Wow. It appears that I have a secret twin, and her name is bodypoet. Those posts could describe me–except, I’m a librarian and not a poet, and I don’t have a paper route–yet.
So, to ask a question–do you other SAH types get a lot of flack for your decision? Maybe I’m really lucky, 'cause the only place I ever hear SAHM = Oprah addict stereotypes or other negative opinions of us is right here. SAHMing seems to be fairly common here.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by andros *
**
I’m not pleading for understanding. I’m asking for respect, and I don’t think that’s unreasonable. I don’t put down parents who work. I wouldn’t belittle them by using phrases like “parents who don’t care enough to stay home with their babies” or “uncaring, work-out-of-the-home dads”. That would be unkind and, well, dumb. They work for their own good reasons (not the least of which might be food and other Fun Stuff), and I respect that.
I already feel good about my choices, and I feel confident about what I’m doing. But if we are about fighting ignorance here, then we should be working against generalizing and stereotyping.
I’m assuming you’re expecting a baby? Congrats, andros. 
Nope, already have one. Just lookign forward to leaving my job.
Admittedly, I might have a different perspective on SAH being male, but I’m still not understanding why it’s important that the whole world respect me. Screw 'em. They don’t like my decision and want to call me names? Oh bloody well, huh? I’m over it.
No, she’s not your twin. She’s your triplet. I’m the third one. I do work outside of the home (I am pretty sure I’d be arrested for child abuse within a week if I were a stay-at-home mom) but my housekeeping, my frequency of vacuuming, and my child’s appearance sound eerily like bodypoet is a long-lost sister of mine.
FTR, I certainly believe (and I think most intelligent people agree with me) that there is no more important job in the world than raising the next little crop of humans who will one day research cancer, pick up our garbage, write symphonies, explore space, grow vegetables, solve world hunger, embrace their neighbors, vote for leaders, and fix our cars. I know it’s underpaid, underappreciated, and the rewards are almost wholly intrinsic. But god, what a mission, what a job. I am awed by it.
Ahhh. Congrats anyhoo.
I am curious about how perspectives re: SAHDs might be different. Maybe some of our SAHDs will chime in here. For instance, it seems to me, and this is only my take on it, that the common perception is:
SAHD=extremely dedicated dad
with a small minority designated as:
SAHD=lazy bum who doesn’t wanna work.
I go with the first belief, of course, but there are always those few who can not believe a man would voluntarily make this choice unless he is lazy or can’t find work.
OTOH, being a SAHM, what I pick up on are slight caveats, like:
SAHM=extremely dedicated mom who doesn’t want to “work” anyway
or SAHM=mom who just doesn’t need the money from a “real job” (oh yeah. I WISH.)
Not all people have this type of attitude of course, but it is sadly common, ime.
~k
Oh, I wanted to add:
When I hear a mom has made this decision (and I have several good friends who went this route) I think of them as brave and self-aware. When I dropped to part-time work I went through a major crisis in confidence and even identity. It was very difficult for me to change my conception of myself, evven if my reasons for changing my work schedule were valid, sensible, and endorsed by everyone. I think it takes guts and a lot of good sense to weigh everything and decide that your place is at home with your kids, especially in the face of things like societal doubts about your worth and intelligence.
Also, I’ll smack the next person who apologizes for “wasting their education.” If you’re educated, that gets passed on, too, in your reading habits, your knowledge, your appreciation for information. I know some lawyers and a biochemist that are home with toddlers. They’re not teaching those kids law or biochemistry, of course, but I know their education comes through in a lot of subtle but important ways.
I do all that and manage to work 37.5 hours a week. I don’t think you’re any better than me and I don’t think I’m any better than you and I don’t think you’re kids are being raised any better than mine are. I completely agree with andros… fuck what everyone else thinks. You’re doing what’s right for you and your family the same as I am. Who cares what everyone else thinks.
[sub]People who forget to preview…[/sub]
~k
Amen, Rachelle.
Bingo!
You would not believe the people who have told my husband that he is crazy to be quitting his job as a corporate VP to record and perform music for a living. First off, what is to them if we have to eat Ramen soup for the next 10 years? Fuck 'em all. We don’t have kids, we made the decision ourselves, and many of his soon to be former co-workers are absolutely, seethingly jealous. It’s unreal how people will put down the very life they wish they could have deep down.
Zette
Everyone makes choices. What’s great is that we get to make the choices. I completely support you, bodypoet, in your choice (and I’ve said that before to you). But then you have to go and throw this in:
Most of us are doing the best job we can raising our kids, whether we get to work (and by work I mean paying job outside the home, not meaning to imply that SAHMs don’t work, I think we all know most of you don’t sit on your butt watching Oprah and eating bon bons), or whether we get to stay at home. Some of us work because (like Cranky or myself) we know being a SAHM would put us into the loony bin. Some of us stay at home because we’ve discovered corporate life isn’t what we thought it would be and even the rigors of a home of babies and toddlers is easier. Some of us work because we need the income, some of us stay at home because we can’t afford to work. And then there are the truly lucky - the SAHMs who are SAHMs because they think they are doing the most fulfilling job in the world. And those WOTH moms who find true fulfillment in what they do every day.
The SAHDs I know love it, but not because of the positive feedback - they claim they get a lot more of the “lazy bum, can’t you provide decent for your wife and kids” than the dedicated dad bit. But they do love it because their expectations are on spending time raising their kids – not keeping a clean house, or baking bread, or taking up quilting (expectations my female friends had to get over to become happy about being SAHMs). I think most of them are more like andros than most of my female friends - “hey, this is what I’m doing, did I ask what you thought? and why should I care.”
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Zette *
**
Or you could give some of them the benefit of the doubt. I have a good friend who has done pretty much what you describe (except he wasn’t a VP). I think he’s crazy (but I love and support him anyway) - in part because I crave security, especially financial security. I worry about my own financial security - and I worry about the financial security of the people I care about. He doesn’t, its his life, he gets to live it. But by my values, it is a little nuts. Doesn’t mean I’m jealous - far from it, its a lifestyle I’d never choose for myself. Doesn’t mean I don’t love him and care about him.
Well said, and I agree completely. You are brave to say it first, and I was thinking the same thing. Without naming names, must say, some men on this board might think they were born when the stork brought them to Mummy and Daddy’s house. Who raised them?
Hubby is a SAHD. He works twice as hard as I do, for no pay. We have two toddlers together: a three year old boy and a two year old girl. He is so wonderful. I have to admit, I get jealous at times, because he gets all the fun and the smiles and the giggles during the day. I would trade places with him in a heartbeat.
He worked for a bit, but when we realized that day care for both children would take most of his paycheck, one of us had to quit. I had the more stable job, the benefits, and could support the entire family better than he could, so he quit.
He’s a loving father, caring husband, great cook, and all-around perfect guy. And he gets a hard time from people who think he simply does not want to work.
Ooops, Dangerosa. Sorry. I don’t think I made myself clear enough. The quote I used is NOT how I feel!! I was thinking of how frustrating it is to hear from one side how SAHMs are (insert negative adjective here), and from the “other” side, to hear how it is all the fault of WOTH moms when kids get into trouble.
I fully, completely, unconditionally support whatever choice each parent makes regarding working out or staying in the home. I do NOT think that staying at home makes me a better parent (I mean, I am better than I, personally, would be if I were working, but not better than other parents), or makes my kids better than anyone else’s kids.
I taught in a public high school for ten years, and I did run into kids whose parents didn’t “raise” them. BUT those parents came in all configurations…SAH, WOTH, you name it. Good parenting has everything to do with dedication, devotion, and discipline, and good parents are to be had in all forms, working OTH or not.
Whew. Did I fix that one?
All I really wanted to point out is that stereotyping is not okay…and the stereotype of the lazy, vapid SAHparent is one of the few left that people feel comfortable using and/or hearing.
~karol
Yeah, you fixed it. Been in this conversation with you before, so I knew it didn’t read right. But it does go to show how innocent remarks (like the one in the Oprah thread) can get skewed wrong - especially on a subject folks are touchy about.
You’re doing an awesome job, Rachelle, because I seriously couldn’t manage it. I did work full-time when my two oldest were babies, but I sure don’t remember how I coped. 
Of course, if it comes to it, someone will be bound to see your 37.5 hours/week and raise you a two-hour commute (uphill both ways) and a Pulitzer-prize winning novel. My own mother always pulls the “Well, I had FOUR kids under the age of five…” thing with me. Which, somehow, surprisingly enough, does NOT seem to make my work any simpler or quicker.
I do not think that my kids are being raised any better than yours, and I hope I didn’t imply that anywhere. I’m all for each parent making this call for him/herself. I just don’t think any of us should be put down for our choices.
Best wishes
~k
Hey bodypoet, what a classy rant! I agree completely. I don’t have kids. I’m just a plain ol’ workin’ gal, but parents, whether they work or stay at home, have my COMPLETE respect. I just look at my mom now that I’m supposed to be grown, and I just marvel at what a remarkable woman she is. She wanted to be a SAHM, but we couldn’t afford that. So she taught school, came home got dinner on the table, took care of the house, and with my father’s help raised us, and I know it wasn’t easy for her to do. I get upset everygoddamntime I see folks spouting off those stereotypes about SAH parents having it easy, sittin’ around eatin’ candy, reading Harlequins and such like*. Them folks just talkin’ out they ass, that’s all. I agree with andros about tellin’ them to FUCK OFF, but I still think that folks really need to understand that SAH parents deserve our respect because they workin’ 24/7 and ain’t gettin’ paid for it neither. I’m glad you started this thread to educate us on SAH parents, folks we take for granted and like to THINK we know and judge.
*There’s nothin’ wrong with stayin’ at home readin’ Harlequins or whatever book you want to read if you can afford it and that’s what makes you happy. Shit if that’s what really goes on with the SAH parent role, then sign me up! I got a house full of books just cryin’ for attention.
bodyfire, you rock.
My wife, who also used to be a teacher (and intends to return someday) stays at home with our two daughters (3.5 & .5 years). The only thing that makes me happier than us being able to afford her doing that is that she enjoys and does such an amazing job of it.
The house is usually a disaster, I do most of the cooking (I love to cook), and I can’t remember if I’ve ever seen the laundry hamper without something in it, and I wouldn’t change a thing if I could. Including the fact that she likes Oprah! [sub]she even reads the books.[/sub] As a result, the oldest loves to read as well. As a matter of fact, the only time the TV is on is for Oprah and HNIC (my bad - the little tomboy is a big Mats Sundin fan) [sub]my Bog, I’m raising a Leafs fan!!![/sub]
I thank providence that the SO does what she does as well as she does, and I’ve had more than one exchange with colleagues who make those stereotypical cracks. This from men who need to be periodically reintroduced to their SOs due to work schedules or other vices much more vile than Oprah.
I worship the ground my SAHM walks on, and I might be inclined to look at a copy of Wind to appreciate the work of another ‘non-working’ member of society.
z
Boy, ain’t that they truth! My economist/statistician SAHM used to read me Poe and discuss local politics with me. So, I ended up being a 5-year-old trying to talk Poe and local politics with my kindergarten classmates. It sure didn’t go over too well.
She screwed me up but good!
In the end though, I am immensely grateful to her. I ended up with a huge sense of intellectual curiosity and a broad base of very useful knowledge. And my brother and I have managed to exist here at the SDMB for a collective total of more than 39 months and 3700 posts without getting seriously flamed. Now, that’s an accomplishment!
And there’s life after SAHM-hood, too. My mom may have “wasted her education” for 15-20 years while she raised us. But now that we’re grown and gone, she’s an active leader in…local politics! She’s a genu-ine elected official! She’s chairman of the board of trustees of our hometown’s extremely large, influential, and extremely controversial public library. She’s the #1 big cheese. She just presided over a $6 million renovation. And she still recites Poe to me.