I was talking to someone on a conference call and they said “oh, that’ll pay back in spades” or some such variant – but I am confident you know the expression in general. They then immediately excused themselves – “pardon the language” – and I stopped things and asked “pardon what?” and he stated that he thought that “spades” in that expression referred to Blacks and was therefore unintentionally racist at its heart.
I hadn’t ever considered that – I have always assumed that it referred to playing cards. Is anyone familiar with any “truths” about this old saying? Is it generally understood in the Black community to be racist in origin – or not?
Just curious…every now and then I think about the phrase “I shot my wad” and how fundamentally crude and sexual it is. Same with “who’s your Daddy” having its roots in prison sexual dominance, yet somehow crossing over to the mainstream. Is that is what happened with the “spades” cliché, or is it really more harmless than that?
When I hear spades in the context that your co-worker used it, I don’t ever associate it with black people. I think of cards and garden utensils, but not blacks.
It definitely is based on cards – the OED says it’s from bridge, where spades is the highest ranking suit.
That doesn’t preclude people from thinking it has something to do with the racial term, which also is derived from cards (e.g., “Black as the ace of spaces”). But from a purely etymoligical standpoint, the phrase has no direct racist origin: it’s just parallel to the racist term, though both have the same root.
Since it’s a metaphor from bridge, it means that spades are more valuable than anything else. So, if spades = black people, that would imply that black people are more valuable than other people. If it’s racism, it’s racism directed against non-black people. :smack:
I used to hear my mom say “black as the ace of spades,” but she’d use it in a non-racial context, such as to describe a dark night, or the color of a vehicle, cat, or hair color. Basically, anything that was literally black.
So your coworker was actually being racist by misunderstanding a saying that isn’t racist at all? Wow. Like there aren’t enough real ones out there to choose from.
If you will excuse me, I have to go celebrate St. Paddy’s day in the cafeteria. I hear there are some black Irish there and I want to greet them with a yo bro.
It’s not racist, nor is “call a spade a spade” (which is based on the digging tool ((mistranslated from a trench)) and which I have heard black people use).
As a generalization, black people are more prone to perceive racism when it’s not really there, and white people are more prone not to perceive racism when it really is there. Though there’s plenty of room for growth and improvement in American race relations, there has been progress and increasing awareness over the years, which I think is reflected in the misguided but presumably sincere apology related in the OP. His heart was in the right place, but his understanding of the facts was incorrect.
Shagnasty - I wasn’t judging my co-worker at all; I was merely surprised that they felt the need to qualify their use of the phrase. I have no idea if that person is racist at all - it simply wasn’t part of my thought processes as I pondered the phrase after we spoke…
I should say it’s used to mean an increased return in value (not necessarily number, so exponentially was probably not the best word). so it could also be used to mean payback in a increased negative value
Google isn’t helping as much as I would like, but I always understood “shot his wad” to mean that he has given all there is, and it’s over now. He doesn’t have a chance now. I’ll look around some more.
to spend or use everything that you have. He’s going to shoot his wad on his night out - whatever it costs for a good time.
to say everything that you want to say about a particular subject. Our opponents shot their wad at the meeting and left everyone in no doubt that they would oppose our plans.