I’ve met Arpaio a number of time.
He’s completely senile.
I’m just wondering what inanimate object SA is going to choose to fuck that will “prove his point” on THIS one.
Isn’t it nice when problems offer their own solutions?
Waitaminit. Inmates are expected to return their underpants when they are released from jail? And such returned underpants are going to be given to other inmates? Is this standard procedure?
Exactly. It’s anecdotal and utterly worthless. Also, does it occur to you that the case of a business executive getting a DUI is not the same as the case of a poor person stuck in shady business at all? How she might not be the “norm” and that in many cases, it doesn’t matter how scary jail is because life is already hell?
Common sense tells me that if a person is placed into a situation where he is willing to commit a non-middle-class crime (gang-banging, drug addiction, whatever), and absolutely nothing is done to change that person’s situation, they’re liable to go back to doing exactly what they were doing before they went to jail. And common sense is fucking worthless, so how about some evidence? Like the fact that prison systems that rely more on rehabilitation and are “kinder” have way less recidivism than the US system? Or the fact that all that jail/prison does to a person in the US is treat them like an animal and give them a black mark on their resume?
Also, you claim that prison is all about punishment. No, it isn’t. It isn’t in most modern justice systems, and hasn’t been for decades. Most of the world has gotten past the idea that punishment is the end-all, be-all goal of imprisonment, because society is better off that way! The sooner idiots like you figure this out, the better.
And this isn’t prison. It’s jail. A large number of people being held in jail are not being punished for anything or are being punished for small transgressions.
You actually have a point here, that was poorly worded on my part. I shouldn’t have said “hardly anyone takes him seriously,” Obviously people do and they do spend awhile composing multi paragraph posts to refute your posts. That was the very thing I was complaining about! What I should have said was “hardly anyone agrees with him.” No one is going to be persuaded by your stubborn repetition of the same points, your dismissal of contrary cites, your dismissal of contrary facts as opinions, and your assertion of your own opinions as facts. Similarly, you will never, ever admit you are wrong about anything.
You spent a lot of time defending a child molester and his enablers, and now you are defending a sadistic sociopath. I have a hard time believing you aren’t just trolling.
I’m Hispanic, and I saw nothing in the recent Arizona law that caused me to believe Hispanics were unfairly targeted. Some aspects of the law intruded on federal authority and were thus overturned; no parts of the law were racist in nature.
I believe a more accurate way to put it would be that hardly anyone who posts agrees with me. 
Clearly my opponents are not going to be persuaded by my dismissal of their erroneous cites, nor by my pointing out that their alleged facts are really just their opinions.
And I’ve admitted it when I’ve been shown to have been wrong around here more often than anyone else I can think of, save perhaps Bricker. That’s not to say it happens often but it does happen when appropriate, and that fact shows you are wrong yet again when you claim I will “never, ever” admit I am wrong.
That, in itself, should tell you something.
Even assuming that that were true, your refusal to admit that you were wrong about Sandusky would pretty much have killed your stand-up-guy rep.
As usual, the problem is on who proposed the laws and who enforces the laws, clearly they had too many connections with racists.
Point being that one has to stop swallowing the propaganda that claims that it is raining when in reality they are peeing on us.
…Yes, and there-
Oh god dammit beat me to it. -.-
Starkers is the Universal Thanksgiving Uncle, the obnoxious twit who delights in asserting that his “common sense” trumps your science and book-learnin’. And you know that sooner or later, somebody in the family will send him to the hospital with a carving fork stuck in his ribcage, the only questions are who, and when.
It occurs to me that no matter where the jail or prison is located there is no shortage of prisoners seeking release, so the presumption must be that they prefer life in the hell they allegedly came from. Still, common sense and normal human response to stimuli would dictate that an inmate would be more likely to try to avoid returning to a jail or prison where gross but adequately nutritious food is served, where days and nights are spent in tents in desert heat, where prisoners wear pink underwear, their cable television is limited to the Disney channel and music to Frank Sinatra, than they would be to try to avoid returning to a jail or prison where they have access to weightlifting equipment, pornography, cafeteria-like food, and while away their days in common areas playing cards and watching whatever the consensus is among channels on their federally mandated cable television service.
Exactly. I made this very point with regard to comparisons to that isolated island of penal civilitude, Norway.
Which prison systems would those be? The only one I know of being touted this way is the one is Norway where people are permitted to kill 175 people and serve only twenty years…oh, and with the possibility of an extra five if they’re…dangerous. :rolleyes:
But like you said just above, if someone comes from a crime-ridden background and nothing is done to change that person’s situation, they’re liable (and I’d say not only liable but practically guaranteed) to go back to doing exactly what they were doing before they went to jail.
Trouble is, there’s nothing that can be done in jail or prison to significantly change that person’s situation. You can house him in a hotel or resort setting, clothe him in fresh slacks and a sweater each day, smile and call him sir and ask what he’d prefer for dinner that evening, and when it’s all said and done, he’s going right back to the same neighborhood and the same people and the same social dynamics he came from. And unless he’s willing to move to a completely different area away from everyone he’s known and associated with, including most probably much of his family, he won’t realize any change whatsoever in his “situation.”
You guys love you some hyperbole, don’t you? Criminals get locked up all over the world and they have been for centuries. It’s considered more humane than inflicting physical punishment, which I happen to think would be both more effective and efficient in terms of recidivism and not taking huge chunks of a person’s life away from them and their families.
But I digress. Locking up people who break the law is hardly treating them like animals. They get books, television, exercise, porn apparently in some facilities, conjugal visits in some facilities, card playing and chess, and the knowledge that liberal judges, corrections officials and parole boards are working hard as they can to get them released as soon as possible no matter what their crime, sentence or length of rap sheet.
I do?
Pretty sure I said the opposite in this very thread. I don’t have that many posts here so far, so perhaps you could arse yourself to learn what it is I did say.
Haven’t really seen much evidence of society being better off as a result of anything prisons have done, myself.
What I do see is lots of people on the street in their late twenties and early thirties with rap sheets a mile long for multiple drug and violent crime convictions, up to and including manslaughter and Murder 2 convictions, roaming around robbing, raping and killing people who would have been much better off if these people hadn’t received the enlightened largess of liberals who paradoxically think that keeping criminals locked up is inhumane and damaging to society, when the true inhumanity is visited upon the families and loved ones of the victims these people injure or kill, and the damage to society is that we all have to live with the knowledge that vicious criminals are being turned loose time and again to prey upon us by liberal do-gooders who care not in the slightest for the victims they create through their wrongheaded attempts to rehabilitate the unrehabilitatable.
No, u.
Seriously.
You’ve obviously forgotten that I was right about everything regarding Sandusky. I performed quite a noisy victory dance. I’m surprised you missed it.
Still, it doesn’t surprise me you can’t keep things straight in regard to that thread. Ann Hedonia and Larry Borgia can’t either.
If you have any science or book-learnin’ that shows more benefit to society than harm as a result of the revolving door prison system we’ve developed in this country the last fifty years I’d be most happy to take a look at it.
I expect to be waiting a while.
And don’t forget you’re older than me, uncle luce.
Just sayin’.
While you are waiting, consider the fact that 99% of all those sent to prison will one day be released. Now, if you make prison life as grievous as possible, imposing conditions just this side of what the law allows, for no other reason than to inflict discomfort, do you imagine that is going to result in a person disposed to re-integrating with the society that approved of such conditions, or might he carry a bit of a chip on his shoulder?
Just sayin’.
That’s easy: A Tortilla Roll 
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Yes. Which does not mean they will suddenly turn from a life of crime to some other life which they probably don’t understand how to lead in the first place. Especially if they are offered nothing in terms of rehabilitation and are treated like less than human. Especially when the only thing the prison teaches them is cruelty. It’s common sense to believe that they’d less like to return there, but more often than not, they are stuck in situations in their lives that will lead them back, and if you do nothing to change that, it does not matter how shitty the jail is. Meanwhile, jails which are explicitly more shitty may in fact lead to people having grudges against society. Ever think of that?
Let’s be clear on how the penal systems in civilized european countries work. Brevik is, for all intents and purposes, gone for life. He will never leave prison. They cannot sentence him to more than 21 years, but if he is considered still dangerous, they can keep on adding 5 year periods until his is considered no longer dangerous (i.e. he’s dead or at least ridiculously old). And guess what: with his statement in trial “I would do it again if I had the chance”, there’s no way in hell he’s getting out of that. So take that 21 years crap and stuff it; Brevik is not going to leave prison outside of a coffin.
Yes. Which is exactly why the norwegian system works so damn well - it doesn’t focus on punitive measures and instead focuses on the question of “how can we get these people to act like civilized human beings once they leave here?”.
Yeah, see, that’s what just isn’t true. In norway, they offer things like job training, education, and the like - while in prison. Hell, Varg Vikernes, infamous frontman of Burzum, was able to record an album while in prison for the murder of a former bandmate. (It was a pretty fucking brutal album, I feel is worth mentioning.) There are things you can do. Hell, even the psychological effects of not being caged in with other criminals in a hostile environment can help. And the fact is, the statistics support it. Whether or not you will admit it, a focus on rehabilitation works.
Meanwhile, Arpaio’s system? The “scare them so bad they don’t get put back into jail” system? It doesn’t. It fails resoundingly at making any sort of positive impact. All it does is heap unnecessary additional punishment on prisoners, a decent portion of whom are there waiting for trials and hearings and haven’t been convicted of anything, let alone anything serious.
You think. Well, good news: we’re not about to abridge human rights to test that, although I suppose you could take the Maricopa County prison as exhibit A as to why that doesn’t work.
Hey guys, why didn’t anyone warn me that I was dealing with one of those people?