And is it vanity to want to accomplishing something relatively few are able to accomplish just to prove to yourself that you can?
Actually I would color you something less flattering than lazy.
I reasonably asked TonySinclair to explain, according to him, when it is okay to be concerned about the conduct of a non-retarded adult family member.
He ignored the question. When I asked him again, you jumped in and claimed that the question had been answered multiple times.
Of course that’s not true. And that’s on top of the fact that you misquoted and strawmanned me earlier in the thread.
I have no interest in a discussion where the other person misrepresents my position or other peoples’ positions and refuses to correct himself or apologize. This exchange is concluded.
Goodbye.
That would indeed be a sign of poor judgement. Is such an act something your relative is prone to do? I’m thinking no.
Defining “okay” to mean “reasonable” in this instance, I’d say it’s reasonable to be concerned about a loved one engaging in an activity under at least one of two conditions.
Condition one: the activity is clearly having a negative effect on their work or personal relationships. They’re at risk of losing their job, significant other, or alienating their family by continuing the activity. Someone has wine with dinner - no problem. They get fired or dumped because they’re showing up drunk everywhere - problem.
Condition two: the activity is demonstrably dangerous even when the person is intelligent, mentally stable, and responsible. “Hey, brazil84, I’m off to shoot heroin with 20 people and we’ve only got the one needle, but no worries - I’ll wipe it off with a napkin when it’s my turn to shoot up. You still going to church next Sunday? Cool, I’ll see you then!”
Or, for example, my friends and family have always been concerned to some extent about my owning and riding motorcycles. I’ve been riding since 1978 without an incident, but given that statistically motorcycling is provably more dangerous than driving and none of them ride, their concern strikes me as reasonable. Well, until they start talking, and demonstrate that - like most people - they have only a dim understanding of what makes motorcycling more dangerous than driving.
The issue here, and it’s not just you but a lot of modern society, is the tendency to plot a curve from one point. Everyone nowadays has a dim understanding of some psychological and medical terms and they rush to (mis)diagnose everyone they see based on a single observation or statement. Basically, we’ve got a world based on Kindergarten Cop where saying you’ve got a headache prompts someone to diagnose a brain tumor.
I agree. Probably a lot of fat slobs who finally decide to lose weight are doing so in large part because they want to improve their appearance. The next question is whether there is ever tension between vanity and health.
You do this a lot. 
I was under the impression that QuickSilver meant that your original question had been answered multiple times already.
Leave him alone. He’s still angry with you because you didn’t offer him an apology.
Honestly I don’t know how to answer that other than how I already have and that you have quoted:
Although to be fair you are not asking about excessive or disorder but vanity. Vanity is something done for superficial appearance reasons and which may or may not have health benefits, may even have health harms. “A beneficial amount of exercise” from a health perspective increases fitness, lowers risks of diseases, and reduces the chance of early death. Really pretty straightforward. Accomplishing the goals of vanity does not equal accomplishing any fitness (although often accomplishing fitness goals satisfies any reasonable vanity requirement.)
In terms of marathoning for the little it is worth my fitness goals have changed since then. rp is of course correct that distance running does not equal joint damage (and some studies even show that it protects the joints long term) but in my 50s I am more conscious of the loss of muscle mass that tends to occur over the next decades and am more focused on building muscle mass and strength as well as cardiovascular fitness and balance with a wide variety of exercise. When I do long runs now it is just because it is fun to do that every so often. But that is just me.
In post 128 you dismissed the pursuit of chiseled abs as “pure vanity”. I’m just curious as to why you feel that the time and intense training required to complete a marathon is a worthwhile pursuit but the pursuit of chiseled abs is a purely vain pursuit. Wouldn’t the intense training required to develop those visible muscles provide an overall benefit on par with completing a marathon?
I don’t think so. It is vanity to do it in order to brag about it. To be able to check it off your own bucket list? I would not classify that as vanity even if it is some degree of self-pride.
That “fit mom” **Beowulff **linked to, posting herself looking buff and the line “What’s your excuse?” That strikes me as vanity and obnoxious. Someone posting a picture of himself with his shirt off to brag about his flat belly Putin style? Also strikes me as mock-worthy.
OTOH that “fit mom” saying, as she does in the article, that if I can get and stay fit anyone can, aint bad … better if she focused less on the looks of it than the activity of it though.
Training for a marathon develops excellent cardiovascular endurance. Training abs do not.
The main of effect of trained abs is better posture, a “counterbalance” to the low back muscles and can help avoid or ease back pain. (Along with a strong core, can’t neglect the obliques)
Visible abs can serve as a visual checkpoint on progress(though not really precise), same as a runner logging miles or recording split times.
And a ten or fifteen mile run likely provides the same benefits as the 26.2. It really sounds like the OP’s family member is being discouraged simply because others don’t share his goal. Unless someone can demonstrate why the intense training required to complete a marathon is somehow above the scrutiny given to the ab guy. I really can’t see how ab training is either a riskier or vain-er pursuit than running a marathon.
CLee I am really getting the impression that you don’t read the posts you respond to. Really, they are written in plain English yet you seem to be unable to understand them. I’ll try to make it even clearer. Cardiovascular endurance is a fitness attribute not a looks (vanity) attribute. Chiseled abs is a looks attribute not a fitness attribute. There is no dimension of fitness measured by how chiseled your abs appear. Time and intensity have nothing to do with those things. It is how that time and intensity is spent.
Now if someone achieved chiseled abs by way of accomplishing fitness goals, fine. But extremely low BF% is not a fitness dimension, fitness is not higher at 8% BF compared to say 14% or 18% BF, and the calorie restriction required to get down to that low BF% may interfere with muscle gains. Moreover the focus on abs may distract from more generalized functional strength work.
I’m reading it just fine. I’m asking you why you feel that a 26 mile run has higher benefits than a ten mile run. I can speculate that you set a personal goal or wanted bragging rights (which is why I ran the Cincinnati Marathon). So what if the OP’s ab guy is motivated by vanity? The pursuit of chiseled abs will require training and discipline in all areas to some extent. How can you keep avoiding admitting the benefits to goal setting and exercise? Why would you be alarmed at the ab goal, but not a marathon goal?
For a healthy heart, it appears that around 15 miles/week(more or less) is all that’s needed. The other miles are for relaxation, de-stressing, weight control(my favorite :D), improved performance at races, just doing something we love to do, alone time, idea time, etc.
Having a visible a six-pack should be a side effect of exercise, not the goal.
That is false. DSeid asked me essentially the same question, and I answered him in post 145. That post clearly stated criteria for being concerned, in the context of this thread — anorexia or bulemia. It also strongly implied that jettisoning more important activities, e.g. medical school, would be a cause for concern.
You ignored it, and asked me a very insulting question that implied that I was an idiot. I answered that question, too, although IMO it didn’t deserve a response, so I kept it short and sweet. You asked a third time, and by then I should have ignored you, but I didn’t, I answered you yet again, with a link to my previous response to DSeid. I even included a free diagnosis of your family problems, a $500 value.
You MUST have seen that, because you fucking quoted it, but somehow you are still saying that I keep ignoring your question.
Your family has my deepest sympathies.
Tony to be fair your response to me did not answer the question unless you meant to say that you did not mean what you said (that it was only okay to worry about what an adult family member does if he is retarded), only that you wouldn’t ever worry about a family member’s exercise habits. I also do not see how his question was insulting since it was what you had said and he merely asked if that was what you really meant.
Okay it is, in truth, pretty clear that you did not mean what you said literally, just that you’d trust a developmentally normal adult to decide on their own exercise habits without needing advice, but what was wrong with stating that? Why take such offense at being asked if you meant what you said to be taken at face value?
I think I was very clear, and if you don’t, I see no point in trying to communicate with you. I accept the possibility that I am the one who doesn’t understand English, but I just don’t care enough to pursue this.
I’ll admit to completing the one marathon I ran for no other reason than the tshirt. I’ll admit to watching what I eat for no reason other than vanity. I talk long walks and hike for my mental and emotional health, but much of what I do to stay in physical shape I do for the sole purpose of feeling good about how I look and feel. No shame in that, and the results are exactly the same.
Nonsense. You made a ridiculous statement:
Clearly you were implying that unless an adult family member is retarded, it’s unreasonable to be concerned about him. (And this is different from what you said in Post #145.) When I called you out on your ridiculous statement, you immediately started weaseling. When I pressed you and tried to nail down your position, you continued weaseling and tried to change the subject with personal attacks, which you are still trying to do.
I have no interest in a discussion where the other person pretends he said something different from what he actually said. Or hides his position behind a cloak of ambiguity.
This exchange is concluded. Goodbye.