A California girls basketball coach was suspended because her team ran up a score to 161-2.LINK
What do you all think?
I think first of all it is going to happen that some teams are just darn good and others are totally bad even when leagues are supposed to be equal. Its bad sportsmanship though for a top level coach to run up a high score to this point.
The better coach should have 1. known how dominant her team was ahead of time and 2. only played her lower tier players (she kept her starters in until half).
BTW, usually they dont have “mercy rules” at this level.
I think that all sports should have an honourable “throw in the towel” option - the onus should be on the hopelessly outclassed team to do the surrendering, not the victors.
Without a mercy rule, I don’t really know what they expect the guy to do. Tell his players to just stand around having a wank while the other guys run up the score a bit? And where’s the cutoff between a big victory and being a dick?
Well as I said they could play their 2nd or 3rd stringers. Maybe not do full course press, tell his players to pass 5 times before shooting, tell his top scorers they cannot shoot and must pass the ball. I once saw a game where Micheal Jordan played in a charity game with some celebs and he never took the shot but always passed the ball to others.
Best thing would be to get their team into some tournaments or a different league where they were playing higher quality teams.
Yeah, I can see that also. No need to let your players feel like crap. And sometimes as a coach your just stuck with kids with no talent. Soccer used to be this way with schools with heavy talent and other schools which were just introducing the sport.
We actually had a lacrosse coach who pulled his kids off the field and threw the game because the other team was playing ringers (older kids).
The article does say he benched his starters and told them to run down the shot clock. A high school team may not have enough people to have a full second or third string, but I have no idea how big their team actually is. It really sounds like this is a failure in the league rules, not anything bad that the coach did.
Benching your starters once the game is out of hand and giving an opportunity to the subs is fine. Are you supposed to tell the subs not to play hard, when they’re getting what may be one of their few or only opportunities to participate in the game?
“Running up the score” is an embarrassment chiefly to the opposing coach. Catering to their hurt feelings (and maybe worries about job security) isn’t what playing games is supposed to be about.
This. The game was unavoidably going to be lopsided, but I coached teams where that was the direction to the superior team (and this was when one team so outclassed the other that the difference was a chasm)–everyone’s going to play, you will not shoot until we make five passes, no full-court presses, play a modified defense. Explain exactly why you’re doing so, and why that’s important. It teaches kids at that level a valuable lesson about being good sports. If rules would have permitted it, split up the teams to play a mixed squad against a mixed squad.
Losing is also an important experience and lesson, but IMO there’s a line that gets crossed, and I agree with the losing coach: the other guy did not serve his own team well. He let them down, though I’m sure he doesn’t see it that way. He missed a real coaching opportunity, one that did not get realized by spanking a significantly inferior opponent well past the point of humiliation. If he had given his girls the message, they would have known just what to do and taken their foot a bit off the gas.
I came to grow sick to death coaching against “we’re here only to win” types who shrieked at their kids and acted like they were coaching a pro team. Most kids will not play at higher levels. Almost 100% of them. What they should learn are, first, fundamentals; later some advanced stuff as skills progress; and at all levels, team work, discipline, and how to be a good sport. That last bit will serve them well throughout their lives.
He didn’t pull his starters until the second half. He didn’t stop pressing until the second half. By that point he was up 104-1.
He talked to the opposing coach prior to the game to tell him his plan was to play a half of all out basketball to “get the team ready” for some conference competition.
What this tells me is the coach knew the other team was weak, knew what to do to make it less humiliating and chose not to until they’d already spent a lot of game time rubbing their opponents’ faces in it.
There was absolutely nothing good learned by either team that day. And admittedly nothing the coach could have done to make it a competitive game, there was a lot more he could have done to teach his team about respect.
Sometimes in life, you don’t need a rulebook at all—you just need common sense.
Like that lawyer who sued a dry cleaners for 50 million dollars over a pair of pants. It may have been legal according to the rules, but it’s totally unacceptable to a normal human being.
Winning is important in a high school game. But after you’ve guarranteed your win, it’s time to teach ethics.
After pulling ahead by 50 points to zero, the coach should have told his team to “accidently” miss a few blocks, etc, and let the other team score a dozen points. Then they should have used the rest of the game to practice their passing skills among each other, with only an occasional shot at the basket.
And the coach deserves to be fired for not knowing that.
He’s a high school teacher, not a professional athelete.
I played tennis in junior high. I was decent, but I played against many people who had been playing tennis since they started walking, and were amazing. I didn’t really feel any shame losing against someone who was clearly better than me at tennis. I think I would have felt more embarrassed if the other player started “accidentally” missing a few shots and letting me score.
I agree with others that maybe the game should have been called sooner. But I don’t think there’s ever a need for pity points.
The coach was prepping for league play. You don’t prep for league play by letting the other team score a lot. Besides, I’ve played basketball, and I would have been FAR more insulted if the other team stood around and let me get a lay-up than if they stomped us.
To people saying the coach should have put in second stringer, that happened. To people saying the coach should have told players to burn time, that happened. If your team is going to be so butthurt about losing by a large margin, forfeit the game.
I only have a problem with “running up the score” when it’s down dangerously and has the potential for someone to get hurt. When it’s just numbers on a board - deal with it.
… soooo… the Harlem Globetrotters should stop making the other teams look like they’re stuck to the floor?
I’ve seen quite a few games where one team was hopelessly outmatched: they knew it and were looking forward to a chance to play against and exchange t-shirts with the other guys. There’s no shame in losing by a wide margin, but there would be shame in losing when the other guys are purposefully sitting down on the floor so you can score.
I can’t say I’d care be the loser of a 150 - 2 drubbing, but it would be even more insulting if the winning team ‘played mercifully’ to keep from hurting my feelings.
If your team can’t learn anything from a team that destroys you, then you’re a piss-poor coach. Better to prep your team with, “We’re gonna get blown out, but this team is going to show you how to play–watch them and learn.”
Right, tennis isn’t exactly like basketball, but I’ve never played basketball for a team so I couldn’t exactly compare. I don’t have any issue with the second stringers playing. I also don’t have any issue with players maybe playing at 75% effort instead of the 100% effort they’d be putting into a big tournament game. I had an issue with the suggestion that “the coach should have told his team to “accidently” miss a few blocks, etc, and let the other team score a dozen points.” The second string playing is not the same as pity points, but if the players were barely jogging around the court and not even trying to block some of the score attempts, that would be pity points.
Exactly. The “prepping for conference play” argument collapses on the weakness of the opponent. They’d undoubtedly get far more prep just scrimmaging in practice.
I wouldn’t have an issue if the coach in question hadn’t pressed with his starters the entire first half against a woefully over-matched team. As it is though it was an asshole move.
How is playing your second or third string “pity points”? It doesn’t help the first string to tromp another team. It’s less useful than playing their own second string at practice. It does help the second and third string to get experience playing in a real game, the one thing they don’t get to do much.
Why on earth would you put your first string on the court, except for the satisfaction of really kicking ass? It doesn’t help anyone.
I don’t know if a suspension was a reasonable response, but playing your 1st string for even the first half is a dick move.