I hope I have the right forum for this. I’m never sure.
I think my title pretty much asks the question. But, I’ll expand a little.
With the Penn State Scandal heavy on my mind, I’m wondering if there is anything Sandusky could ever do, to allow me to forgive him and I just can’t come to a resolution.
First, I acknowledge that it is probably arrogant of me to think I have the right to judge this man in the first place. I don’t have that right, I think. Or do I? Another question I’m just really torn on. I mean, outside of a court of law, do we as a society have any right to judge any wrong? I think we have to, in order to keep our kids safe, but then does that make us/me guilty of another wrong, that of being judgmental or arrogant.
Maybe it’s a degree of wrongness. Maybe my wrong arrogance is so much less harmful than Sanduskys wrong that my wrong is more ok?
Grrr, Is that clear as mud?
I’m just so torn and I need some food for thought. Because, you see, I like to offer forgiveness. It feels good. Plus I’ve so often needed it myself, but… I’m struggling to find a way for this man to right the wrongs he did. But how awful must it be, to be Sandusky. Is he sick or just evil? Is he tormented? Does it make me evil to not care or have compassion for him. How unfair is it for me to say he’s evil, if he is just wired so very very wrong.
Oy, I hope this is isn’t too long to read or too muddled to understand. I can never seem to get the thoughts out on paper as clearly as I’d like. But I know one of you smart dopers will come along and clarify my thoughts for me, give me something to chew on so that I can feel easier and maybe then I can get some sleep.
Not for me. He could throw himself on a live grenade tomorrow, and that wouldn’t change the fact that he preyed on children for his own sexual pleasure.
He is evil. He had the capacity to not do what he did - to suggest he didn’t is to reduce him to the level of a rabid animal.
I was abused as a kid by my uncle Frank.
Summer of 2002, I had traveled the path to the point I was ready to forgive him, if he would acknowledge his wrongs. I went to see him, and he was the same arrogant fuck he had been in the past.
If he would have expressed regret, contrition, blame, ANYTHING, I might have been able to bless him and let him go. I was ready to hear what he had to say, for the first time after years of therapy, many 12 step meetings, letters to the rest of my family, and looking at the consequences of his abuse in my life.
He lied. He said nothing happened, he never messed with other kids, it was all me.
Lies.
Narcissistic asshole.
I went to his funeral a few years ago, and 2 of his sons-in-laws thanked me for breaking the silence, and they had kept the kids away from him since 1993 when I sent letters out to the family.
Maybe this guy is different. Maybe there are abusers who can acknowledge their actions, and be honest. We’ll see.
But I wouldn’t bet on it
David
He used his power and access to ‘at risk’ kids, to prey on them. For years and years.
With enough time, I might be able to reach some form of forgiveness, for him. Perhaps he was driven by urges he could not control. It’s not like there is any effective treatment he could seek out. Sure, it’s easy to say, ‘Well, I’d put a gun to my head before…’, I’m not so sure it works that way. Perhaps having unsuccessfully sought sexual gratification in ways more acceptable to society, with crushing defeat. Then finding sexual arousal. I’d bet that’d be a pretty powerful train to derail. Maybe I would never find my way to forgiveness, I’m just not sure.
Society may not be able to undo what happened to these children, who have been so betrayed, in so many ways. But, it seems to me, we owe them the tiny piece of mind that comes of knowing this monster is caged. And, of course, public safety would dictate he never again be released.
If it is “judgmental or arrogant” to say that I’m not cool with people who anally rape 10 year old boys, I’m okay with that. I believe it is not possible to live in complete moral relativism where one doesn’t make any judgements at all. Even judging people for being judgmental is a judgment. Who’s to say that being judgmental is wrong?
I can believe that some people do have inborn attraction to children, and that the desires are not something they can control, but that doesn’t mean it’s okay for them to act on those desires. We all have urges that we can’t act on in a civilized society. For example, I bet some people probably have an urge to hunt down and kill child molesters, and yet they don’t act on it.
I don’t give it much credence when people who have a pattern of serious crimes try to act repentant. If they were really sorry they could have stopped after their first victim, yet somehow they didn’t realize it was wrong until they were caught? Yeah right.
When someone like this pretends to be sorry for what they did, I think it’s far more likely that they’re just saying what they know people want to hear or crying crocodile tears.
If his victims decide that it’s important to their healing for them to be able to forgive him, well, then so be it, but I don’t see any reason that society needs to spend any time on compassion or forgiveness for a child abusing predator.
He’s toast; nothing can rehabilitate him, especially if he’s convicted. About the only person to survive this charge was Michael Jackson, and in Jackson’s case, there wasn’t conclusive proof. For Sandusky, the charges are far too damning, and there seem to be several eyewitnesses.
Further, he brought shame on the Penn State program. Those who might have rushed to his side would be Penn State fans, and, even if they believe he’s innocent, he’s going to be hated for bringing down Joe Paterno.
If he set up a system to distribute his wealth to the individuals he raped, then committed suicide, I still would not feel forgiveness, but it would be a start. Fuck Him.
I agree. I could forgive a person for being sexually attracted to young children. But I can’t forgive somebody for having sex with a child. I don’t accept the idea of not being able to control yourself. Sandusky may not have had a choice in his thoughts or feelings but he had a choice in his actions.
Based on what banjoDavid said, it would have to start with a full statement of all of his crimes, including dates and specifics as to his actions and the names of the victims. (Perhaps some of them have not come forward on their own and so having the names of the victims would allow the authorities to offer counseling to them.) And then, of course, this would need to be followed by a guilty plea to the charges.
The criminal justice system will assign what will fall short of being a sufficient punishment for his crimes, simply because there is no sufficient punishment this side of the Eighth Amendment for the series of crimes he’s plainly (I’ll leave ‘allegedly’ to the news media, thanks) committed. Hopefully his sentence, even with maximum parole, will be at least 35 years, so he will have essentially no hope of ever being a free man again.
In the meantime, the least the rest of us can do for his victims is to regard him as the scum of the earth, and to limit our interactions with him to spitting at his feet, should we ever be in the same zip code as him.
I agree that what this guy did is virtually unforgivable, and that he needs to be locked away until he is dead, but if I had to guess, I would say that the odds are pretty damn high that he was a victim of childhood sexual abuse back when he was a kid, and somehow the sickness/mutation/virus was passed along yet another generation.
I wonder if any of his own child victims have gone on to molest kids even younger than themselves?
I assume that Sandusky has been molesting kids throughout his entire adult life, meaning some of his early victims might be in their late 30’s or early 40’s by now.
It’s a cycle that seems fated to repeat itself, over and over again…
The best thing that he can do is sell all of his assets and give every cent of his net worth to a victim’s fund. Then he can plead guilty with no conditions and take the maximum sentence. I still wouldn’t forgive him.
My honest-to-God first thought was “probably kill himself”.
That wouldn’t incur forgiveness, but it would certainly get a majority of people (those in this thread included) to have the “finally got what he deserved” thought in their heads.
This is always an unpopular opinion in these kinds of cases, but if our reaction to stomach-turning offenses is always “forget our traditions of justice and hang him by his balls, because I’m very angry”, then why do we even have courts or juries? Just poll random passers-by for a week and punish him on that basis. If more than half are negative at the end of the week, put a bullet in his head, if less, beat him unconscious and cut off this thumbs.
That being said, if he does 25 years in prison, makes restitution, and agrees to chemical castration, I personally would forgive him in the sense that I wouldn’t begrudge him the ability to pursue some sort of life after paying his debt to society (a life that doesn’t permit being around children).
Sandusky should plead guilty to all charges (no courtroooms), then serve his life sentence and have Penn State pay BIG financial settlements to the victims.
My level of tolerance and compassion dictates only that he’s free to live his life once he’s made amends and served his time. I do not stipulate that the time should be easy or leave plenty of life to live at the end. He didn’t give his victims any compassion on account of their age; he should be treated the same.