faces. They still think they ought to be dating the cover girl, and we are “spoiled princesses” if we are not overjoyed at his attention.

Is it wrong for a woman who takes care of her body, her health and her looks to hope for a guy who makes some effort to do the same?

22

I think this ends up being a little different for women who want kids. In most situations, the woman’s career is the one that takes a hit after the baby is born, so I totally understand why many women who want to start families have an eye on whether their partner has a career that’s going to allow her a little bit of flexibility in planning a family. The prospect of pregnancy complications, ending up on bed rest, having a longer recovery time, or suffering from post-partum issues (mental or physical, with baby or mother) makes the idea of having children far, far less stressful if their partner has an equally or more successful career. The man can bear more of the childcare burden, but he’ll never be the one hooking himself up to a breast pump at 3am the night before a board meeting.

23

This doesn’t apply to me, but I just feel compelled to say that I think it’s an excellent point!

24

I’m realizing what I posted might be misconstrued- I don’t do these things for men. I do them because I enjoying being fit and being at my best. Nor am I tooting my own horn- I’m not by nature exceptionally attractive.

The major takeaway there is that women generally do put a fair among of effort into making themselves attractive partners on a number of levels, and it can be difficult when what you get out of that is a lot of men who don’t even try.

25

Me either.

The “Charlotte” one doesn’t really work, but otherwise he pretty much nailed it.

26

Are you sure?;):

I’m just teasing you. I would agree that you shouldn’t get married to any old jerk just because it’s something that is expected of you because of some out-dating conservative Middle-American morality. Getting married shouldn’t mean giving up a lifestyle you enjoy. It should be about finding someone to share that lifestyle with you.
I have to imagine though that finding a decent guy has to get a lot harder as you get older. Mostly because it seems like a lot of single guys in their 30s and 40s and beyond act like jerkoffs. They watch movies like The Hangover, think it’s a blueprint for building a life plan. I see a lot of these guys out in the bars looking like Jon Gosselin in his cheeseball Ed-Hardey T-shirts, still hitting on the 22 year olds.

27

Ah yes, ye olde “where are all the good men” bit.

The whole college ratio thing is misguided. Women looking for a career pretty much have to go to college. Men have trades available to them. Some guy who majored in Psych at UMiss-Bumfuck is probably not going to out earn a qualified welder or plumber. The problem is that college women don’t respect trades. That’s a problem with them, not the men. (Please excuse the generalizations here).

Anyone else find that quote shockingly immature and selfish?

28

Heh. I think the “good men,” and by that I mean, “the guys who have always wanted a committed relationship” got snapped up 10 years ago, by like-minded women. Some of them might be divorced now, but certainly not all of them, and if they’re divorced they’re more likely to have kids of their own. Maybe the guys and gals that wanted to wait to settle down did wait, but then the women suddenly realize that their looks won’t last forever and they need to get cracking if they want to have kids, and they wonder where the relationship-minded guys are. The single guys, however, don’t have the same urgency as the women their age, because they don’t have the same biological pressures. If that’s true, then women in their 30s and 40s would end up looking at a pool of mates who are either older than them (and thus ready to settle down) or are divorced (and might have kids).

Of course, I’m talking out my ass there.

29

Nope, you’re right. Men who want to settle down and have a family generally don’t wait until their thirties to get married. Really, anyone who does want a family and has greater foresight than Mr. Magu gets the family thing going before 30.

I’m not saying this as a disinterested observer, or someone who isn’t in the situation. I’m about to be 26, and have been on the road basically for four years straight. If I want to have my first kid around 30 or 31, I need to start that process in the next year or so. It’s not like I am going to be able to go down to the local market and pick up a bride. (I suppose I could mail order one). There’s a process of dating finding the right person, and then a time period where you need to ensure yourself that this is the right person.

If your plan is to spend your 20s partying, building a career, and experiencing life, then don’t be shocked when the 30s come and all the remaining mates are the type of people that spent their 20s partying.

30

Not true. I always wanted a family, but didn’t get married until my 40s. It was just a matter of circumstances. It took me years to get over my extreme shyness – I didn’t start dating at all until my early 30s. (I never dated at all in high school or college.) Then it took a long time to meet the right woman.

31

What’s wrong with it?

32

As a 27 year old guy that recently broke off a 5 year relationship, I’m not at all concerned about trying to start a family. Being in your late 20’s through early/mid 30’s is pretty awesome. To women recently out of college, you’re the more mature and established guy. People your age are also fair game. And, if it’s what you’re going for, the mid-30’s “Oh shit, I need a baby now!” crowd might give you a look.

World, oyster, etc…

33

(bolding mine)

Or building a career, or experiencing life, right? It stands to reason that if some people are single because they are working on their career, then similar-minded folks are too.

34

I never said it was impossible to start a family after 30. Just a lot more difficult. Women’s fertility typically begins dropping at 30, and after 35 it’s a steep drop, for one.

You’re doing it wrong. Your early twenties is time to be out partying and seeing the world. Being in the bars when you’re 27 is fine, but when you hit 30 it turns from cool, to kind of weird, to creepy very quickly.

35

I just didn’t feel like typing the last two.

But hey, someone that spent their 20s too busy with their careers or experiencing life for a relationship is totally going to flip a switch and be responsible long term relationship person when they hit 30.

36

Eh, disagree 100%. Where do you live? Thinking a 30-year-old in a bar in Chicago is weird…is weird.

37

I said at 30 it starts turning from cool to kind of weird. Not that you instantly become weird at 30.

And yes, if I ran into a 32 year old single guy on the prowl in a bar, I’d consider him kind of weird.

38

As a guy in their late 20s, you should know its not that easy. You said earlier that you have been on the family track for 4 years with no luck (unless I am misinterpreting what you wrote). All it takes is finding one more serious relationship that “almost but doesn’t quite” hit the mark and you will be passed your ideal first kid age. Not trying to pile it on here but it is not easy to hit a one year window when you have to add the variable of dating into the already unpredictable variables of general life. Still, I wish you the best because I am right there trying to figure this whole thing out with you.

I have always known that I want kids and a family in the future. As a 27 year old male in a new city, the “30 ideal” is fairly unrealistic for me. I moved to advance my career and have a better chance at my target graduate program and absolutely understood what the move would mean for my future family plans. Being in a new city makes it particularly difficult to meet new people, so I will readily admit that I am not the standard for late 20 something males who are single and interested in having a family.

The last city I lived in had women that followed along with the women in the OPs article. Generally, they were in their 20s focusing on career development and then they would hit their early 30s and panic. Working as a bartender while I was a student, I noticed that girls in their late 20s had little interest in a guy who was doing university research in a design field. Not having a car does not help but otherwise my standard of living should be perfectly acceptable to anyone not needing caviar and country clubs. Of course, I lived in neighborhood loaded with med, law and MBA students and recent grads. So it was easy to have a good time (casually date/sleep around) but challenging to find an actual partner.

I know what you’re saying here but it really depends on the bar. I worked in one bar where anyone below their upper 20s looked out of place and another where you looked like a creeper at 28.

39

Yeah, but how many people do you know have spent their 20’s too busy for any relationship? I know of very few. I’m not even sure how this point is relevant to this discussion.

Women are finding themselves single more often because their standards in men have risen. They have these standards not because they spent their 20’s partying or building a career, but because they no longer need men for survival or self-esteem. A guy can’t just be bring home a paycheck and still be desirable. There’s a greater expectation that he’ll have other attributes that impart value in a relationship. Otherwise, what incentive is there for a woman to start a relationship with him?

Men’s standards for women are also going up, btw. It’s not a one-way street at all, but for some reason we more frequently hear about all the overly picky women out there.

40

Was anyone complaining?

Not all commentary on dating by women is founded on the idea that we are not getting what we want. We are, for the most part, very aware of the trade-offs we are making. We know that being too picky might mean we end up not getting married. We know that by focusing on our career now, we are making sacrifices in terms of relationships and family. We have weighted these options, and choose to do what we are doing, because it suits us.

I have no idea if I will regret my choices (and neither do you) which is one reason why this kind of dialogue between women is useful. These commentaries are about figuring out strategies, sharing experiences, and seeing what works in a world where we can’t just follow our parent’s lead. It’s not, as you seem to assume, about being secretly or openly miserable that we are single. It’s not about “where are the good men” but more “why I’m not interested in these particular men.” No misery, whining or pathos about it. Just talking about the choices we’ve made and how we are working with them.

Why is it a “problem” that “college women don’t respect trades.”? If women are overwhelming conforming to a pattern, don’t you think that maybe, just maybe, they have some reason behind it besides being flighty and irrational beings? I, for one, have dated people who did not have a college education and, for the most part, we have nothing to talk about. When I spend all day writing academic research papers on the effects of trade policy on inflation in Latin America, and he spends all day thinking about plumbing, we just don’t have much in common.

I keep thinking, and I can’t even see a way that it immature and selfish.

Does this go for men, too? Because if we kick everyone over 30 out of bars, bars are going to get really empty. As for “the time to be out partying and seeing the world,” speak for yourself. I’m nowhere near done “seeing the world” and I really don’t care about your opinion about what I “should” be doing at this stage of my life.