Jon Stewart on Crossfire

Well, that would be fine if they didn’t pretend that they were something more than what they are. They claim that they are holding people’s feet to the fire when they are in fact just amplifying the usual white noise between partisans.

Of course they’re just doing the job their paid to do by CNN. But that doesn’t mean they’re above having someone point out that the king has no clothes, so to speak.

If there was a viable outlet for real, hard-hitting debate, this whole issue would be moot. But to my knowledge, there’s not. Or if there is, the people in power are avoiding it wisely, knowing they can get their talking points out more easily on one of these black VS white, pissing contest shows.

To my eye, Jon was pleading for the CNN watching public to want for more. As long as the public accepts theater as news, the market will provide.

This isn’t Comedy Central’s job. Comedy Central’s job is to provide comedy. Don’t ask why the court jester isn’t doing the king’s job. Ask why the king isn’t doing the king’s job. The jester is just the messenger.

They defined themselves as A debate show, and it is one. Just because Bush and Kerry happen to be very partisan doesn’t mean they didn’t have a debate. It isn’t a burn-everyone news debate, however. Stewart may want Carlson and Begala to be like Michael Moore and slaughter all of their political guests, but Crossfire doesn’t have the luxery of getting Tom Cruise on the show or whatnot when politicians decide they don’t want to be on the show.

Carlson had a good point, who the Hell is Stewart for saying they should have asked more probing questions when he didn’t when he had a chance. Stewart hid behind the whole “Oh, it’s an entertainment comedy show”, but he knows the impact of his show. He knows that he’s basically considered one of the media. If Crossfire has ‘failed’ on their obligation, so has Stewart.

I haven’t seen Crossfire before… Can someone please tell me why you guys dislike the show and the hosts so much? Surely it’s not because they don’t hold proper debates??

I’m sorry, that was me. :smack:

IMHO: Listen to what Stewart says.

His show makes fun of the absurdity of the situation. His show is successful because the situation is absurd. But the situation being absurd does not help America.

Crossfire, in his opinion and in mine, only contributes to the absurdity. You have a guy from the left and a guy from the right lapping up and spewing out the bullshit fed directly to them from their respective parties. Instead of challenging the shit talking points that each party spews (John Kerry as the “most liberal senator” is one fine example, there are hundreds of others on each side of the aisle), they just look to yell it out louder. Instead of discussing and dissecting the issues, the Crossfire and Hardball guys reduce everything to sound bites and talking points. There is absolutely no substantive debate to the actual issues forwarded by these shows. Stewart came on and tried to alert them to that.

This is contributing to a perceived decline of democracy in this country. The presidential debates were largely seen as “boring” and John Kerry was criticized as throwing too much facts and data around. In a damn policy debate. Because the average viewer’s mind is blunted to the point where a 2 minute answer seems like it drones on and on because everything else is a 15 second sound bite.

Stewart on The Daily Show has taken issues with the talking points, and when a particularly juicy one comes along, he demolishes it. He is not afraid to go after partisan mouthpieces who spew those data as well. But this is a newly adopted role for him, and he is not a trained journalist, nor a trained political scientist, nor an economist, nor a media analyist. Like me and I’m sure many of you, he and his writers read a few blogs and read a few newspapers and op-eds every day. We go to the primary sources when inconsistencies arrive. And we make up our minds. The cable news shows have forgotten how to do this. Their experts and hosts are all partisan shills. So the same 10 talking points are repeated every day and left unanalyzed. And Stewart, consistently, is the only guy on TV trashing this bullshit. So he comes on Crossfire to ask the real journalists to take over this role or at least help out a bit.

I think that Stewart gave Kerry a pretty rotten interview, but I think that he is right to claim that he is just a fake news show. Again, not a trained journalist here. Watching Stewart, he interviews three types of people well:

  1. Other comedians. An example is Will Ferrell when he was promoting Anchorman. It was a hilarious interview in which they just played off of each other.
  2. People who are at ease, don’t feel they need to pander, and he doesn’t need to impress. An example is Bill O’Reilly from last week, which was a great back-and-forth.
  3. Partisan shills who present some bullshit line, which he uses to rub their nose in it. An example is Henry Bonilla, a Congressman from Texas who came in unprepared and parroting the “most liberal senator” line. Stewart made him look foolish. Again, this is a new role for Stewart and the reason he gets mad props here and everywhere else is because he is the only person on TV doing this. Not the “news debate” shows, not the national news, not anybody on TV. Which was his point to Begala and Carlson.

Kerry was in a different class, and provides a tough interview. You see the same thing with plenty of other of comedy hosts (Leno, Letterman run into this kind of guest far more often). Stewart was intimidated, Kerry was intimidated, Kerry is not naturally funny, and Stewart has like 10 minutes of interview time. Stewart has done find with people in the #2 spot like John McCain and John Edwards (during the primaries, before he announced his candidacy for president, which he eventually did on TDS). Kerry wasn’t in there; he was making his only TV appearance in a while and Stewart was trying to be nice and Kerry was trying too hard. So I understand it, even though I wish he had done better.

Stewart’s obligation is to be funny, and he satisfies it.

Funny, smart, and sexy… Am I the only one who envies his wife?

Do you actually consider Tucker Carlson and Paul Begala to be ‘real’ journalists? On Crossfire the only person who comes close to be a real journalist is Novak, but he’s much more of an opinion editorialist-like writer. If Stewart wanted to complain about journalists not doing their jobs, he should have trashed a show where real journalist are one (like The Capital Report… or whatever it is called).

Furthermore, Carlson and Begala may have in the PAST been journalists, but they aren’t anymore. They don’t write for any papers in a regular fashion, AFAIK. Sometimes CNN calls them to be political analysts, but once again for the right and left. When their JOB is to be shills for their side, how do you critisize them for doing it? After all, Carlson holds many views different from the President (look at his interview on Bill Maher’s HBO show), but he won’t say them on Crossfire.

But I’m not married … dang, I thought you were talkin’ about ME. :smiley:

That’s precisely what Stewart is so mad about! It’s obscene that so many people are getting their news from him! That’s not his job. That’s not what he does, that’s not what he claims he does, and that’s not what he wants to do. But, as edwino has so eloquently stated, he’s been forced into this role by the absolute failure of legitimate news sources to do this themselves, and he has every right to be outraged at the mainstream news for putting him into this position. The only wonder is that everyone else isn’t outraged, too.

Okay, but if you want this to be a flirt thread I’m pretty sure a constitutional amendment against it will be drafted.

So… how you 'doin?

:smiley:

I think Stewart answered that when he said “we need help from the media and they’re hurting us.”

Come on! Tucker was criticizing Stewart for asking Kerry “How’re you holding up?” He might as well have criticized him for saying “It’s good to have you on the show.” In fact, I could totally see that. Tucker: “‘It’s good to have you on the show’? Could you possibly kiss his ass any more?” :rolleyes:

Anyway, was Jon Stewart a jerk for going on their show and insulting them? Yeah, he was a jerk to couple of a-holes who really deserved it. If they weren’t a couple of creeps (particularly Tucker Carlson, I haven’t really seen the other guy much) then their response would be “OK, Jon, so what do you think we should be doing?” Then, after he is able to complete a sentence or two, they could go ahead and respond. Instead, what did they do? Interrupt him, talk over him, insult him, and whine about how they don’t like being lectured.

Again, I don’t think this was so much Jon Stewart expecting these guys to turn their format around on his insistence. This seemed more like his way of reminding an audience, who may not be familiar with his show, that they should want for more than they are passively accepting as debate and news.

Yup. I bet Walter Cronkite was thrilled to see someone with the balls to say it.

With the current state of ‘journalism’ on television, I imagine Edward R. Murrow whirls around so fast in his grave he could be used to drill for oil.

Do you really believe this? The reason why a lot of people get their news from the Daily Show is because its FUNNY! Why do you think when Fox News came out it started doing great in the ratings? Because people don’t want the old boring news. They want entertainment with their news. They want slanted, controversial, yelling, screaming news. Or aside from that, they want funny news.

You think the national media suddeny started to ask probing questions people would tune in? God no! They’ll still watch the Daily Show because it makes them laugh. All the people I know that watch it do so because its fun and hilarious, not because Stewart asks the probing questions. Frankly, if the networks start being more probing, I don’t foresee many people going around quoting Tom Brokaw.

I should add, it takes some balls to go on a show and tell them it sucks. Especially when sitting before a live audience who, one would imagine, thinks otherwise.

And it’s just plain amazing that he can seemingly win over such an audience with his eloquence and wit.

I finally found a link that worked and waited a few hours to download it with my damn dial-up connection.

I don’t understand the debate going on here about the Daily Show, etc. It’s beside the point. What made this so amazing is that no one who has access to the media ever steps outside of the theater and calls them on their bullshit. It was surreal. And inspirational. Maybe if we all started calling them out that have to respond and do their jobs. Yes, the public wants to be entertained, and shows like Jon Stewart’s entertain us. But we also want to be informed, and who’s doing that?

Wasn’t sure if he was married until now. :frowning:

Married with children, mentioned most recently when Gwenyth Paltrow was on and Billy Bob Thornton was on a few days later. Both actors had daughters recently and Stewart was seeing if his new son could ‘bone’(Stewart’s term) their daughters when he grew up.

I wish my parents had pimped for me on national television when I was a baby.