Isn’t it up to the couple what the boundaries of their relationship are? I have a similar thing with my best friend. I’m one of those people who needs a sounding board; I need to talk it out with a neutral party. My fiance is much the same. We’ve discussed, repeatedly, how venting to our best friends has been for the better in our relationship. It filters the things we chose to keep fighting about, as opposed to just letting them go. Obviously Sneak is no longer on board with this, but if it was made clear from Day 1, I don’t think LL did anything wrong up to this point. It’s like someone who agreed to an open relationship suddenly throwing a tantrum about adultery. I don’t like the implication that what works very well for us makes me (both of us, really) a jerk by default. Not everyone’s relationship operates the same way.
(FWIW, my parents, happily married for 35 years, run their relationship the same way. It’s where I learned it from. Can’t be all bad.)
I keep any relationship drama strictly between me and my guy, but I still side with LL. If it was part of their accepted dynamic that LL tells BFF everything, then it’s part of the deal. It does not give S the right to snoop.
Never
No
Grave invasion
3A. As others have said, it would depend on other relationship factors. In my current relationship, no. If I’d only been dating someone for 6 months, quite possibly yes.
No, of course not. Occasionally, while feeling really adventurous, I have checked the names and topic of emails IF the account was left open on my computer.
No, as evidenced by the fact that I have never been charged with homicide.
See (2). I would be blinded by anger. My blood pressure is spiking just imagining it.
3A. No. Every one gets one free* pass.
*Free: one hell of a fight that sets down the rules about privacy hard and fast.
However, I do not complain about my partner to my friends. If I did so, I would already be considering ending the relationship.
There is nothing in the OP that says that Sneak accepted BFF being privy to the relationship details, only that LL has insisted that she will be, period. I’d say the fact that Sneak has asked for an apology from LL for discussing the argument says the opposite: that he is not okay with it, and the matter was not discussed with him at all. In which case it really doesn’t matter how long-standing this BFF-LL “arrangement” was or how much Sneak and LL’s relationship benefited from BFF’s advice-- it was wrong of LL to make it BFF’s business in the first place. Seems to me that LL’s anger over the invasion of her privacy is very hypocritical.
Who are you supposed to talk to when things get tough? I know, your partner, but sometimes, you need a different perspective. When I talk to my best friend about my relationship, I want him to tell me if I’m being an asshole. Sometimes he does, sometimes he doesn’t, but it’s a POV I trust. I would go insane if I didn’t have that head check, and maybe LL in this story is too. Just because you don’t need that kind of support outside your relationship doesn’t mean it’s wrong to need it at all, or that LL shouldn’t have it. It’s not a justification for Sneak snooping, either.
Then LL needs to end the relationship, and tell Sneak that he’s blown it - preferably while calling from a new location after she’s already moved out. She should also tell the IT staff at work about Sneak’s accessing the mail server.
I was taking issue with LL telling Sneak that no topic is off-limits and it’s tough cookies if he doesn’t like that. Of course I don’t have issue with people seeking advice from others; I do, however, have issue with people saying, “Hey, I’m going to talk and bitch to this person about our relationship. Don’t like it? Too bad.”
My point, basically, is that since Sneak has objections to LL discussing things with BFF (which he obviously does, given that 1) he’s asked for an apology in this instance, and 2) LL has reiterated that BFF is always gonna be in the loop-- why is being repeated unless it keeps coming up?), then LL was wrong to vent about this argument to BFF. It seems to me LL knows Sneak doesn’t like her discussing details with BFF, but just doesn’t care enough about his feelings to keep their problems to herself.
Now, I don’t know whether Sneak has issues with LL discussing their relationship with others in general, or if he just has issues with LL talking to BFF specifically. But I personally would be a little more respectful of my SO’s privacy than LL is being, BFF being my BFF notwithstanding. Or I’d break up with my SO. Either way, I see no point of making my friendship with a confidante a point of contention in a relationship. You’re supposed to enjoy those relationships, not pit them against each other.
Also, I never said it was wrong to need a friend’s support or that I didn’t need it myself or that LL shouldn’t have it or that it justified Sneak’s behavior. With regard to the last point, I’ve actually said the opposite.
Don’t you think it’s more unfair of Sneak to tell LL “change the terms of your relationship to your best friend, who presumably you’ve known longer than you’ve known me-- start keeping secrets from her, keep your feelings about our relationship from her”? That’s just unrealistic, I think. BFF is probably like part of her brain now. It would feel unnatural for her to keep things from her friend. I think Sneak probably knew that from the beginning, so it is tough cookies if he doesn’t like it now.
And I’m saying, that’s too bad for Sneak. I wouldn’t change my openness with my best friend for my SO. I actually think that’s a recipe for the downfall of the relationship with his SO-- he’s just jealous, probably. If he was being rational he would WANT her to vent to her BFF rather than hold it in and unload it all on him.
There would be no need for an apology if he wasn’t such a sneak. She should apologize to him for “discussing the sitution”? How controlling is that? Please.
I still don’t see how or why.
That’s your assumption. I don’t think it’s really fair to LL. Maybe she needs to talk to her friend to stay sane about things, or just to get it off her chest so she can be calm when she talks to him. You assume she’s talking to her BFF to spite Sneak. I doubt it. I’m sure she’s doing it because that’s what she needs to do to process the situation. If Sneak can’t deal with that, and needs to resort to espionage, then he needs to go away, because he’s in the wrong and he’s acting like a controlling, intrusive nutcase.
Who made it a point of contention? It was a pre-existing situation and it wasn’t a problem until he started snooping.
LL needed BFF’s support. You’re saying she was wrong to seek it because it upsets Sneak. I’m saying, too bad for Sneak. You’re not saying it justified his behavior, fine, but you’re ignoring what that behavior means-- there’s a pattern here, and all of it makes Sneak look bad. Trying to cut her ties to people she’s close to, invading her privacy, being, in the OP’s words, “a heinous asshole”… she should run away.
Just saying, if you think she needs to apologize or mess with the one obviously successful relationship in this situation, then I think your assessment of the situation is off.
1. Have you/would you snoop a private work email account belonging to a significant other?
No.
2. Have you been snooped in such a manner, that you know of?
Yes.
3. Would you consider this to be a grave invasion of privacy or is it no big deal to you? Terrible invasion of privacy. I’m kind of a privacy nut anyway, and instinctively sensitive to such things.
3A. If you go with “grave invasion,” would it be enough to end the relationship over?
Probably, but it depends on the person, the circumstances, etc.
I have no desire to continue this conversation, Rubystreak, as you continue to put words in my mouth. For example, I never said LL is blabbing to BFF just to spite Sneak; I just said she doesn’t respect his feelings enough to keep quiet. Between that and that this is a hypothetical, I see no reason to continue.
1&2: In 16 years of marriage, I’ve never read my wife’s regular mail or email without asking. I’m pretty sure that goes both ways.
3&3A: On a scale from 0 = no big deal to 10 = grave enough invasion to end the relationship on account of, I’d give this about a 2. I’d be bothered by it, but not upset. But I’d still probably sit down with my wife to see if we could harmonize our differing expectations of privacy.
Not my conversation, but I don’t think that’s unfair. You have to commit to your partner and the Relationship has a right to privacy, just as do the individuals in it.
Of course, the first indication of an abuser is a determination to separate the object of abuse from external support systems and frames of reference, so one really needs to know the details of the relationship before advising.
But if you’re fighting with and bitching about your sweetie all the time, maybe you re-evaluate the relationship. Doesn’t sound like you’re good for each other.
No need to go off in a huff about it, though. Really.
You said that LL is “making it a point of contention” that she needs to confide in her friend. IOW, she is continuing to do it, in a deliberate way, knowing Sneak is against it, because she doesn’t respect him, and is continuing to cause it to be a conflict point. I see Sneak as the one who is “making it a point of contention,” and it is his very concrete and demonstrable disrespect of her that has caused this point of contention. So while “spite” may have been the wrong word, you placing the onus of this problem on LL, and my objection to it, remain.
Oh, I’m not so sure it’s hypothetical, but OK.
Couldn’t agree more. Obviously, if things have gotten this bad, it maybe should be over. But I think it was Sneak who pushed it over the edge into Crazyland, and LL just did as she always did. He never would have known about it if he wasn’t totally overstepping her boundaries.