Sorry, but I don’t think I should. The doc says confidential at the end of every page.
Today, I am once again training the new guy. From the tone of his grunts and “hmms” and the expressions on his face I think he’s thinking, "what have I gotten myself into. 
And he just now had to come to me to have me reset his email password. :rolleyes:
And if he says “Hey thanks dude!” one more freakin’ time I may scream.
I haven’t heard back about the tests. I’m not sure if that means anything or not. I’m itching to email them and ask when we can setup a live interview but I guess that’s a bad idea.
Question is why are they TRAINING someone else…doesn’t a layoff mean they’re getting rid of the position? Are they having people do multiple jobs or something? 'cause…yeah. I know, technically, that most employers don’t need a reason to tell you ‘Pack your stuff and go home, don’t need you any more’ and hire someone else the same day, but an actual layoff usually has business implications.
And good luck, I can’t imagine you’ll be out of work long, and appendages are crossed for you!
Oh, and here’s a little interview-related giggle for you 
http://www.virtualshackles.com/ (Don’t worry about the domain name, it’s a comic )
That’s what I don’t understand. I’ve been told that it’s not me, they just want to “go in another direction”. That, of course is a meaningless buzz phrase.
And while I was typing this, the new guy walked in and asked if we had any blank DVD disks, which I was able to immediately pull out of a drawer. He’s been obviously happy about how I have things organized, it will make his job easier. Things weren’t organized when I took this job. There was no formal tracking of the computer inventory like there is now. I guess in the end I did all of that to make this other person’s job easier while I collect unemployment.
The guy is Ned Flanders cheery. I’m expecting a “diddly” any moment. At least he didn’t say “hey, thanks dude” this time.
I’m thinking now that this may be age discrimination, or possibly disability discrimination. My last day is Friday, so maybe I’ll head to the EEOC next Monday.
A little while back, one of the employees in our office had a baby and took some maternity time, then came back to work part time. A while after that, she was let go. I don’t know the details, just that she wasn’t given notice or anything and it wasn’t due to cutbacks. They just told her one day and she was gone.The rumor was that it was because of job performance, but I can’t swear to truth of that rumor.
Some time later, she was back! She’s not working in the corporate office, but at a nearby location. It all seemed strange to me. I’m wondering now if she brought some kind of maternity discrimination suit.
I can’t say too much, but being the IT guy I was the guy who had to copy and archive a bunch of emails due to some sort of employment lawsuit involving the company in another part of the country. So I know that there’s a history of at least one (justified or not, I can’t say) and possibly two, cases with this company.
So maybe this is more of the same. The timing seems almost designed so as to avoid a discrimination charge. If the one man consulting firm that I worked for (which has a family connection to the company) had laid me off there could have been a possible case against him. If I had submitted an application to the actual company there could have been a possible hiring discrimination case. But the way they did it, the company didn’t refuse to hire me, since they had filled the position before I could even apply. And my employer let me go because of lack of work and thus cutbacks; because he lost the contract. So no one’s to blame! They’re home free.
Except… I may have a hiring discrimination suit against them. The corporate HR woman had suggested to me several times in the past that I seek some kind of deal where I would be on the company’s payroll and therefore have benefits. So the thought was there, Plus, even if I never applied for the job (since they filled it before I even knew about it) it seems obvious that they would consider me since I had been doing the job for 2 years and nearly everyone seemed more than pleased with my performance. I’ve been complimented more than once.
And when my boss told me that he was laying me off and that I would be training my replacement, I asked why the company didn’t make me an offer and he replied that “they just wanted to go in a different direction”. Which sort of implied that I was a possible choice, since a “direction” has to be away from something, or in this case, someone. Also, in this context, “different direction” is a meaningless buzz phrase that sounds like a way to avoid answering the question.
Am I off base here? I don’t know, but I may check out the EEOC anyway.
I am not a employment lawyer, but unfortunately I don’t think you have a case here…
You didn’t have an employment agreement or relationship with the company, rather they had a contractual agreement with the IT consulting company. What that contract said, we don’t know - but it is likely that your one-person IT consulting employer wanted to protect himself from them dropping their contract with him, and hiring you directly, and wrote that provision into the contract - unless you can find out what was in the contract, you are at a disadvantage and it would be hard for anyone to advise you.
The company you worked at may have been in a difficult position, because they contractually couldn’t hire you away from the IT Consulting firm. Perhaps they were hoping you would quit the IT Consulting company in which case they would be legally OK, but as of now, the IT Consulting company is still your employer.
In terms of hiring discrimination, assuming a standard consulting contract, they can’t hire you if you are working for someone else, and it would look very fishy if they ended the IT Consulting contract, just to pick you up directly.
I don’t know how big the company you worked for is, but it’s not uncommon for companies to have to dig up evidence during a discovery phase for issues with merit or not.
Regarding age discrimination, are you 40 or above? That’s where the protected class starts. Would the corporate HR woman be privy to the details of the contract between you and your IT consulting company?
You can certainly consult an attorney - but if I were you I wouldn’t let this distract from your focus of getting a new job.
Of course I’m 40 or above, or I wouldn’t be considering this possibility. Without going into details there’s also the possibility of disability discrimination. I have no idea if the HR woman is privy to all of the details of my contract with the consulting company, but of course I have a copy.
In the whole time I was there I received 0 performance complaints, and when I was told I was being laid off, I was told specifically “it wasn’t you”. I was told that they wanted to go with a different firm that wanted to place their own person. When I asked “why didn’t company make me an offer” I was told first that they wanted somebody who could do some traveling. When I stated that I could do that I was told that they just wanted to go in a “different direction”.
While training this person I asked what consulting firm he was with and he said there was no firm he was an employee of the corporation. At one point, thinking that perhaps I could get some consulting work because nobody can learn all of it in two weeks, I asked the new guy if he was sure he was going to have all the information he needed and he said that he could get what he needed from my former employer. When I asked how long that former employer was available to him for questions he said “basically, as long as I need him”.
So why was I told that the corporation was going with a new firm, and how could my former employer be available to him as needed if the contract had ended? And why was I given changing, bullshit, evasive answers when I asked why the corporation didn’t make me an offer?
And why was I training someone else to perform the same functions that I had previously performed, keeping in mind that I received praise from individuals I supported, and no complaints from either the individuals I supported nor anyone in management, nor the man I worked for, who in fact gave me a substantial raise at one point during my employment with him?
I should add that I’m over 50 which is the actual cutoff in federal law.
I’ve worked in this field for decades, both as a consultant and as a direct employee, and I know when something smells fishy. I’m getting bullshit answers and conflicting information. I’ve personally received praise from some of the people I support and I’ve never received any warnings about my performance, and in fact was given a substantial raise at one point.
Immediate coworkers in the corporate office are aghast at this. That’s not a reaction that occurs when someone who is non-productive and hard to work with is terminated. When that happens people give polite sympathy, not whispered conversations about how it doesn’t make sense.
Some others, both former employees and people in other locations have told me that what I’m experiencing seems to be typical behavior for this company and have even suggested that they have had the impression of replacements for age or gender.
I’ll also add that, other than one oriental woman, corporate is one of the whitest places I’ve ever worked. Admittedly that’s not true about other offices, but corporate is very sensitive about appearances. That’s not directly relevant to me since I’m white, but it may show a mindset.
OK, all good information. You have a copy of your contract. Does it include (or can you get) the overarching master agreement or terms and conditions between the IT consulting company and the company you work for? Maybe you can get the master agreement from corporate HR or the IT consulting company guy if you don’t have it? Usually this document requires separate signatures, and has the details of when payment is due, talks about legal liability, etc.
Is there anything in that document that talks about the company needing to wait X days before they hire you, or needing to pay a fee of X to the IT consulting firm if they hire you?
For what it’s worth I’ve been on the other side - hiring consultants, and then deciding that the strategy long-term should be to have our own employees in the positions. I’ve wanted to hire the consultants, but contractually my hands were tied.
If the contracts do have deterrents to hiring away the employees of the consulting company, the company can say that they would undergo financial and/or legal hardship if they hired you over someone else, or that there wouldn’t be a transition period and they would have no IT support for a period of time.
It sounds like the IT consulting company owner made an agreement to provide some support to facilitate a transition, either for money or in the interest of good will. That is fairly common.
You could be absolutely right that there is something fishy going on. Unfortunately the fact that they aren’t your employer complicates things if you weren’t eligible to be interviewed.
Okay, it seems now that there was a little more to this than I realized and none of it reflects on me or my job performance. The CFO stuck his head in my office today and said that he wants to talk with me tomorrow and make sure that I’m happy (hopefully that means $$$). Also, there’s a possibility that more IT manpower will be needed in the near future and if so I would be at or near the top of the list.
The company that sent me the programming tests liked my responses and I have a second interview with them tomorrow. So maybe I can walk into a new job with severance in the bank.
And maybe I can make a move on that cutie who’s been making eyes at me for months and I’ve avoided because of the whole “don’t date in the office” thing.
Do you like coding? If so (and you’re good at what you do), I’d recommend entering the codejam competition (created by Google), even better if you have some free time when it starts.
It might yield surprising (if long-term) results.
Wow that is all awesome! Maybe the CFO wants to make sure no bridges are burned so that the door is open in the future…
Per the above I’m not clear where you think you have a case. You indicated you are a contracted hire working at this on site company as the agent of another company/contractor providing your services to the on site company. You are not a employee of the on site company where you work. You are effectively (contractually) a temp.
Starting an EEOC fuss doesn’t seem like the best exit strategy is you are looking to get past this and into another job. Being 50 and a few years the behind the curve on current skill sets is enough of a challenge in your field, being litigious in addition does not seem like the best plan to advance.
I’m not clear about it either. I’ve just been very upset and was basically just ranting. I don’t have a case and I don’t think I ever really believed that I did or ever really wanted to pursue it.
It turns out that they knew months ago that they were going to terminate the contract, and my employer also knew it but never told me. Here in the office they assumed that I knew. They had been recruiting for someone for months. They wanted someone who could do both what my boss did for them, software, and what they saw me doing around the office everyday; setting up and fixing computers, customer support, ect.
What they apparently didn’t realize was that I have a degree in computer science and an extensive software background and was in this job because it was what I could find in the bad economy at the time, and it paid above average for this type of work.
If I had known what was going on, I would have applied for the position. They may or may not have hired me, but it would have been nice to have the chance.
The federal Age Discrimination in Employment Act kicks in at 40.
So I had my second phone interview. I can never tell if those things go well or not, but it didn’t go totally south. They said that they would be speaking to the hiring manager. The HR person here said that’s a good sign since you don’t talk to a hiring manager unless you’re intending to hire. Makes sense to me. I’ll have to wait and see and keep looking in the meanwhile.
Great news - hope you can move into the new job very soon, while still banking the severance pay!
Ugh. Did I actually say “keep looking in the meanwhile”? :smack: Obviously I meant to say “meantime”.
Haven’t heard anything more from them, but I suppose I shouldn’t worry after just 1 business day.