Lawn Care: Organic Vs. Chem Lawn

What are the advantages (and disadvantages) of each? Does one, in fact, have merits that make it a far superior choice over the other? I need to put my house up for sale in the next several months (I’ve only been in it for about 6-7 months). I want the lawn to look as good as possible and I am thinking of hiring a service to get the results that I want. A nice lawn is an important factor in the “curb appeal” factor of desirability; at least it was with me. My lawn is looking okay. Not great, but okay. There are houses in the area with better lawns and others with worse.

The two main factors that I want to look at- are:

  1. Differences in cost? A Chem-Lawn flyer on my door mentioned a cost of $39 (per treatment, IIRC). Is an organic lawn service going to be similar in costs?

  2. Differences in results? Are results going to be similar using ‘environmentally friendly’ techniques as using ‘environmentally unfriendly’ methods?

I have seen statements online that claim that organic fertilizers will condition the soil, where chemical fertilizers are only used by the plant and there are no long-term benefits to the soil.

If all things are equal, (cost and results) I would go with organic because I have a dog and Austin seems to be more environmentally sensitive than other places that I have lived in.

Also, what makes organic fertilizer better in the eyes of an environmentalist? I just bought some fish fertilizer- that is plant food made from pureed fish. I can’t imagine that idea sits well with many environmentalists.

I hope this is okay in GQ, I had pondered putting this in both GD and IMHO as well.

Bump.

  1. Differences in results? Are results going to be similar using ‘environmentally friendly’ techniques as using ‘environmentally unfriendly’ methods?*

Chemical fertilizers generally give quicker results. Organics take a while longer, but tend to not leach away as fast.
I have seen statements online that claim that organic fertilizers will condition the soil, where chemical fertilizers are only used by the plant and there are no long-term benefits to the soil.
Organics don’t kill soil organisms (unless concentrated). They tend to handle the organics easier because the aren’t pure forms of ammonia or urea (common fertilizer ingredients). Chemical fertilizers are in fact salts, and they can make soil alkaline enough that it kills beneficial organisms (in theory). Organics tend to be much more what the organisms would get if they were living in a ncie forest, they’d get nutrients that don’t actu quick and aren’t so alkaline.

The other problem with chemical ferts is they can build up in the soil and actually damage your plants. This is why too much chemical fert can actuall burn plant roots. You’d rarely get that problem with an organic fert (except say steer manuer which has high salts due to the salt licks steers use. Steer manuer can actually cause similar problems as regular chemical ferts).

If all things are equal, (cost and results) I would go with organic because I have a dog and Austin seems to be more environmentally sensitive than other places that I have lived in.

Organics really can’t hurt. WHy not try it if you’re environmentally inclined?

*Also, what makes organic fertilizer better in the eyes of an environmentalist? I just bought some fish fertilizer- that is plant food made from pureed fish. I can’t imagine that idea sits well with many environmentalists.
*

Well, being organic it tends to help build the soil profile. Chemical ferts add nothing to the soil profile (a good compost will help build topsoil in places where it’s been removed via construction). There’s a method of mulching that calls for adding mulch on top of the old mulch each year, adding organics in, and helping to create soil. This is called no till cultivation, and from people i know who’ve done it, they’ve actually been able to get soils that are so full of clay they’re almost bricklike into a more friable state.

I’ve noticed with mulch that i have thriving soil, digging around in it i’ve found extensive mats of fungal microrhiza (the “roots”) which indicate healthy soil (fungi often “help” plants out with their microrhiza, helping to provide additional food and mosture). I would never have had this had i never laid mulch and only used chemical fertilizers.

…but I’ll elaborate.

Chem ferts do not enrich the soil with organic matter, and as noted, this does not promote good microbiotic activity. Organics add organic matter and create a hotbed of organic activity, which is really what lawn care is all about: soil care. This is why so many gardeners cram ‘compost’ down your throat. Compost is like the black gold of organic activity.

Rich organic soils work to feed the lawn consistently. This promotes consistent color, consistent defense against disease/fungus, & consistent defense against drought (organic rich soil maintain moisture). Organic ferts work to prevent thatch, because surge growth is limited, and some organisms actively feed on the thatch (cross growth …thatch is not clippings). Layers of thatch = breeding grounds for disease/fungus and they prevent the water from penetrating the soil.

You can use organics out of a bag: Ringer Rx and Milorganite are two that are found at home centers, but garden supplies have more local stuff: chicken poop and that sort of thing.

Cutting the grass regularly and leaving the clippings (use a mulching blade) is also part of organic care. Clippings return nitrogen, boost microbiotic activity and shade the soil.

I lin chemical valley in NJ where homeowners chase their tales with fungicides, big bags of urea based ferts and I get nothing but questions about my ‘program’. They are stumped. They spend 300-500 per year, I barely break 50-75.

I mow and I’m done, they bag and empty, bag and empty over and over and then they rake anything left. Then they set out for pickup all the clippings! DUH!

If you have any more specific questions to drill this down, just holler. Oh, just fertilize in Fall…and toss in fert in the spring as an after thought.

Get your lawn ‘off the drugs’…get it off those junk fertilizers and you’ll find less issues all around.

Alright, some good responses. Thanks.

First thing first. When I moved in last summer the lawn looked really good, and based on the thing that Chem Lawn left on my door, I think the previous owners were using their service, but I am not sure because I have pulled lots of weeds out of the lawn, both last year and so far this year.

Right now I have three different types of grass growing on my lot. The backyard and front sideyard are Bermuda and they both look good and are low on weeds. My main concern is the front yard, which is mainly Buffalo grass. Buffalo grass is very heat and drought tolerant (a good idea in Texas) however it also seems to spread roots at a slower pace than Bermuda grass, and be more receptive to weeds. The Buffalo grass isn’t as thick as the Bermuda grass, and maybe it isn’t supposed to be, I don’t know and neither do most people I’ve talked to. The third type of grass is a patch of St. Augustine in the middle of the Buffalo. St. Augustine is pretty popular in this area, but I don’t like it. It grows by sending out runners above the soil, and the blades are wide and stiff. Eventually, the St. Augustine will take over the Buffalo grass, and if it gets the chance, the Bermuda grass would take over them both.

Like I said, I want the yard to look good to put the house on the market within three or four months, so I don’t think that I’ll do this myself. I’m going to get a quote from an organic lawn service and see if it is in the same ballpark as Chem Lawn.

Philster, when I move into my new house (I’ll be the first owner) I will take you up on your offer of information.

Just out of curiousity, what do I gain if I top dress the yard?

Top dressing would add organic matter, if it contained some compost. Even basic topsoil should have some organic matter.

You would be talking one baby step towards improving the soil compostion, which is always good.

Nothing dramatic would happen. But that’s the whole point. Drama kills the soil.

If you have a dog, I wouldn’t use chemicals.

I’m actually considering buying a house at this time, and the lawn looks suspiciously green. That’s one of the questions I plan on asking the owners. Because I have a dog, it might somewhat tip my decison in favor of the other house we’re considering. (I’ll have to research it more–how long does that stuff stay in the soil?) People with small children might think along the same lines.

Strictly on an antecdotal basis, I offer the following: some friends of mine treated their lawn for years with chemicals. Both of their dogs developed tumors, and now both have died within three months of each other. Was it the lawn chemicals? I cannot say that for sure. But I’m sure they didn’t help matters.

How long do chems stay: Good News/Bad News

Good news is that in runs off within months. Bad news is that it runs off somewhere to do harm in streams and lakes. So much is water soluable that it get used and runs off quickly.

Pesticides might linger longer, and the longer they were used, the longer they remain.

Generally a season or two should help things.

I’m going to get a consultation from a place called EarthAction Lawn and Landscape. The guy said at this time of year they usually will do aeration and top dressing, but we’ll see what they say. I just hope that they don’t set my Xterra on fire.

Sorry I didn’t see this earlier.

Everything that has already been said is sound advice. And of course, whenever you can use organic over chem you should. My entire lawn is organically sound. However, One thing that has not been mentioned is thatching. I thoroughly thatch my lawn every year, and year after year I have a very healthy lawn. I use a blend of Kentucky Blue Grass and Fescue, I find it makes for a very hearty lawn. I often have people asking if I used sod when I moved in…I answer with a grin and say no…But I love working with my lawn.

Phlosphr, you are showing your northern roots with that post.

Our friends down south couldn’t use bluegrass or fescue.

And didn’t ya know that dethatching is out? Well, not really, but dethatching is something to do with care because it opens the ground up to major league weed germination. Sounds like some southern grasses might be thatch heavy, so maybe they need it if ti hasn’t been done and the lawn is struggling.

Up north, with good lawn practices, an annual aeration should be alll that is needed. It breaks up some thatch as a bonus to loosening compact soils.
“Dethatch when needed” would be my advice. …and in fall…since it’s sressfull to the lawn. Might as well overseed, too, when dethatching.

Yep I’m showing my northern roots. Though not a swamp one, I am a Yankee. I have a power thatch on my tractor and I only do it once a year. Also, I do put extra seed on in the spring…not much…just enough. I like extremely thick grass…:slight_smile:

…me thinks you like thick grass so much that you create an environment in which thatch would rear it’s ugly head. But, no worry for you, 'Mr I gots me own Track-Tor with big ass rake". :smiley:

Since we’re fighting ignorance, anyone reading this thread should know that lawn maintenance -such as aeration, dethatching and seeding - is to be done in the fall as first choice…spring as second choice…but it must be early spring to mid-spring.

Oh, and since you love your lawn so much, put on some sunblock and shades, and do yourself some good. :cool:

…me thinks you like thick grass so much that you create an environment in which thatch would rear it’s ugly head. But, no worry for you, 'Mr I gots me own Track-Tor with big ass rake". :smiley:

Since we’re fighting ignorance, anyone reading this thread should know that lawn maintenance -such as aeration, dethatching and seeding - is to be done in the fall as first choice…spring as second choice…but it must be early spring to mid-spring. If you were given one ferilization per year by the lawn god - yes there are lawn gods - that would be done in fall as well.

Oh, and since you love your lawn so much, put on some sunblock and shades, and do yourself some good. :cool:

personally i don’t like lawns because to me it means work (and i’m talking mowing here).

Anyway most lawns here seem to use Kentucky blue, which handles our cool weather well. But we often see bermuda grass (which takes a kind of elegant look when it grows vertically… fine wispy leafy stems). The worst lawn i’ve dealt with is Kikuyu (Pennisetum clandestinum). It’s coarse, light green, a bit hairy, and rampant as hell in warm weather. It actually can get pretty dense if left unmowed (i’m talking 3 - 4 feet). Mowed it stays tight and matted. It has coarse stolons which get everywhere (i’ve pulled it out from siding and found a 10 foot long stem that was looking for a place to set roots down). It will even grow INTO water (i’ve talked to a woman who says that this grass grows into ponds in Africa where it comes from (It’s a savannah grass)). I’ve even tossed a clump into a bucket of water and 2 months later it was growing fine.

I remember when i removed the kikuyu lawn. The stolons were so packed in (over 30 years worth) that i was getting sod bricks a foot thick (with sand underneath that was still soft, rather than compacted).

I don’t even have a lawn but this thread is pretty interesting.

You guys make chemicals sound pretty bad, so my question is: How do they work?

If they are so bad for the soil, and have a high salt content, how do they produce results? I always thought “salting the earth” was extremely harmful.

Not all salts are the same. And Salting the earth is only bad for plants that cannot handle highly alkaline soil (if you salted the earth around a saltbush, or a mangrove you wouldn’t do much damage, as they have ways of segregating and excreting excess salt). I can tell you that if you put a non-acid fertilizer with azaleas they will pull up their roots and die (or linger and fade at least).

When you add an acid and a base you get a salt. It’s that simple. Ammonium nitrate is the salt of ammonia and nitric acid. Vinegar and baking soda will make sodium acetate.

Most plants cannot use table salt - sodium chloride (actually i don’t think any plant uses it for anything, most have ways of excreting it). However plants can utilize ammonium nitrate because the nitrate gets broken down into nitrogen (and other things), which is what the plant needs for cell growth. That’s how chemical ferts work, they supply nitrogen, which provides quick growth, hence your lawn turns deep green and grows like mad (grass doesn’t need the other two elements, P and K as much as nitrogen since the other two are used more for fruit and flower production)

The reason i don’t prefer pure chemical ferts is they leach right through the soil easily and they can be so concentrated they burn the plant’s roots (and cause cosmetic damage to leaves). They’re not so good because they readily wash through the soil and often end up in groundwater or in watersheds (i should know i live near commercial farms and they have problems with nitrate and nitrite poisoning of groundwater). Organics tend to stay in the soil longer and feed the other organisms, since they aren’t the pure salts of ammonia (which bacteria and fungi don’t make too much use of).

Chemical ferts are bad especially in sandy soil because as i’ve said they wash right through and most of the time before plants can utilize them. Organic ferts tend to stay within the sand grains longer which means they’re a lot more useful for long term growth.

Chemical fetilizers are sold by the same companies that produce fungicides and disease control, which, ironically, you wouldn’t need it you didn’t make your lawn a junkie to the stuff.

Chemical companies are big business, and many have their roots in farming.

Now, to feed everyone on this planet, it is my understanding that you must have chemical fertilizers (nitrogen), because with out it, you would have a food shortage: in other words, without chemical fertilizers, there is “X” amount of natural nitrogen available to grow crops. If there was no way to make nitrogen based fertilizers out of thin air, you couldn’t grow crops and harvest enough food to support cattle, people and other stock.

All chemicals are not bad, when used properly they are an absolute necessity to life on this planet. Removing pesticides from some farming could result in disease riddled crops, low yields or even famine.

So, pesticides and nitrogen fertilizers are necessary, and when controlled and weighed against starvation they are important components in feeding everyone.

However, when the putz down the street uses a 5-step fertilizer program every year, pumps pesticides and fungicides in to his lawn, you have to realize it’s not exactly being ‘managed’. Your neghbor is dropping chems on the cement and probably not overly concerned with runoff from that, let alone from soil.

I’m not a ‘greenie’. I’m realistic. We must use the chems to support the crops that feed us directly or indirectly. We must manage them and always look for best practices and least damaging stuff.

But do homeowners really need to contribute to the damage of my local watershed? Absolutely not.

Exactly. I am not against the use of chemical fertilizers. I myself use them when my plants need a quick pick-me-up. However i use them judiciously and follow the directions. I can’t tell you how many times i’ve seen people throw handfulls of the stuff all over the place.

Why use chemical fertilizers when in some instances you can get organics cheap (compost is one way. It requires work, but you recycle clippings, branches, and trimmings and it all goes back to the plants. Best of all once you get it started it’s free).

I actually rarely fertilize. I simply grow things that can tolerate soil conditions. Needing to fertilize all the time is a sign you’re working against nature and your plants. I have not once sprayed for pests either.

First off, a synthetic chemical-based lawn service might be able to “green up” your lawn faster than an organic one, though I’m not certain that buffalograss responds as well to a quick fix as, say, bluegrass.

On the other hand, in the Austin area it might be a good selling point to have a lawn you can point to as organic, assuming it looks fairly good (I’ve lived in Texas, so this is not just speculation on my part).

Ask the organic firms about a relatively fast spruce-up, including replacing the St. Aug. in the yard with buffalograss similar to what you already have.

I’d also think having the buffalograss is a good selling point, since other grasses like St. Augustine are less well adapted to drought, even if they look “neater”.

I’m glad to see other posters here are wary of chemical treatments and their effects on the water supply (and possibly pets).