Your historian is saying, “Maybe kinda sorta”. Perhaps he intends to convey that is a strong possibility rather than a definite fact.
Because they used every damn thing they had. They were losing and could expect no mercy at least from the Russians due to they way they had committed atrocities in Russia.
Heisenberg was essentially moving his lab in a truck as the Allies advanced.
What he was relating was what is generally believed by experts.
Obviously, we can’t say definitively that was what happened which is true of lots of things.
Similarly, I suppose people could jump up and down screaming regarding my statement that James Baker said “fuck the Jews! They didn’t vote for us!” because he’s never admitted to saying it, but it’s certainly widely believed among Washington insiders and few doubt it’s veracity.
It’s actually considerably more likely than the whole “you’re part of the reality-based community.”
You probably don’t realize it, but you’re effectively quoting Reza Aslan explaining why Iran sponsored terrorist attacks against Israel.
As he put it, “they use terrorists because that’s all they have.”
The point is the Israelis are terrified they’d use nukes because from their POV, the Iranians have used everything at their disposal to attack Jewish civilians.
I think the Israelis are wrong, but it would be absurd not to understand where the Israelis are coming from.
Somehow, I figured that you would jump on that with both feet. 
While I disagree with Aslan on some things, I do like him and think he’s a terrific writer.
shoot, boys, as major kong said (more or less),“you wouldn’t be human if you didn’t have some pretty major reservations about nuclear combat.” at least this thread is just a fight with dull knives…
{quote=Cut Nose Curry} Rules? In a knife fight? {/quote}
He doesn’t think anyone less than an expert should engage in debate.
Well if you were an expert, he wouldn’t need to back up his statements because you would already agree with him.
I don’t think Israel faces overwhelming odds in a war with the combined forces of all its neighbors but I would point out that Israel’s forces outnumbered arab forces (or was pretty close) in every war they fought and in the more decisive wars they employed first strike. With that said, Israel’s forces (at least in the beginning) seemed to be made up largely of militia and irregular forces while the arab forces were presumably soldiers.
Don’t worry about it, Ibn has a thing about wikipedia, I half suspect he is a school teacher (I have met some school teachers who think wikipedia is the devil).
That doesn’t sound particularly genocidal and anti-semetic (some of the other stuff they say does but this stuff, not so much).
???You say shame on you a lot where it isn’t particularly appropriate.
Not saying it would be a good thing but its not genocide either.
Perhaps this is another example where the internet is disseminating false information but aren’t Netanyahu’s links to Irgun more substantial than Ahmedenijad (or the Ayatollah’s) connection to Hitler?
I think that if the Palestinians were to gain military dominance over all of Israel (now called Palestine), then yes Hamas would be likely to cease terrorist activity in Palestine and proceed to elect former Hamas members into high office (all the while denouncing the terrorist arm of Hamas).
Perhaps they would treat Jews like crap and we would see a century of UN resolutions condemning Palestine before the Jews got the upper hand again.
But nothing tells me that Hamas would abandon terrorism under a two state solution. Do you think they would be satisfied with only half a cake (or pie)?
Shame on you, too.
It beats swearing at someone and incurring the Wrath of the Mods.
Good grief, Damuri.
You’re still smarting over the last time I embarrassed you and still making passive aggressive attacks?
Do I remind you of an ex-girlfriend or something?
Personally, I’d almost forgotten about you, but you’re still clearly not over me.
Sorry, but I’m just not that into you.
You’re far too boring and predictable. I need someone who’s are more exciting to keep my interest.
The Irgun disappeared before Netanyahu was even born.
I also don’t think anyone has claimed that Ahmadinejad or the Ayatollah was linked with Hitler.
They’re both certainly quite anti-Semitic(or were in the case of Khomeini) have backed a number of anti-Semitic laws(or anti-semetic as you’d say) in Iran and probably would have ethnically cleansed the Jews from Israel if they could have which bears some resemblance to Hitler.
Are you sure you weren’t confused?
Were you thinking of the early Arab nationalists like Nasser and Sadat who backed Hitler during WWII?
Were you thinking of the founder of Palestinian nationalism, El Hajj Amin Al-Husseini, who met with Hitler many times, organized Muslim SS divisions and enthusiastically supported the Holocaust and later on helped the rise of his nephew Yasser Arafat?
Or perhaps you were thinking of Yasser Arafat who had a chief bodyguard known as “Abu Hitler”?
I suppose you could have meant “Abu Hitler” instead of “Adolph Hitler” when you asked about connections to Hitler, but that doesn’t seem likely.
Ibn Warraq, you’re out of line here and I’m giving you a formal warning. As a general note to you and Snowboarder Bo and Damuri Ajashi, this is not the right forum for your issues individually. Leave the personal stuff in the Pit and stick to the facts while you’re posting in Great Debates.
I was teasing him in response to some passive-aggressive comments he made about me which were pretty clearly designed to get a reaction.
He also has a pattern of deliberately attacking me through making such posts responding to others and, I believe has been warned about this by mods before.
If you feel that I deserve to be warned for some minor teasing to his repeated provocations then it seems only fair to either give him a warning or to rescind mine.
I didn’t think those last few posts deserved a warning, and yours did. I specifically mentioned the three of you in that mod note.
These other instances of contested land do not always involve million of refugees living as refugees for decades. These other instances of contested land has not resulted in the export of terrorism all over the world.
And in other cases we have in fact seen significantly more global disapporval (see south africa, or were the afrikaners also Jewish?). Criticism of something with a Jewish nexus is not necessarily anti-semitism, sometimes it just criticism of something that needs criticizing.
Yes, superior Jewish genetics and society makes Jewish success inevitable.
We let the American Indians vote.
Rather than assume racism perhaps an objective look at the facts would make this seem like less of a mystery.
To be fair if you can consider the Jews in Israel “not much” you should probably consider the palestinians in the West bank “not much” too so thye current state of affairs does not create much objection either.
Why do you keep doing this instead of arguing the substance of the arguments? You frequently pick up on some lack of knowledge in the person youa re arguing with and use taht as a pretext to dismiss them and their opinions entirely. Do you really need to know the intricacies of the tax code to have an opinion on taxes? If so then every debate on taxes would be more or less a dialogue between me and Rand Rover. Imagine if every third post from me ina tax thread was "I’m a tax lawyer, what makes you think you are qualified to have such a stron opinion on taxes if you don’t even understand how how taxation works? I suggest you read Ginsberg’s treatise on mergers and acquisitions, Garlock’s treatise on debt, Kramer on financial products and articles by Kleinbard and Peaslee before you embarass yourself further in this debate.
Were the Cypriate muslims colonialist or imperialist invaders? Perhaps he doesn’t have a lot of sympathy for them for that reason.
See, this is part of the problem I have with Zionism. Its GOTTA be where it is right now because of what? Some divine mandate? If the point is to have a Jewish nation in case history produces another Hitler, why does it have to be exactly where it is? Whats wrong with a country that just happens to have a lot of Jews in it? We don’t have to call it Israel, we can call it Florida.
Well to be fair, if they thought they could take and hold more, then Israel might be a bit larger right now.
While I realize that Sunni muslim is a lot closer to Shia muslim than Judaism, it seems to me that sometimes Sunnis and Shia do not get along. I don’t think Iran gives a shit about Israel except to the extent they can curry regional political influence by bashing on Israel.
When i criticize zionism, I am usually criticizing the all the shit that Israel does to maintain a Jewish majority in Israel.
You are merely saying I prefer the status quo. If the situation were reversed, and the neighboring states were all happy without an Israeli state and the Zionists would only be happy with an Israeli state in Palestine and we couldn’t make both sides happy, would you say "oh well we might as well make the neighboring states happy and leave Palestine alone or would you carve an Israeli state out of Palestine?
They have offered to recognize israel. You must know about the arab peace plan, I’ve mentioned it several times int he past. The fact that you don’t like it doesn’t mean the offer was never made.
No kidding. It gets unnecessarily insulting but the mods seem to think its ok.
Damuri has a rather weird, somewhat disturbing fixation on me which has caused him to have a rather extensive history of repeatedly making passive-aggressive attacks on me, which is what I was responding to.
He’s actually been warned specifically about “calling out other posters” due his history.
I was under the impression that someone who had a history of engaging in such behavior and being warned to stop by the mods would be asked to would receive a warning.
I was also under the impression that some latitude was given to people who were responding to personal attacks.
Anyway, my comments to him were clearly tongue-in-cheek and self-deprecating.
What was so offensive about them that they warranted a warning while repeatedly trolling another poster doesn’t?
Thanks
I’m not insulting him. I’m pointing out that he he is using weasel words. Weasel word - Wikipedia (I know how much you hate wikipedia but its no reason to keep yoursself deliberately ignorant.)
I don’t need to do that to identify weasel words.
Angry? I took issue with your argument that anyone whose knowledge of the middle east was based on stuff they read on the internet (including wikipedia) didn’t know enough to participate or voice an opinion on the middle east unless they read your list of books on the middle east.
Why would I need to?
Once again you don’t seem to udnerstand what I was saying. There is no moral indictment.
“FWIW, I don’t think that the government of Iran would either give nukes to terrorists to commit genocide against Israel or launch a nuclear attack against them.”
http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=14448493&postcount=48
I’m not really sure which hair you are trying to split with that statement but if it would make things clearer, I will rephrase to say "Even you don’t think
Even you seem to admit that the shah’s alleged alliance with Hitler was not anti-semetic and i don’t remmeber anti-semitism being brought up during the iranian revolution. Is anti-semitism in iran to some degree displaced anti-Americanism or is there really a historical anti-semitism throughout Iranian history?
Seriously?
Sorry I’ve been away, I’ve been busy at work. Did you miss me?
You’re right, I’m sorry, sloppy reading on my part. He was hanging out with some former Irgun members commemorating the King David Hotel bombing but he is not identified as an Irgun member.
Then whats with the 5 or 6 pages about hitler and iran in this thread? I thought the clear implication at least initially was that part of the reason Israelis were justifiably worried about Iran was because of their lnks with genocidal hitler? Are you saying that those are irrational fears and that any link between Hitler and iran has no place in a rational Israeli’s reaction to a nuclearized Iran (which I don’t think would be a good thing)
Sorry about the spelling
Yet we know that if their Muslim neighbors could wipe them out they would. So, what is stopping the Israelis from pushing the Palestinians into the sea?
I once had a Muslim friend of mine say that Spain used to be theirs and should be again. Once once belonged to Islam, always belongs to Islam. Little different than the religious reasons that people claim the Jews use for their being in the ME, imho.
There is an Israeli state there now and its neighbors will never be happy with it being there no matter what concessions happen. Even if the future Palestinian state was able to survive on its own, that won’t stop the rockets and bombs from going off in Israel. As you even said earlier, Israel’s existence is used by the other totalitarian governments in the region as a diversion and Iran will still support the terrorists.
And there have been other plans before and after. Why weren’t they accepted? Why didn’t the plan say that whatever each side has now is what they get and all those oil rich Arab states will subsidize the new Palestine ensuring it survives? Issues around water are bullshit as places like the UAE have huge water desalination plants. Someone just has to pay for them.
'Cause they are the Good Guys.
The international embarrassment of doing so, especially since even America would likely feel obligated to end aid to or even embargo Israel if they did that.