Ex-son-in-law moved out a year ago (to a different state) and refuses to change his address for auto registration and insurance. Says it is too expensive where he now lives.
Wife is worried that this is fraudulent on his part and that we are contributing by forwarding mail and not informing our shared insurance agent.
What do you think?
IANAL, but I’d say yes, it is fraud, but you are not required to rat him out to the insurance agent. I’d stop forwarding the mail, though.
It’s not fraud, exactly, but it does void the policy. He’s essentially uncovered right now. If he gets in an accident, he’s screwed. You, on the other hand, have no duty to do anything about this. You’re fine.
He’s not covered only if his insurer finds out about his deceipt. If they don’t find out, and they pay his claim based on disinformation about where the vehicle was being kept, then he has committed insurance fraud.
Insurance is higher in his new area because the insurance company believes the risk in that area is higher. He’s lying to them in order to pay smaller premiums that are not commensurate with the totality of risk to which his car is exposed.
If he’s not registering his car to his new address, then he’s also committing tax fraud, since his registration payments are not going to his new state.
IANAL, so I couldn’t say what your legal liability would be if your role (forwarding his mail) were discovered. I would think that if he’s paying you to forward his mail, then you could be seen as benefiting from the fraud. Even if you’re not being paid, you’re enabling fraud on his part. IMHO, that’s not cool; you need not rat him out, but if you want a clean conscience, you should probably knock it off.
Isn’t there a way to give the post office the new forwarding address? Or does he have to sign that? Because the post office, I think, informs the sender of the new address. Problem solved.
Ex in-law? What do you owe him? “Return to sender” his mail and let him deal with the fallout.
Yep, that is the simple solution - but then he will just take it out on darling daughter…
He has already made a claim on policy for storm damage on car during a hurricane last fall. State Farm paid claim.
The only way this isn’t fraud is if he honestly doesn’t know he has to update his address with them. So yes, it is fraud. It’s classic material misrepresentation with intent to gain. You are enabling him to defraud his insurance company, which leads to higher premiums for EVERYBODY. Not cool.
I think you should tell your son the buck stops here, and he needs to get insurance in the state he drives. It’s one thing to refrain from updating your address when moving to a nearby city in the same state (that’s still fraud, but of a lesser degree). But when moving between states, there’s **no **excuse. Living in another state means you’re under another state insurance commission, and an entirely new set of insurance rules applies to you. What if he moved from a no-fault state to a fault-based state?? The difference between these types of insurance is night and day.
Is this fraud going to get him prosecuted? I sincerely doubt it. But he’s paying his premiums for nothing, because when he has an accident they are NOT going to pay out a single dime. It’s just as bad as being uninsured, because although they’ll refund his premiums once they figure this out, he’s going to retroactively have a huge gap in his insurance record. And then his premiums will go even higher than they would be if he just got a policy in the right state in the first place.
I work at an insurance company.
[Insurance Adjuster Hat On]
He has an accident. I find out his policy reflects not only the wrong address, but the wrong state and decide more investigation is in order. It’s a stretch whether I’d deny coverage as opposed to just letting underwriting know the exposure has changed. My company tends to be pretty forgiving when we’ve received a lie-by-omission. But let’s say we’ve asked him, somehow, “what’s your address?” and he’s told us" jasg’s house in Upper Left Hand Corner" when in fact he had established residence in San Diego, CA I could deny the claim on the grounds he misrepresented his situation to the company. I probably still wouldn’t, however, because the misrepresentation is not a material one. Would we still have written the policy for him in San Diego? If so, then he’s still got insurance for this accident. I’m not going to deny an otherwise valid claim when I only have a technicality to stand on. But not every company works that way. Also, if he’s using your address for registration, you could get sucked into any lawsuits filed against him arising from a car accident (it would be to explore the extent to which you enabled him to get behind the wheel and cause the accident). You’d probably be able to get dismissed relatively easily, but it’d still be a pain in the ass and you’d need to get a lawyer to do it.
I can’t speak to the legality of misrepresenting one’s address to a government body for purposes of vehicle registration. I’d guess it’s a criminal act, and that by participating you are a party to any such crime. If you’re cool with that, hey, who am I to say boo?
[Insurance Adjuster Hat Off]
So…you’re letting him hold you hostage because you’re afraid he’ll behave badly? I guess that’s your choice, but since you’re going to be dancing with the devil either way you may as well force the Ex to get a life and be divorced. I’m no stranger to unreasonable Exes (mine is ok, by my current wife’s ex is a jerk), so I kinda feel for you not wanting to make things worse. But sometimes you have to let your daughter’s problems be her problems.
I think it might depend upon his profession.
If I am not mistaken, some people who are in construction or have jobs that are seasonal might actually be exempt from changing plates and insurance in another state, if they can show they still claim the other state as “home” and pay taxes there.
I know of one guy who worked here in Las Vegas for over a year and still had plates and insurance from a different (cheaper) state, and it was totally legal.
Again, not sure how every state does this, and I believe it does depend upon profession.
IMO, providing a false address to obtain cheaper coverage is Insurance fraud.
Best to cover yourself, at minimum, send mail back to the sender as not living there or such. Tell your SIL-ex your intentions.
Thanks for all the advice everyone, I concur with it and will have the talk with wife, daughter and perhaps ex-sil if they won’t.
(DMark, his profession for the last 18 months has been milking unemployment, before that IT Helpdesk)
Sent a polite request to ex-SIL to change address by May 1.
No direct response, but he has informed daughter that I am an “effing dbag”. I am so proud.
nm.
** Inigo Montoya** covered what I wanted to say.