Jewish anti-semites

Have there ever been any Jews who have been anti-semetic, meaning spoken out critically, or taken actions against the Jewish people as a whole?

I know a girl who adamantly(I just figured that one out, I as four when he was still on Mtv) refuses to go synagogue, despite the wishes of her parents. I believe she said it “sucked” and that it was “a waste of f*cking time”. There’s one. :slight_smile:

It would be a little masochistic to take action against a group as a whole when you’re a member of the group wouldn’t it?

Of course if you read your Bible there were many prophets who spoke out against the terrible sinful ways of the Israelites/Jews as a group, not least of whom was a bloke called Jesus of Nazareth.

Is that what you were looking for or were you more interested in the Sect of Haymen?

[Elder Garth]Stupid assholes! Moses ain’t gonna teach them anything! Do not fear, Haymen! This night shall be yours! And the Anti-Semetic Jews will once again rule the earth![/Elder Garth] (Southpark joke)

In David Shermer’s book, Why People Believe Weird Things, there is a chapter on Holocaust deniers, and he does discuss one Jewish man who is a denier. I don’t have the book with me, but if nobody beats me to it, I’ll look it up when I get home.

There was/is great strength of feeling (amongst Jews) around the issue of Zionisim, which is not quite the same thing as the OP…

Then again, some people feel that to be anti-Israel is to be anti-Jewish…

Then again, as a goyim I really don’t know what I am talking about…

Gp

[teacher hat ON] One person is a goy. More than one are goyim. [teacher hat off, revealing the yarmalka]

I used to work for an old (upper 70’s) man who ran a business he inherited from his father. The man was Jewish, not observant, but for some reason he despised me. He knew I had to leave early on Fridays in the winter (for Shabbos, the Sabbath), and he would make nasty comments all the time - even though he knew very well that I made up the time earlier in the week.

He also made comments and remarks when I would take off time for the holidays.

Dagnabit - Five years working in a Jewish school and I still haven’t learned how to refer to myself!!!

I thought goy was slang/colloquial… Oy vey!!

Gp

pkbites:

Absolutely. Karl Marx was Jewish but virulently anti-Semitic. Many of the instigators of Medieval pogroms, blood-libels and Talmud-burnings were Jews who converted to Catholicism, although names escape me at this moment.

Goy and goyim can be slang, and they are not always used in the nicest way. I usually feel uncomfortable when people use them; in fact, the little KVS’s are banned from using them unless said usage directly relates to something learned in school.

I would add to this list Vladimir Zhirinovsky, who has recently admitted Jewish roots:

http://www.jpost.com/Editions/2001/07/19/LatestNews/LatestNews.30767.html

Also, you could argueably put Noam Chomsky in that group.

If your definition of anti-Semitism includes only foaming-at-the-mouth, neo-Hitlerites, who view the Jewish race as an evil to be exterminated… then there are only a handful of Jewish anti-Semites. The most famous example is chess champion Bobby Fischer, who’s actually been affiliated with the American Nazi Party.

Such Jewish anti-Semites are extremely rare, and can be safely dismissed as lunatics. Beyond that, well, deciding what constitutes bigotry CAN be tricky. Sure, sometimes the bigots are very cooperative and make it easy for us, but not always.

A Klansman who declares that blacks are a subhuman “mud race” is obviously a contemptible racist. But what about a sociologist who observes patterns of behavior in the black community that he finds disturbing- is HE automatically a racist?

A redneck fundamentalist who screams that Catholics are the whores of Babylon, and that the Pope is the antichrist is just a bigoted ignoramus. But what of the secular liberal who resents the Catholic Church’s attempts to sway public policy, or a Jew who hates the Church for its past persecutions of his people? Those people are certainly “Anti-Catholic,” but they’re more than mere bigots. They’re people with rational reasons to hate the Catholic Church- even though they may have no animosity toward individual Catholics.

Now, what about a person who was raised in a strict Catholic household, but grew up, rebelled, and now hates the Church and all it stands for. Would anyone consider him or her “an anti-Catholic Catholic” or an oddity? No! We call such people “ex-Catholics”!

But nobody is ever considered an “ex-Jew,” is he?

MANY people from MANY cultures grow up and come to dislike the heritage or religion they were brought up in. In most cases, nobody considers that unusual. A country kid from Mississippi may come to hate the people and values of his community, and move to New York, where he’ll continue to fume at the things he hated in the South. Are such “anti-Southern” Southerners regarded as an oddity? Are they regarded as bigots? No. For better or worse, some people have valid reasons for disliking and rejecting their heritage.

Many Jews, particularly those devoted to Israel, are quick to label Jews who disagree with them as “self-loathing.” Thus, a liberal Jew who is troubled by Israel’s treatment of Palestinian Arabs may well be attacked as “a self-loathing Jew.” This strikes me as utterly unfair. One is not a bigot because he disagrees with the policies of his kinsmen.

I’ve rambled on, but the point is this:

  1. Yes, there are Jews who loathe Judaism and don’t have much use for their heritage.

  2. SOME of them are plain whackos.

  3. SOME of them have good, valid reasons for feeling as they do.

Well, then there’s always Rabbi Elisha ben Abuya.

Noam Chomsky is innocent of the anti-Semitic charge against him, curwin. He criticizes Israeli policy—what’s that got to do with being anti-Semite?

From Merriam Webster

This is something I never really understood. If I ask, “Are there any Arab anti-semites?” That question is easily answered in the afirmative. But jewish anti-semites are a case by case great debate waiting to happen. Why is that? Hebrews and Arabs are all semites.

There is also another category of anti-Semitic Jew dealt with in my favorite (and still relevant) movie Gentleman’s Agreement. Those are Jews who buy into anti-Semetic stereotypes about Jews being vulgar, loud, money-grubbing, etc., or any other offensive stereotypes. It’s a particularly insidious form of bigotry, because these are people who can’t see that if they don’t fit the stereotype, then the stereotype is invalid.

I was once surprised when a very nice Jewish friend of mine held back from participating in a conversation about Judaism in which some non-Jews were discussing Jewish issues on which I knew he could provide insight. Later I asked him why he hadn’t spoken up. He told me that he “didn’t like to advertise” his Judaism. Gave me the creeps.

Spoiler “as advertised” Virgin

I think if I see Semitic misspelled as “Semetic” one more time I will puke.

As for why aren’t Arabs considered under the definition of “anti-Semitism,” your confusion is 'cause you’re taking the meaning literally, having looked it up in a dictionary. In 19th century Germany or whenever the term “anti-Semitic” was coined as a euphemism to avoid saying “anti-Jewish,” no Europeans took any notice of the existence of Arabs back then. Now we live in a more multicultural world, which is why such questions can be asked.

FWIW, I understand the dope who shot the American Neo-Nazi Geo. Lincoln Rockwell was born into a Jewish family, rebelled against it or whatever you’d call it, hooked up with Rockwell’s gang, had a falling out with same, and then shot him.

I suppose there is a difference between being an anti-semite and just being indifferent to or dissatisfied with one’s background.

It’s also worth noting that there are groups of Jewish people who are not anti-semitic, but who are anti-Zionism and speak against the existence of the State of Israel. I think the Satmars are anti-Zionist, no?

Oh, since I’m pretty confident the OP was not asking about “smiting,” I changed the thread title. :slight_smile:

I started to post this morning with that very point, Lance Turbo, but right before I clicked “Submit Reply,” that little nagging voice in the back of my head made me look up “anti-Semitism” in the very same resource:

I’m glad I’m not the only one who wondered, though. :slight_smile: