Jam bands: love them or hate them?

Cafe Society
21

[QUOTE=Zsofia]
Can somebody cure my ignorance and explain just exactly what a jam band is? I’ve heard the term before but have never been really clear on it.
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“Jamming” is the term musicians use for an informal get together in which musical ideas are shared and musical output is heavily improvised. A typical jam most musicians would be familiar with is a blues jam. Get a bunch of musicians together, yell out “OK, 12-bar blues in A” and everybody will just start playing. If you want to be more precise, you might specify the “turnaround” or other alterations to the progression, but musicians will pick up which version of the blues progression you want to play after the first go-round.

Now, in a rock context, a lot of times musicians will just get together and say, “hey, I got this cool riff/chord progression, let’s jam around it and see what happens” and will hope to develop new musical ideas by playing off other musicians and the such. A jam band is a band that takes this sort of improvisatory approach to playing (and usually composing) music. Extended improvisations are required in a jam band. A jam band is known for long form songs and will take a song that might be 3 minutes in the pop idiom and extend it out to 10, 15, 20 or so minutes. Jam band songs are not always this long, but the emphasis is on instrumental improvisation, not on tight songwriting.

As for jam bands, I don’t like them in general, but I do like some early Phish, Blues Traveler (which I consider a borderline jam band at most) and, of course, the Allman Brothers.

22

[QUOTE=Moe]

This is one of the important basic ideas behind it, from a musical perspective: static harmony, grooving rhythm, open-ended structure. You don’t need to know much about music theory, or deal with complex rhythms and sudden key changes. (these are all, of course, huge generalizations). With a little knowledge and some technical skill you can very passively just go with it and experience the energy transfer between players.

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I’m already in a band that does everything you’ve just described - but we’d fall into the category of post-rock. The music we play has much more in common with Explosions in the Sky, Tortoise, or The Sea and Cake than any conventionally-understood jam band. We do have long, improvisational songs, but rather than indulging in long show-off solos, the idea is that everyone in the band is working together towards one sound. And rather than being tweedly and bouncy, the sound we’re going for is sustained, dramatic, and layered, and “heavy” as opposed to “light.”

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Oh, and I want everyone here with iTunes to do a little experiment/poll for me. Go to the iTunes Store, look up the band Pele, click on the album The Nudes, and listen to some of the samples on that album: The Mind of Minolta, Therapists, Nude Beach Pin Hole Camera, and Visit Pumpy, for example.

Then tell me: 1. what you’d consider that music to be, 2. whether you enjoy it or not, and 3. do you like or dislike jam bands?

I’m curious to hear your responses.

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[QUOTE=Argent Towers]
I’m already in a band that does everything you’ve just described - but we’d fall into the category of post-rock. The music we play has much more in common with Explosions in the Sky, Tortoise, or The Sea and Cake than any conventionally-understood jam band. We do have long, improvisational songs, but rather than indulging in long show-off solos, the idea is that everyone in the band is working together towards one sound. And rather than being tweedly and bouncy, the sound we’re going for is sustained, dramatic, and layered, and “heavy” as opposed to “light.”
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You’re right–there’s a little more to it than just extended improvisations. Usually, “jam bands” have their roots in blues, country, folk, with the occassional sprinkling of jazz.

As for the Pele stuff, I would call it instrumental post-rock, with traditional jam band influences on some songs, jazz on others, even world music. As for enjoying it, it’s certainly inoffensive, and I wouldn’t object to seeing the band live. I don’t love it, I don’t hate it.

25

[QUOTE=Ogre]
Hate. Despise. Am dreading the day 15-20 years down the road when the jam band craze will have spawned a nostalgia crowd. Grrrrr.
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Hey, I thought the jam bands of the 90s were just a 15-20 year down the road Greatful Dead nostalgia phenomenon to begin with.

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[QUOTE=Eonwe]
Hey, I thought the jam bands of the 90s were just a 15-20 year down the road Greatful Dead nostalgia phenomenon to begin with.
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You’re right, but they spawned enough of a frat boy culture thing on their own. God help us.

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[QUOTE=Eonwe]
Hey, I thought the jam bands of the 90s were just a 15-20 year down the road Greatful Dead nostalgia phenomenon to begin with.
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And there’s a good chunk of truth to that - I’m not a Deadhead, but they did write some good songs - but you will probably like the Phish nostalgia even less. :wink:

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A jam is only good when it has a point. Yes, I know that didn’t make much sense. Let me 'splain. A band that goes onandonandonandon riffing on a couple of the same notes or measures gets boring real fast. Throw in some changes or know when to quit. For those who do like jam bands, check out the John Butler Trio, if you haven’t already.

29

Ah, the Dreadful Grate.

Um, no.

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Back in my fraternity days, we were drinking and playing pool in a bar one night and my friend only had one quarter for the jukebox. So I told him to throw on an Allman Brothers tune. Basically it just played innocuously in the background for like 20 minutes, making it the perfect selection.

That’s what Jam Band music is good for. Light ambient music to not pay too much attention to it while you smoke weed or drink or just hanging out.
I suspect since Argent Towers started a thread about Indie rock, that if you like one, you tend not to like the other. Jam Band music seems more fun and frivolous while Indie Rock seems darker and more cerebral. Jam Bands seem to attract frat-guy types while Indie Rock seem to attract guys who DJ the college radio station or edit the school newspaper.

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[QUOTE=Argent Towers]
I’m already in a band that does everything you’ve just described - but we’d fall into the category of post-rock. The music we play has much more in common with Explosions in the Sky, Tortoise, or The Sea and Cake than any conventionally-understood jam band. We do have long, improvisational songs, but rather than indulging in long show-off solos, the idea is that everyone in the band is working together towards one sound. And rather than being tweedly and bouncy, the sound we’re going for is sustained, dramatic, and layered, and “heavy” as opposed to “light.”
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I’ll check out the Pele samples tonight when I get home (don’t have iTunes at work).

I agree with pulykamell’s distinction though I hear more 60s-70s classic rock, bluegrass, blues, folk, than country in jam-rock’s roots.

Personally, I dig many bands who would fall under the “post-rock” label a lot more than jam-rock these days. (Love Tortoise, Stereolab, Rachels).

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[QUOTE=msmith537]
That’s what Jam Band music is good for. Light ambient music to not pay too much attention to it while you smoke weed or drink or just hanging out.
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There’s some value in good background music, but if you’re talking about Mountain Jam, I think you’re maligning one of the high points of rock music.

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[QUOTE=Moe]
I’ll check out the Pele samples tonight when I get home (don’t have iTunes at work).

I agree with pulykamell’s distinction though I hear more 60s-70s classic rock, bluegrass, blues, folk, than country in jam-rock’s roots.

Personally, I dig many bands who would fall under the “post-rock” label a lot more than jam-rock these days. (Love Tortoise, Stereolab, Rachels).
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You might like The Sea and Cake also.

I’m currently in a band called Post-Turk that combines post-rock with Turkish influences. Our eight-minute single The Shiek is online and will play in a Quicktime player at that link. You should give it a listen even if you don’t want to hear the full 8 minutes (but I would advise listening at least up until the halfway point so you don’t miss the dramatic climax.) I think you will really like this song. I am playing the bass part on a guitar (the first line you hear besides the piano at the beginning.)

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[QUOTE=Moe]

I agree with pulykamell’s distinction though I hear more 60s-70s classic rock, bluegrass, blues, folk, than country in jam-rock’s roots.
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Really, do you not hear a lot of country in jam rock? I could be a little more sensitive to the influences, since piano is my first instrument and the piano riffs in bands like the Allman Brothers, Grateful Dead, and even Phish are straight out of country. Allmusic.com lists “Country-Rock” as one of the genre description for the Dead, and the Allman Brothers are pretty unabashedly coming from country roots.

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I like The Jam (which, of course, is almost as far away from the jam band aesthetic as one could get).

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In the immortal words of Eric Cartman; “Goddamn hippies say they want to save the world but all they do it smoke pot.”

Jam bands make me want to commit a hate crime.

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[QUOTE=Snooooopy]
I like The Jam (which, of course, is almost as far away from the jam band aesthetic as one could get).
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I’ve got a pocket full of pretty green
I’d like to smoke it but I lost my screen …

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[QUOTE=pulykamell]
Really, do you not hear a lot of country in jam rock? I could be a little more sensitive to the influences, since piano is my first instrument and the piano riffs in bands like the Allman Brothers, Grateful Dead, and even Phish are straight out of country. Allmusic.com lists “Country-Rock” as one of the genre description for the Dead, and the Allman Brothers are pretty unabashedly coming from country roots.
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Well, I must admit, if there’s one genre I know little about it’s country, so I’m willing to chalk it up to my own insensitivities to it. For some reason, the label “southern rock” seems to come to mind more than “country” when I think of the 60s-70s jam bands like the Allman’s and the Dead. Phish always seemed to me to use the most superficial elements of a variety of genres in an almost tongue-in-cheek sort of way.

Argent, I probably would’ve really dug Pele about 10 years ago (not that I disliked what I heard now, just my ear is in a different place). As for categorizing it, post rock with jam rock influences sounds good to me.

The thing about this discussion to me is that, I associate a neo-60s hippy cultural mindset with “jam-rock”. The cultural distinction is important. So if Pele commonly played at jam-rock festivals, I see no reason why they (based on the samples I heard) couldn’t fit under that umbrella.

However, I must admit I’ve really been out of the jam-rock world for some time now. I kinda got the feeling, listening to those samples, that this is what jam-rock would’ve evolved into by now (more subtlety in the texture, more cohesive). It sounded contemporary, like it had all but completely shed the R & B and classic rock influence. (and perhaps this is part of where the idea of “post-rock” comes from. I dunno).

Anyway, I listened to your tune (in full :slight_smile: ). Not bad. I’d work on tightening up the tempo and playing a little more with the timbre of the instruments. (turn a few knobs, try some effects. In general, try to create a more organic soundworld).

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[QUOTE=Moe]
For some reason, the label “southern rock” seems to come to mind more than “country” when I think of the 60s-70s jam bands like the Allman’s and the Dead.
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I’m sure you don’t want a long exegesis on the topic, so I’ll try to keep it quick - that label does pretty much fit the Allmans, but not really the Dead. The Allmans had a definite country influence, particularly in Dickey Betts’ songs (Ramblin’ Man, Jessica), but the material that made their name was primarily blues-based, with some jazz influence in places. The Dead played some of the same kinds of songs, but they did a lot more trippy stuff and never struck me as Southern-sounding. They were from San Francisco anyway.

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I vote hate them too. And having been in college in the early 90s and since my sister went through a Deadhead phase, I feel I have heard enough to have an honest opinion. I just never got the point, and the endless noodling offended my garage rock soul. And it is hard to say who pissed me off more, the neo-hippies or the backwards baseball cap wearing frat boys who made up the bulk of their audience.

Now that I am a bit older and less vitriolic, I will admit that there are a few decent songs on American Beauty and Workingman’s Dead - but they work because they are fairly tight, clocking in at five minutes or less. The extended jam versions make me insane.

Like others here, I do put the Allman Brothers in a different league, because while they often went on a long time, it just seemed to my ear that Duane, Gregg and Dickey had something creative to say, while Jerry and Bob Weir just seemed to hammer away at the same riff to within an inch of its life. Dave Mathews and Phish never did anything for me either.