Is Soros actually actively trying to change U.S. policy? Or what is the basis of the hatred?

Great Debates
81

:rolleyes: That’s a really feeble attempt at evasion on your part. Their website says, as you yourself quoted, that specific categories of guns “should be banned”. In other words, they want to ban everything that they specify as the subject of the predicate “should be banned”, which is exactly how I noted that the word “ban” is commonly used.

You, on the other hand, want to use the generalization “banning guns” to mean not just “banning all guns” but also “banning specific subsets of guns”. That’s what gets your usage flagged as hyperbolic and misleading.

82

When I said that he’s the equivalent, I should have said that he’s perceived by the right similarly to the way the left perceives the Koch brothers.

Whether or not that equivalency is valid or not, isn’t what I’m getting at. To right wingers, he’s this fantastically rich billionaire who’s funding a bunch of foreign programs and supposedly a bunch of liberal causes. He’s also on record as having said some things that can be perceived as anti-American.

So he’s seen as a sort of deep-pocketed villain to the right-wing, much like the Koch brothers are perceived by the left-wing. Of course, the truth on both is probably somewhere nearer the middle.

83

I think the key thing people in this thread seem to be missing is your point about perception. THEY don’t perceive what Soros is doing as being bad or anti-US or whatever, but don’t seem to get that other people don’t interpret or perceive things the same way they do. A lot of this thread has been about trying to prove Soros didn’t really say something anti-American, with both sides talking past each other because, frankly, they are interpreting what is said or done in different ways because their perceptions are different.

Same goes for the gun ‘ban’ semi-hijack. Both sides are talking past each other because they perceive the issue differently and are using ‘ban’ in different ways to mean different things and have different impacts. What I see mainly in this thread are a bunch of liberals who are saying something along the lines of ‘well, I don’t see any problem with Soros…seems fine to me’ and not getting that the very things that they are ok with are what sets off conservatives and the right.

84

…we ain’t missing anything. I’ve conceded people have different perceptions. My point is “what are they basing their perceptions of Soros on?” My contention is that they are not basing their perceptions on the actual words Soros has said or the actual things that he has done. But they are basing their perception on talking points, on propaganda. And we’ve had several examples of that in this thread alone.

85

You’ve got to be kidding me. You can find nonsensical claims about Soros but you can’t find something in the morning news? Liberals keep saying that conservatives are in a bubble that prevents them from hearing any factual information that undermines their preconceived beliefs and conservatives deny this has any truth. Yet here we are.

The conservative New York Daily News.

The semi-conservative CNBC (no business channel or magazine is ever truly liberal).

Other sources outside the country, including The Guardian, made the same statement.

I’m guessing that you would be a perfect replacement for Sarah Huckabee Sanders if she decides to step down.

86

The NYT reported “Trump Prepares to Visit Pittsburgh as Some Urge Him to Stay Away”. The president’s planned visit drew criticism — and prompted disagreement within Pittsburgh’s Jewish community.

Two Jewish groups had called on Mr. Trump to back down from inflammatory rhetoric that they said seemed to be encouraging the most radical fringes of American society. Some members of the congregations that were attacked have said they did not want Mr. Trump to come. Others, including Rabbi Jeffrey Myers of the Tree of Life synagogue, said they would be glad for a visit from Mr. Trump. Reporting both sides of this story is perceived as bias by conservatives: only defenders of Trump have any legitimacy. In the words of Matthew Shapiro of the Daily Wire: Here’s the real headline: Rabbi Jeffrey Myers of the Tree of Life Synagogue told CNN this morning, “The President of the United States is always welcome. I’m a citizen. He’s my president. He is certainly welcome.” That’s not going to get the same kind of media coverage. It’s no wonder why. So the opinion of one guy that happens to agree with you should be headlined. The views of an organization should not be.

I opine that Scylla needs to question his information sources. Senator Majority Leader McConnell (R) and House Speaker Paul Ryan both turned down invitations to appear with Donald Trump at the site of the Pittsburgh synagogue shooting. That doesn’t sound like a situation where Soros’ son jizzed up a fake controversy. In Bipartisan Rejection, Lawmakers Will Not Appear With Trump In Pittsburgh - TPM – Talking Points Memo

NPR: “Trump To Visit Pittsburgh Despite Objections From Mayor, Jewish Leaders” [INDENT]Jewish leaders in Pittsburgh, affiliated with the progressive group Bend the Arc, penned an open letter telling the president to stay away until he made overtures to certain communities, including those of the Jewish faith.

“President Trump, you are not welcome in Pittsburgh until you fully denounce white nationalism,” the letter said.

“Our Jewish community is not the only group you have targeted. You have also deliberately undermined the safety of people of color, Muslims, LGBTQ people, and people with disabilities.”

But others have praised his reaction to the massacre.

Matt Brooks, the executive director of the D.C.-based Republican Jewish Coalition, told CNN that Trump’s condemnation of anti-Semitism was “very powerful and strong.” Trump Visits Pittsburgh Despite Objections From Mayor, Jewish Leaders : NPR [/INDENT] I say that if the D.C.-based Republican Jewish Coalition can put together a list of signatories from Pittsburgh that don’t have a problem with Trump’s rhetoric, they should do so. (Furthermore, they would do so.) Conservative allegations of bias on this story are of the funhouse mirror variety.

87

Pretty much this. On the right, having rich donors is business as usual. The expectation is that the flood of money will drown out the progressive POV. Having money supporting progressive causes from an identifiable wealthy source is unusual and the right is naturally resentful and fearful that this is upsetting the apple cart. Soros has been blamed for everything from “false flag” operations to changes in the weather. :rolleyes:

88

Basically Soros is just the D equivalent of the Koch brothers, who don’t get all this conspiratorial wackiness associated with them. Although, to be fair, once you’ve called someone a major Republican donor anything other insult seems kind of unnecessary.

89

Very often, “Globalist” is code for “Jew”.

The root of a lot of this is anti-Semitism.

90

Let’s try it this way: if someone wrote “that last post from Hypothetical Poster was really poorly written”, would that be an anti-Hypothetical Poster statement?

91

So you agree that the statement that “Republicans are in favor of banning prescription drugs”. Is not misleading.

92

Actually you did a good job of repeating what the left wing says about the Koch’s. They are not right wing, they are classic liberalists in the purest of sense. They have and do support democratic candidates on the federal and local levels, that support free market principles.

During the 2008 campaign season, after W rode off in the sunset, the left wing supporters were left with the lack of a villain to portray in the their stump speeches. This is when the Koch brothers infamy grew as they were put into that position at that time. The Koch’s have been politically active for decades, again supporting candidates the espoused their similar free market principles.

Once the Koch’s became vilified by the left, the right needed to find their own supposed left wing villain to offset the Koch’s…hence the attention on Soros.

Had those events not happened, the majority of Americans would have continued to not know who either of these families are.

93

They claim this. But at the national level, they’re pretty exclusively Republican. And they head up a group of 400 to 550 plutocrats, backing GOP policies on voter suppression, military spending, anonymous campaign spending, and other traditionally conservative themes. Their father started the John Birch society.

“Their political operation employs about 1,200 people in more than 100 offices across the country — which, as Politico noted, makes it far bigger than the Republican National Committee itself.”

They regularly block taxes on fossil fuels, despite economic theory saying we should tax bads like pollution rather than goods like labor or capital. That “Classic Liberal” self description is a sham, sort of like Hayek’s mau-mauing about freedom, then carrying water for Pinochet.

94

It’s because he’s a billionaire and huge liberal donor.

The jewish angle I believe is contained to the fringe right. I don’t hate him for that, but I don’t hate him at all.

Let’s get real, it’s not like the Koch brothers get a lot of love from the left.

95

But they also don’t really get the crazy ass conspiracy theories, either. At least not from the mainstream.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

96

Let’s not forget that the scale and secrecy of the Koch brothers far surpasses anything done by Soros.

It’s projection.

97

As a Jewish person myself, any victim of antisemitism engenders my reflexive sympathies, but we should not forget Soros is no friend to Jews. Bloomberg - Are you a robot?

98

I don’t think most Redneck Trumplings (Trump’s base) pay enough attention to the “fake news” to even be aware of the extent of the Koch brothers influence. Plus weren’t they anti-Trump?

No the reason for the Soros hate going mainstream is the same as all the other hate going mainstream. Trolls and hate groups exploited new more open forms of communication like social media and and alternative news to disseminate their vile delusions. Trumps victory has emboldened and normalized these hateful voices.

99

Soros hate is obviously not proportionate to his actual influence, obviously also fueled by Nazis. Your opinion of Soros is obviously influenced by your Nazi political allies. Even if just in what you are paying attention to.

100

Secretly funding liberal Jewish groups makes ‘one no friend to Jews?’ I generally like people people who give me money, maybe maybe I just don’t understand the intricacies of your religion. Are liberal Jewish people who are not supportive of a conservative Israel just not real Jews?