What do you find more offensive?
I find burning the flag more offensive.
I am also firmly in the “Flag burning is protected speech” camp.
I can’t imagine why burning any piece of cloth or paper with anything on it is offensive. Get over it.
It is offensive because of the intention behind it, which is the wilful destruction of a national symbol. (The flag is somewhat unique in American culture as being pretty much the only thing we all can agree that we like.)
That said, I’m not one to get in much of a snit over it. Jerks behave like jerks; film at 11.
Depends on who is doing the burning and why.
We must know different people, because there are certainly plenty of Americans who don’t like or don’t care about the US flag.
I find burning a flag more offensive than burning a map, because it’s a stronger symbol. But I do believe that flag burning should be protected free speech.
Neither of them is offensive to me, and I voted accordingly, but burning the flag certainly has a symbolism that burning a map or banner lacks, because there are rituals in American society associated specifically with the flag. If someone burned a map or banner I would be confused, but if someone burned a US flag I would immediately know they were pissed off with the country for whatever reason.
-Electric Warrior, American
How about burning a Nazi flag? Is that offensive?
Godwin in less than 10, what do I win?
Burning the flag is a well-known symbol of showing contempt for my country. That’s offensive. Burning a map or banner with the same contempt is equally offensive. It’s not the action, it’s the thought.
I think the intent can be equally offensive. Burning a flag is just a clearer signal of that intent, for the ceremonial and cultural reasons others mentioned.
Says you. It is horrible looking and is designed all wrong. The stripes should be vertical and the red ones should be green and the white ones should be purple. The stars should be blue triangles and be set in a trapezoidal field of orange in the lower right hand side. Also the flag should be circular. Why should we be sheeple like the rest of the world and have a rectangular shaped flag.
I’m not bothered by the burning of any of the examples and like Friedo said:
Absolutely, if you’re a NAZI. Are you admitting to being a NAZI?
TWEET!
This is going down hill fast, folks. If you wish to debate the topic, please take it to Great Debates. The OP asked “What do you find more offensive?”, so please try to state your own feelings on the matter without criticizing the personal feelings of the other posters.
Thank you.
Definitely this. Check out Penn & Teller’s flag burning routine. (I’m at work or I would fetch a link for you). It’s inspiring.
However, I voted flag burning as the most offensive. Clearly not so with Penn & Teller and clearly not so in the case of an accidental burning. I presume the poll intends “burning in protest.”
I am a Canadian - born & raised. A couple years ago I visited Washington D.C. and saw the Fort McHenry flag - the flag that “was still there,” the inspiration of the US national anthem. It was a profoundly moving experience - from the actor portraying Mary Pickersgill (the woman commissioned to create the flag) inviting kids to place the lifesized stars on the blue fabric she had rolled out, through to the solemn procession through the pavilion to view what’s left of the flag itself. It literally brought a tear to my eye. The flag is not meaningless and burning it is not simply engaging in an exercise in combustion.
Why, because the cloth has any special properties? No, but for all the ideals the flag symbolizes. The flag doesn’t represent the current administration’s foreign policy. It represents the people it flies over, and the noble principles on which the country was founded. Burning the flag says “Fuck you” to all that is good in America.
If I as a person did something to hurt you, and you bring that to my attention by pissing on my mother’s grave, that is unequivocally an offensive act irrespective of how correct you are or how badly I treated you - and claiming it’s just a plot of ground underwhich my mother happens to be buried isn’t the point.
Having said that, I agree with Valgard that protesters should certainly be permitted to burn the flag. I require no protection from being offended. Protesters who exercise that right, though, run the risk of having their message drowned out by the sense of outrage that act provokes.
Even the Nazis?
I kid.
I don’t find any of it offensive (and you can even substitute the Canadian and/or Québec flags into this discussion; I’ve seen both and am not offended by the act).
I think it’s an impolite way to behave towards our southern neighbour, but I don’t find the burning of a foreign flag offensive.
I voted “I’m a douche thinking “what if the map is another country with initials US?” and deserve a beating” because - well, primarily because I’m a douche.
I don’t find flag-burning offensive, or at least no more so than if someone were to just say the thoughts behind the action (e.g. “I hate your nation and think you’re all scum” or something like that). I don’t think it’s a particularly effective thing to do and I’ve never really understood all the emphasis that’s placed on flags - it’s a symbol, nothing more and nothing less.
That said, since it’s been suggested I am actually wondering - what if it is a different country? A country like, oh, I don’t know, Iraq? Or Afghanistan? Personally, I think that burning a map of Iraq with “USA” stamped on it is making more of a statement than simply burning an American flag. If someone goes and burns an American flag, then they’re most likely trying to express the sentiment “I think America sucks” or something else general like that. If someone burns a huge map of Afghanistan upon which they’ve stenciled a symbol of America, then the message is much more focused.
I figure wanting to offend people is the reason flags are burnt. It’s intended to be offensive.
That said, it’s protected speech. One of the things the flag symbolizes is the freedom to burn it.