J. EDGAR thread

I saw this movie today. I’d describe it as ‘Good’ or ‘B+’. It wasn’t bad, wasn’t great, not something you’ll want to see again or put on your short list of favorites probably, but worth watching, though I doubt it will lose anything on DVD.

It would have worked better as an HBO miniseries. Some of the best moments were the anarchist movement of the 1910s and 1920s that are largely forgotten now but helped to put Hoover in power, and the Kennedy through Nixon years are dealt with in something of a fast pace, but almost nothing from the mid 1930s until the early 1960s was covered and there was a LOT in that time frame that would have been interesting to see. (A prime example is the McCarthy Era: J.E.H. was a lifetime hater of Communists and anything he perceived as a leftist, and yet one of the few people he hated more than Communists was Joe McCarthy who he saw as a bumbling opportunist.)

It does not whitewash him at all and in fact the frame narrative has a lot to do with his attempts to whitewash and aggrandize himself. His relationship with Clyde Tolson is a major part of the plot but it’s not Brokeback FBI by any means; in fact I think it’s at most a minor spoiler but I’ll spoiler box it anyway that

their relationship is definitely a homosexual romance but it’s implied to be completely platonic for its 40 year duration due largely to Hoover’s baggage with the label of being gay

From what I know, and I’m far from an expert on Hoover or the FBI, it seems well researched. Judi Dench is a bit miscast as Hoover’s mother (she’s a great actress but seems too Judi Dench [and too old in her early scenes]), Armie Hammer is better as Clyde Tolson than DiCaprio is as Hoover imo (Leo’s performance was capable but not Oscar worthy).

Anybody else see it?
And if anybody wants to discuss it I’ll add
OPEN SPOILERS AFTER THE O.P.

I plan to see this, but given your “B+” grade, I may wait for it to come out on DVD. I’ve only seen one review for it and the author totally panned it because he/she claimed Hoover was one-dimensionally, totally evil and the movie didn’t try hard enough to portray him as such. Methinks the reviewer had an axe to grind.

My father (age 90) worked for Hoover (albeit not directly) in the late 60’s and early 70’s. I would be curious on what he would say about this movie. But he is not a movie goer, and even if he was, he probably would not see this movie.

Dad has nothing but respect for “Mr. Hoover”, and the only negative thing I have heard him say about Hoover was that he was very demanding and ruthless.

But you don’;t

Sampiro: You might find this piece from the Sunday NYT “Weekly Review” section of interest.

I haven’t seen it yet though I definitely plan to. You say Leo’s perfomance was okay but not great. Do you think that has anything to do with the makeup / his physical appearance? I think he’s a great actor but still has somewhat of a baby face that can be distracting in some roles. I was even going to start a thread " what actors still look contemporary no matter what makeup or costume they wear?" as the flip side to the “what actors looks seem to be from a different era” thread.

Regarding your spoiler, that’s pretty much what David Halberstam believed as his own personal opinion.

I thought his make-up was actually really good. I did have a problem with his voice however; he sounded the same in his 70s as he did in his 20s, and most people’s voices change when they age. (They don’t start off with a deep voice and end up soprano or anything obviously, but it tends to lower or raise a couple of octaves and other changes.)

I saw this today and came to the boards eager to discuss. I’m surprised there aren’t more posts in this thread.

I will watch it again primarily for the set decoration, and a little bit for the costumes.

I thought the score was beautiful. The progression through the presidencies was a nice frame for the movie.

I agree with the notion that the story could’ve used more time to be told fully. It did leave me wishing I knew more about Helen Grandy.

She was real, but I’ve no idea if she and Hoover ever dated as they did in the movie. I’m betting there’s another set of those files she destroyed out there somewhere.

After the film, two ladies were in the lounge arguing about whether the aging makeup was well done or wasn’t. Any thoughts?

With Leo DiCaprio as Hoover and Armie Hammer as Tolson, I’m betting this will be the very first time Hoover/Tolson slash (written by teen-to-twenties women) will take off as a genre…

I thought it was fine on Leo, not so much on the others. I’ve seen better make-up jobs in regional theatre than they used on Helen Grandy; they basically just grayed her hair a bit and added some obviously fake wrinkles.

A very important part of playing an old character is movement and voice and I didn’t think the actors did a good job of that.

I really liked the movie. I thought Leo’s makeup was first rate but the other characters were good to terrible. Hammer as an old man was pretty bad and frequently knocked me out of the story. I found Dench to be great especially the “Daffy” scene. It really goes into showing you why he was closeted, to perhaps even himself all his life. Of course the scene after she dies was really touching as well.

But Naomi Watts is really incredible in the film. You really don’t see Naomi Watts at all. She also ages in the film and does a fine job acting.